I stumbled across this video via Dark of All Trades, and it annoyed me. This tradcath weirdo calling himself “PreConciliar Radio” has a question for atheists that he thinks will rock us back on our heels and make us doubt our beliefs, which is rich coming from a baby-faced guy who is concerned with what version of the Catholic Mass he has to listen to on Sunday morning.
That earthshaking question is What is the meaning of life?
Oh no. Are you questioning your beliefs about god now? I know I’m not.
My answer to that question is simple: there is no meaning to life. We just are. We exist, and then we try to rationalize our existence, and everyone comes up with a different explanation because our brains will happily spin their wheels in the absence of anything of substance to grapple with.
Maybe you disagree, and maybe you have the one true meaning of life. That’s fine, go ahead and tell me what it is, but if you could, please also tell me what objective evidence you have to support your proposed purpose. Also tell me what makes this purpose a property of life — is it shared with spiders and clams and sugar gliders and ants? After all, they live, too.
I’m pretty sure the Tridentine Mass isn’t the meaning of life.
42
There’s no meaning of life but people can find various meanings in life, which are individually subjective or collectively intersubjective. As with morality, I think meaning lacks an objectivity.
Right now my meanings somewhat revolve around trying to get fitter (no not in any Darwinian sense) and undo years of sedentary desk and couch sitting.
Every time someone posts here there’s an implicit pursuit of meaning in their own ephemeral life pond, but the universe as a whole has no shits to give. Your meanings will evaporate when you eventually croak. Good talk.
Aw, look, Baby Theist hasn’t read and/or understood any even reasonably modern philosophy and assumes no one else has either.
Of course, given he’s a tradcath and my mom was a parish liturgy director for decades, I probably know more about HIS religion than he does, too.
chrislawson @1
minus the meaning of the Universe and Everything. Could even be negative.
P.S. I know that presupposes additivity of meaning, and I know that 42 is the unswer to the Ultimate Question which may or may not be What is the meaning.
I think meaning is inherently subjective. When I hear someone ask, “what does it mean?” my response is: to whom?
I ran across this article the other day:
‘Mission: Impossible’ Has Always Been Important
Again I respond: to whom?
The comments on that video do a pretty good job pointing out his vacuity.
He wants to cause us “to doubt”. Doubt what? Does he really think that question has never occurred to an atheist before? I’ve been thinking about the Meaning of Life since before this guy was born. Conservative Catholicism was never one of the options I considered. Tried the Protestant equivalent for a while, found it unsatisfactory, so what’s this clown going to say now? The meaning of life is what you make of it — there is no cosmic source of Meaning, no Platonic Ideal to be striven after.
@1 and 4, please provide appropraite references. Loonquawl and Phouchg, (7.5M BCE), Annals of Deepthought.
I agree that in and of its self life has no meaning. However you can give your life meaning, purpose etc., and if you don’t that’s your problem.
I do really think though that most people give their lives some meaning, even if it’s absurd, rational etc.
It has already been answered many times, starting with the second comment.
We decide for ourselves what the meaning of our lives are.
Or meanings, there is nothing that says you can’t have more than one meaning for your life.
It varies from person to person.
It can change for yourself through time and space.
What is the appetite of convection?
My question on ultimate meaning relates to the Tridentine Mass. Does that imply that the right chewing gum is Trident? Or is it Dentyne?
Or must one chew a piece of each simultaneously?
I don’t know about being filled by the Holy Spirit. But when it comes to mouth things, it’s probably better to consult the Flying Spaghetti Monster. I can only hope that we are all touched by His noodley appendage.
Ramen.
Here’s your meaning of life:
https://esahubble.org/images/heic0611b/
This question comes from the folks whose central message is: join us and death will be the best thing that can happen to you!
Funny, I find that adding a creator god with opinions about who should go to Heaven and Hell to be the antithesis of meaning: It sucks all the wonder out of the universe and autonomy out of individuals.
The meaning of life – right now- is to trample the Republicans underfoot and yell “vae victis!” See below:
“Funny Fat tabby cat fighting off a mountain lion or cougar”
Every Democratic nominee to have this approach to Republicans. No more bipartisan bullshit.
.https://youtube.com/shorts/-qo1bTl53aw
^ ^ ^
Conan – What is Best in Life
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=Oo9buo9Mtos
(Apply it only to MAGA)
Just noting that under the strict definitions of the Code of Canon Law and the Catechism, the rules are absolute. A person cannot reject the reigning Pope, deny the authority of an ecumenical council, or refuse the official teachings of the Magisterium and still be considered a Roman Catholic.
So anyone who disputes any of the actual rules or holds different beliefs is not a Catholic.
Therefore, ‘tradcaths’ (who reject the Pope’s rulings and Vatican II) are schismatics at best, heretics at worst. Not Catholics in good standing.
(Them’s the rules)
Death. Clearly, that’s shared by all life. So that’s the purpose of life: death.
(Gotta be alive in order to die, no?)
Even if there was a legitimate answer to the question it would be an abomination unto Nuggan.
John @19: I must be misremembering something. Coulda sworn you once said that even a Catholic who has been excommunicated for any of the transgressions you mention is still considered a Catholic by the church. So when you write ‘not a Catholic’ do you really mean ‘still Catholic but considered naughty’? Very different notions.
Rob, it’s convoluted.
Catholic theology is quite clear on this: baptism is indelible. Once validly baptised, the person is forever ontologically marked as Catholic and neither sin, heresy, schism, or excommunication can change that.
That is, they are “not in full communion,” not “no longer Catholic.”
They are Catholic, but schismatic or heretical.
(Basically, it’s magical)
[I had to double-check, but yep]
https://www.vatican.va/content/catechism/en/part_two/section_two/chapter_one/article_1/vii_the_grace_of_baptism.html
1272 Incorporated into Christ by Baptism, the person baptized is configured to Christ. Baptism seals the Christian with the indelible spiritual mark (character) of his belonging to Christ. No sin can erase this mark, even if sin prevents Baptism from bearing the fruits of salvation.82 Given once for all, Baptism cannot be repeated.
Nobody exists on purpose, nobody belongs anywhere, we are all going to die. Come watch TV.
– Morty – Rick and Morty.
To put in slightly different language what a number of others have said before me:
Meaning isn’t something we find, it’s something we make
For me a lot of the meaning of my life is tied up in my family, and some of it in those I’ve taught over the years, some in my modest academic contributions, some in voting and advocating for a less shit world
The meaning of life is to have that lovely mint on the tiny plate because you have that awful feeling that you aren’t completely sated.
bravus,
Imprecise. It’s something we may make, sure. For what it’s worth.
But it ain’t necessary for everyone.
To borrow from the Bard: “Some are born into meaning, some need meaning, and some have meaning thrust upon them.”
[fishy, I prefer the other method of snuffing it featured therein]
A few candidates:
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=life
Uh, my favorite Monty Python movie.
Too much continuity in all the others.
Rob@22–
Further to John’s comment—maybe this is more of an Australian thing (possibly because Australia is one of the least religious countries in the world), but the Catholic Church here has often trotted out the number of Catholics in our population to lobby government against socially progressive legislation on the threat that it might cause a loss of the Catholic vote.
The number they quote is based on those who were ever baptised in a Catholic Church and thus massively overestimates population support as it includes people who have abandoned the Church as well as people who still attend church but disagree with much of the Church’s politics. The Catholic definition of Catholic is not just an ontological insult to those who have left the Church, it’s a crude political extortion tool.
[Yeah, can’t even make it official any more.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formal_act_of_defection_from_the_Catholic_Church ]
The meaning you get from life is a direct result of the effort you you put into your life.
Spending all your time praying at altars of false gods (i.e. all of them) results in a poorer outcome than if you work to help other folks. (Even if you do spend some time at those same altars.)
It will always be a personal balance, and will change over time.
To misquote Sarah Conner from Terminator II :
No
fatemeaning but that we make for ourselves.I despise those who think the meaning of life is to be macho murdering males and subservient breeder females.
We offer, but, do not proselytize. For members of our organization, and those interested, the meaning of life for us is summed up in our Exemplary Precepts
http://theartsinarizona.org/imperativeprecepts2020dcw.pdf
or for a secure link: https://theartsinarizona.qwknetllc.com/imperativeprecepts2020dcw.pdf
or as found within http://theartsinarizona.org/tovpeenchiridion.pdf
or for a secure link: https://theartsinarizona.qwknetllc.com/tovpeenchiridion.pdf
I’ve always thought the meaning of life, if any, is TO LEARN. If there’s a god, and they created us and our entire universe, they probably did it so we could learn and grow from experience. And if there isn’t a god, then learning is still a good thing to do. I wonder if this “tradcath” twit has ever heard that answer.
Then again, that twit has probably heard LOTS of answers and would never admit to any of them. That’s how it always is with people like him: their entire schtick is asking the same question(s) over and over and pretending no one else has ever been able to answer them.
Here is Schopenhauer’s take on the meaning of life:
https://existentialcomics.com/comic/656
hover over comic and then the banner for author’s remarks
what is the meaning of life?
I do not know even what that questions means. what is meaning, from the dictionary meaning relates mostly to language. To answer the question it would be a good start to define the terms first. So what is life actually? In this question what is meant by life? The question does not address anything directly as stated but implies it leaves the questioned open to add their personal view it that way it is more of a sales strategy or the beginning of a pitch then a real question. The questioner has an answer that they will lead the “mark” to come to by themselves.
What is life? What is existence? What is awareness? what do quarks mean? What do photons mean not the word but the thing/event itself?
it seems to me that the real question for humans, who we must admit like words and word games and like to form questions all the time, can be found in a very personal form in Hamlets speech that starts “To be or not to be”
Life is a non-equilibrium phase transition where a driven system settles into a structural configuration that lowers specific kinetic barriers, ensuring the continuous replication of that same energy-dissipating pathway.
A bit abstract?
Requires agency and volition. Not all life has that.
shermanj @39: Schopenhauer needed a Snickers.
https://existentialcomics.com/comic/356
@41
the question that Hamlet begins with “to be or not to be ” is a human question it is probably only ever asked by humans I do not think my dogs ever thought of it.
I have not a clue of what the meaning of life question is supposed be. Life is not a word it is an event in time, a summation of processes that can be described each connected to other event/processes. Life can be seen as having purpose at least in individuals first of which is to continue, then to reproduce to that end humans have evolved culture to facilitate and secure those activities of survival and reproduction which have been successful so far. As far as I can see humans are the only things that are bothered enough to ask questions that as far as I can see have no none personal individual “meaning”. For me the “meaning of life” question is as pointless as questions of faith and akin to them. Like the endless question of children of “why” after every answer given.
By some humans. I’ve never contemplated suicide.
@44
well I am not sure that is true but it may be a matter off degree, but that is only part of it.
the next lines state more
it is not suicide per say but death it self which we all will face regardless of how we die. The question is what do I do now with my time here without the fear of death to determining my actions alone.
all meaning is by nature cultural and exists in culture, in language.
What is the “meaning” of “the big bang”? There is what we mean by phrase “the big bang”, it’s definition but that is not the big bang event
Just because we can form words into sentences does not make them make sense in the real world
i
Not worry about meaning, that’s what I do. Just live.
Works for my dog and my cat.
A good friend of mine died last week – throat cancer at 60 years of age.
While frequently going through the motions of procreating he did not in fact have offspring.
He ate, shat, slept, laughed, wept. As a human he acted and interacted within his world in normal complicated human ways.
I don’t see any ‘meaning’ to his life beyond what he meant to those of us who enjoyed the pleasure of his company. In my case I think of him as one in the pantheon of gods whose hands formed the me that I am now. Though as an atheist, I use the word ‘gods’ as one would as an indigenous person – less deities more external creative forces (or inspirations if you will).
His younger sister, who died of cystic fibrosis when he was only 14 (she only lived 12 years), was one of his ‘gods’. But soon there will be none who remember her – there are only two other siblings still alive.
I will remember and honour my dear friend for as long as I have the capacity to do so.
As a human I think that it is easy to ascribe a subjective “meaning” to the life of a fellow human. But what so of an amoeba? Or a coral polyp? or a plant? They live just as much as we do, so their life should objectively mean exactly the same as ours which as far as I can tell, within this universe, is nothing.
[Nick, a good lament. Your elegy shows your respect for your friend, and is creditable]
Thanks John. He was very dear to me and I do miss him.
I have evangelical relatives that I suspect really want to ask me that. I just thought up my answer: the “meaning” of a thing is the value you might deduce from observing it. So, the “meaning of life” is that everything ends, that chaos always the final result, that entropy wins. I doubt they’ll like it.
Some people feel the following is helpful: Given that death is certain, and the time of death is uncertain, however should I live?
I guess a bit of ‘if I die tomorrow, what do I absolutely have to do before that?’ and a bit of ‘if I end up living several more decades, what do I need to prepare to make that time as satisfying as possible?’
The “meaning of life” is nothing but “having a goal where you don’t question who set it”.