Ken Ham was motivated to respond to YouTuber because, apparently, her message was inconsistent.
Our social media team recently asked me to respond to a young lady who has a YouTube channel that featured a video criticizing young-earth creationists and our (in her view) ridiculous beliefs. Now, we see many (many) such videos (there are whole channels dedicated to mocking us!) and don’t always respond, but I decided to respond to this one to point out the inconsistency in her thinking.
See if you can catch her inconsistency in the clip at the beginning of my response:
What horrible, outrageous thing did Gutsick Gibbon say? Ham pulls out a very short excerpt, about 20 seconds long, that is the basis for his 4½ minute complaint. Here’s all she is given a chance to say.
Young earth creationists are religious folk who typically come from evangelical backgrounds…basically anyone who believes that the Earth was created in more or less present state by god…approximately 6000 years ago.
If you never heard of this before, you might be saying “oh my god, what about the inbreeding?”
That’s it. That’s all Answers in Genesis can tolerate putting on their website. That first bit is totally accurate; Ken Ham might have been literally quoted saying something similar, that he is an evangelical Christian who believes that the world was created 6000 years ago by his god.
But then she says “oh my god,” which he bleeps out. He’s going to repeat that even shorter clip multiple times.
There is no inconsistency. She correctly defines Ham’s own religious belief, and happens to use a common English phrase. Ham’s objection is that, he claims, evolution and materialism are religious beliefs, too, which is irrelevant. If I were to point out that a PB&J sandwich that he is holding is a sandwich, it doesn’t refute my statement to say that my taco is also a sandwich — because Gutsick Gibbon isn’t making a case here that science is not a religion (it isn’t, but again, she’s not saying that.)
What really irks Ken Ham is that mention of the inbreeding problem. This has long been a point of irritation for him; in both the creation “museum” and fake boat gift shops, he sells stuff bragging about the fact that Adam & Eve’s kids had sex with each other, and that it wasn’t a problem because they were perfect genetic beings. He doesn’t like incest mentioned because he thinks he has an irrefutable answer to it. Never mind that he also likes to claim that they were heterozygous at every locus and that Noah’s family carried every possible allelic variant, or that what he’s arguing for is a kind of moral relativism, where sex with your brother or sister is OK if you’re not going to propagate defective children (I’ve always wanted to ask him if it’s fine to have sex with a sibling if you use contraceptives, then?)
What is inconsistent is that he then uses this offense against his faith to rant about how atheists don’t have any morality and they believe they’re just animals and animals can do anything they want. She’s ridiculous,
says the man who thinks that having a silly theme park makes him qualified to judge other’s lives.
He also doesn’t link to Gutsick Gibbon’s YouTube channel, where his followers might be able to discover that she had more to say than the only 20 seconds Ken Ham was brave enough to include.
Ham bleeps it out? Oh, of course he does. He wouldn’t know that the deity’s name is “Yahweh”, not “God”, any more than he would know that “take Yahweh’s name in vain” really means “swear an oath in Yahweh’s name and then break it”.
Not to go all tu quoque on Kenny boy here, but obedience to (an imagined) authority isn’t morality, so since he’s substituting the former for the latter, he doesn’t have any morality, either. Of course, Ken is giving an even worse form of the moral argument than that put forth by ol’ Bill Craig, but this isn’t the time to go into that.
I follow her posts on X. She is an awesome spokesperson for science. She regularly (with clear unemotional scientific arguments and evidence) demolishes YEC arguments.
Incest aside, where did Cain get his wife? And how did he manage to found a city? I’m sure Ken has an answer.
Wait, what? Seriously diarrhoeaously?
That really does NOT sound like terribly family friendly merch..
The “Intelligent Designer” figured out after things went bad with the Tree of Knowledge that Cain having sex with his sisters would be a bad idea. So he poofed up a whole bunch of people for Cain to boink. Maybe he also figured out that Cain needed someone to boss around as well.
Hey, it makes as much sense as the rest of the story. Like God not putting a fence or whatever around the Tree.
What GG really loves to do is beat up YECs with the heat problem. To cram all of the observed tectonics and radioactive decay in the rock record into 6000 years you generate enough heat to melt the earth’s crust and boil off the oceans many times over. Ham, of course, is to dense to realize there is a problem. The honest YECs that have studied the issue realize they don’t have an answer.
AstroLad @5
God crossed his arms, then bobbed his head and the heat went away.
Has anyone realize that Dumb Idiot Ham’s a pervert who thinks people young and old should always engage in neverending woopie sessions and breed like rabbits and overpopulate the earth as depicted in his fantasy world and in the dystopic sci-fi novel Soya Green?
I think the way Ham celebrates Adam and Eve’s copulating in his worthless faculties is an admission that he, himself, secretly engage in pedophilia just like the numerous pastors and preachers who got caught, arrested, tried, convicted, and sentence to spend decades in prison for the crime of sexually molesting children. The only way to confirm this is the have one of his victims bravely step forward and tell everyone about their nightmarish experience with Dumb Idiot Ham, Martyn Lies, “Buddy” Davis, and other stinkin’ AiG losers.
I suppose it’s okay if a person wants to out-source their morality, but they should be willing to acknowledge the fact.
Genetic variation requires mutations, on which natural selection goes to work. Since 4000 BC there would be so little diversity, all humans would be practically clones.
More likely, we would be extinct after some primate- or bat-based parasitic organism (most likely a virus) jumped the species barrier and killed everyone since there is no variation.
The Hamster is compressed ignorance on two legs.
Why di you say “incest aside”? Isn’t Kan Ham’s answer incest, so why do we put it aside?
LOL, Gutsick Gibbon ALWAYS has more to say than 20 seconds. Started watching her videos recently and they are all like 90 minutes minimum, and great stuff.
Shorter Ham: Man who is OK with incest denies the morality of a woman who doesn’t go for incest!
You can’t make this up. 🤣🤣🤣
@5 God was obviously a first time parent. Telling a child to NOT touch something is just like waving a red flag at a bull.
Since Ham denies evolution, he denies descent with modification. Which means he thinks all genes are exactly inherited perfectly from Adam and Eve. Who he says had perfect genes, whatever that means. Which means that all humans have perfect genes today. Which means to him that incest is fine, but also that birth defects are not from genetics but only from God’s will. Which means he accepts God’s responsibility for all defects, diseases, miscarriages, and stillbirths. Kids suffer and die because it’s God’s perfect plan.
If the world began with nothing supernatural, and no God, but then an evil Satan came to earth and lied and said he was God, and did evil everything, how would Ham tell that world from this world? Ham doesn’t question Satan’s morality, but just insists that everyone obey Satan like he says he does.
To Ham, morality is obeying every Satanic being who claims to be God.
You can’t make this up!
If everything is God’s will, then doctors who try to cure birth defects are defying God’s will.
Police and diplomats and defense forces who try to stop bad things are also defying God’s will.
To Ham, nobody should ever try to make anything better, because we are all just supposed to submit to pointless suffering as Gods will and not change anything.
Half of humanity was MEANT to die in infancy, and Ham rejects the morality of anyone against painful infant deaths. To Ham, the only acceptable health care is someone spitting mud into people’s eyes to cure blindness, along with sprinkling the blood of dying doves onto the walls to cure a house of its leprosy, as Moses said.
You can’t make this up.
What Dumb Idiot Ham shows us is just how damaged his brain is. Check this article out below.
Jesus Christ absolutely loathed scribes and pharisees so how someone like Ham can consider himself a Christian is beyond me.
Woozy — Cain went to the land of Nod and found a wife there. He apparently did not have incest.
What a lot of empty projecting.
I’m oddly reminded of the Chick Tract “There go the dinosaurs”. The tract begins with a medieval village going on a dragon hunt and a young child asks why dragons are becoming rarer and his father is now cast as the narrator and must somehow tie this objective question with on objective in-story answer (the air is getting thinner [because the flood waters have been drying up for the last few thousand years] and in a few years they’ll all be extinct. It’s not clear how this villager would know this and if he does why they aren’t trying to implement a conservation program nor even thinking about how to modify village life once the great dragon hunts are all over) must somehow segue into dinosaurs were on the Ark, how evolutionist (who won’t exist for another 500 years) got it all wrong, and that somehow these in-story existential facts must somehow illustration (god knows how or why the morality lesson about how denial of god’s word leads to external damnation.
All this from an (in-story) objective observation “why is it getting harder to hunt dragons”. One has to wonder, if they had been hunting deer would any of this still be relevant.
Here Gibbon merely describes who believes in YCE and is in no way mocking it for being a religion, nor declaring empiricism is not a worldview. Pro projection. And the comment about inbreeding is a practical one about genetic distribution which applies to animals and plants every bit as much as to the humans. Nothing to do with morality. But empty projection. But I’ll let him worry about the blasphemy if he wants (and though I doubt he or any of his followers don’t also use such phrases.)
He didn’t understand her point at all.
“Woozy — Cain went to the land of Nod and found a wife there. He apparently did not have incest.”
I’m pretty sure Ken Hamm has stated that was a sister (or niece, or great niece– people lived longer then doncha know). This is of course a post-hoc just so story rather than any religious belief and is certainly isn’t doctrine but… it is Hammism.
@cervantes #19 – where did the people in the land of Nod come from?
On the general topic of incest, what does ken hammburgler think about Lot’s daughters?
It’s funny that the people who believe literally in Genesis (chapter and chapter 2 are quite different), forget that Cain went off to live in the Land of Nod.
I assume that the people living there evolved, but Genesis doesn’t say.
StevoR@4:
Unless that family’s surname is “Duggar”.
flex@9:
Eh, I think doing that is about as bad as drunk driving. It’s throwing away your judgment and the hell with the consequences.
@ ^ Bekenstein Bound : Yup.I wonder if they’ve been to Ken “not the astronaut” Ham’s boxy big boat full of boxes and BS? Not enough to look it up tho’.. Might explain something if they have..
@19. cervantes : “Woozy — Cain went to the land of Nod and found a wife there. He apparently did not have incest.”
#22. phillipbrown beat me to it here but I’m guessing they were fast asleep on that question..
(BTW. Any indication whether the land of Nod was a real place somewhere? Something else to look up..)
Also the Pharoahs famously had brother-sister marriages didn’t they? Wonder whether the not-astronaut Ham thinks that wa sokay and whether the Pharoah’s still ahd perfect genes or not..
Ken Ham would likely say it can’t be located on a modern map, because the geography has been drastically altered by the Flood. Same with Eden and other pre-Flood locations.
He might speculate that Cain lived alone in his exile for centuries, while his younger siblings lived near their parents and reproduced rapidly with each other. After a while, young couples or larger groups of people started moving to new places some distance away. Each of these humble outposts considered itself a separate tribe, or a nation from pretty much the start, and many eventually grew into city-states by the time of Flood. Families and tribes started trading wives with each other, because somehow people got the idea that it was bad to degrade the existing gene pool with continued inbreeding. One of these early settlements, called Land of Nod, happened to be located near where Cain lived, and established contact with him despite the curse. Perhaps an early sign of humans becoming routinely disobedient? Anyway, that’s how Cain’s place also gave rise to a growing village that eventually became a city.
(AIG should probably pay me for thinking that up)
She met him in person as shown on her video about the Creation Museum. I’m sure he remembers their meeting.
This wouldn’t be hard to tackle in his worldview because contraceptives are obviously against God’s plan whether used in or outside of marriage.