Consider this: ICE agents smashed in a car window in Minneapolis, and dragged a pregnant woman through the snow and ice on our cold hard streets, the week before Christmas.
Minnesotans on the scene reacted by shouting and throwing snowballs and ice at the thugs, because you must do whatever you can to stop the violence, and sometimes that means fighting back. The commenters online are full of hate for the helpless pregnant woman.
@chuckkugler1646
Why would a pregnant woman put herself in that situation? Wow is this a protest manipulation?
Blame the woman for existing.
@dianehaines1220
Unbelievable how the news will AlWAYS tell you that the illegal was pregnant, has autism, is breast feeding a 2 yr old, has cancer, has diabetes, has no criminal history (they committed a crime by being in the USA illegally), etc. Why, Media, do you always side with illegal aliens that have no authorization to be in the USA, and you give a Bleeding Heart story? Certainly you can do better!
I’m sarry, Diane, but most of us haven’t as thoroughly dehumanized “illegal aliens” (being in the US is not automatically a crime) as you have. These are human beings, and some of them will be pregnant, have autism, be breast feeding a 2 yr old, have cancer, have diabetes, have no criminal history, and a host of other human traits. They are people, not plastic mannequins lacking in all humanity, as you wish.
@DeannaEstrada-ki2ug
Get those criminals 🧊⛄🧊⛄🧊 ICE 🧊⛄🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸💯❤️🤍💙🦅👍😂🤣😂
There’s the mindless, hateful creature Diane was looking for.
Then I found this: WHEN IT HAPPENS by Tom Ellison. It made me feel a little better. I’m stealing the whole thing because I need this.
It’s been so long, you sometimes forget that eventually, IT will HAPPEN.
It’s impossible to say when IT will HAPPEN. But it can’t be too long until IT HAPPENS. Looking at the data (age, high-stress job, cardiac history), it is statistically plausible that IT will HAPPEN in the next thirty-six months.
Eighteen, if you factor in hamburger consumption and all the weird bruising.
Of course, it doesn’t feel right to want IT to HAPPEN. And it’s obviously not okay to try to make IT HAPPEN. That’s not what this is ABOUT, just to make things CLEAR LEGALLY as far as VARIOUS AGENCIES are concerned.
But regardless, IT is going to HAPPEN. So you’re allowed to think about IT.
Theoretically, some longevity breakthrough could happen that would enable IT to NEVER HAPPEN. Just the idea is PSYCHOLOGICALLY COMPLICATED. But realistically, IT will HAPPEN. After all, the medical research apparatus will shortly be fully dismantled, unless IT HAPPENS soon.
So, it’s fair to say that IT will happen. But you also prepare for the possibility, even if unlikely, that IT won’t HAPPEN for a long time. Some of you may not last long enough to see IT HAPPEN, which is RICH.
But you imagine where you might be, eventually, when you learn IT has HAPPENED.
Maybe you will wake up, anxious and scared and angry (i.e., normal).
Walk past the armed men and the protesters and the destitute.
Then, out of nowhere, the push notification from THE NEWS: “Breaking: IT Has HAPPENED.”
What will you feel like? When IT HAPPENS?
When IT HAPPENS, it will probably be FEELING. Just a huge, overwhelming sense of FEELING, the kind where you didn’t even realize how starved you were for FEELING. Punctuated with alternating waves of SECOND FEELING, as well as SENSATION.
Plus, a sudden absence of THIRD FEELING, which makes you realize the toll of A CONSTANT BASELINE OF LOW-GRADE THIRD FEELING for ten goddamn TIME PERIODS straight, even though you were still plenty aware of THIRD FEELING, trust me.
How might IT HAPPEN?
It may be morbid, but as it happens, there are many ways IT could HAPPEN.
Heart attack.
Golfing mishap.
An especially frightening NEWS SEGMENT on COASTAL CITY, which is generally not a statistically likely cause of IT HAPPENING, but is not out of the question, in THIS SPECIFIC CASE.
You may consider other WAYS IT might HAPPEN, especially when you are overwhelmed with THIRD FEELING.
You might then feel EMOTION, but don’t beat yourself up.
You wonder how THEY will react. When IT HAPPENS. It will probably be a complete SITUATION. It will be hard not to feel some amount of perverse SENSATION, watching THEIR POLITICAL FORTUNES.
And of course, you will have to tread carefully around RELATIVES, who will probably throw an absolute REACTION when IT HAPPENS. But WE can be MAGNANIMOUS in this new, post–IT HAPPENING world.
Still, you wonder what you’ll do, right after IT HAPPENS. Perhaps you will clutch your loved ones and watch TV, as the news anchors ACT APPROPRIATELY.
Perhaps you will SCREAM, out of OTHER FEELING.
Perhaps you will pop open a SPECIFIC BEVERAGE.
Perhaps you will scroll post after post.
Posts of INCREDULITY.
Posts of ANALYSIS OF WHAT COMES NEXT, WHICH CAN WAIT.
Posts of JOKES THAT EVEN YOU WOULD FIND TO BE IN POOR TASTE, NORMALLY, BUT NOT IN THIS CASE.
Posts SCOLDING THE PREVIOUS POSTS, AND POSTS REPLYING “WHATEVER MAN.”
Posts ABOUT OTHER TOPICS, AND IT’S LIKE, DON’T THEY KNOW IT HAPPENED?
Perhaps you will think of the countless people whose lives might have been DIFFERENT, if IT had HAPPENED sooner.
The important thing to remember, though, is that IT will HAPPEN.
I will not be magnanimous after IT HAPPENS. I want every enabler and apparatchik who went along with this tyranny to be torn down from their perches and deported in disgrace. I want to see the Potomac sanctified by the desecrated corpse thrown into it, as has been done with the Tiber and Thames. I want every wanna-be autocrat to know that there is nothing but shame and disgust awaiting them in the history books.
Let IT HAPPEN soon.
This isn’t even ICE enforcing our immigration laws.
That is just an excuse.
It is state sponsored terrorism and the intended audience is the American people.
Proof.
.1. We’ve been enforcing our immigration laws for over a century without using random thugs in masks, with no badges or ID visible, kidnapping people on the street, throwing them into unmarked vans, and driving them away to no one knows where.
We can and do enforce our laws every day every where without masks, unmarked cars, and creeps without any sort of identification. I see it every day when I pass the city police, county sheriffs, and state patrol.
.2. ICE/BP are the real criminals here. They routinely violate all our laws hundreds of times every day.
Lack of Due process, Rule of Habeas Corpus, illegal search and seizure, racial profiling, excessive violence, attempted murder, murder, holding people in prisons without access to legal representation, very substandard prison conditions that have this year killed 30 people.
It is not OK or legal for the Federals to violate our Civil Rights.
This is terrorism, cruelty theater.
The message is intended for the American people. It is something like:
“We have a powerful secret police force. They can arrest anyone for anything. And if we want, we are going to arrest you.”
In fact, ICE has arrested quite a few American citizens. They are stopping and arresting people for not looking white enough.
And they arrest and sometimes shoot protesters and lie, claiming they were attacked.
You want to be careful here.
Throwing things at the police can be considered assault and they can and will arrest you and charge you with that.
Remember the sandwich thrower in Washington DC?
Yeah, he beat the rap but just barely.
If the police launch tear gas cannisters at you or shoot steel cored rubber coated bullets at you, that is legal. If you pick up a tear gas cannister and throw it back at them, they can arrest you for assault.
What is effective and legal is photographing and especially these days, video recording the thugs. They really hate and fear cameras because it documents them breaking the law, they can potentially be doxxed, and when they lie in court, their cases routinely get thrown out.
You read a lot about the police and ICE arresting protesters here and there. Most of those cases get thrown out of court if people show up, because protesting is legal and protected by the Fourth Amendment.
The videos help a lot.
The police claim a protester assaulted them. The video shows the protester on the ground while the police beat them with a club.
If you want to throw snow balls at ICE, remember that you may get arrested for it and end up in court.
Who did Nazi this coming?
And Diane knowing ICE’s track record she was probably a US citizen. And Diane your citizenship won’t protect you when the ICE Nazis come for you.
When IT HAPPENS, I don’t want it his bed or a hospital room, but in most humiliating, painful, and gory way possible. e.g. Made to walk a gauntlet of whip-wielding LGBTQ+ folks who will flog him bloody before being handed off to a surgical team who will vivisect him sans anesthesia. Republicans would be forced to watch as their messiah is rendered down organ-by-organ as he screams and begs for a mercy that will not come. Only his head will remain untouched, after which it will be mounted on a pike planted in front of the restored White House.
And yes fellow Babylon 5, I WOULD look up into his lifeless eyes and wave like this…
Edit: …fellow Babylon 5 fans…
Well, it shows how far the US has fallen. Like Cuba years ago, everyone is waiting for the soluciòn biologica. Pitiful.
Also, many deem it unlikely that this flood of shit is simply going to evaporate, never to be smelled again. Fascism has shown itself to be hardy and persistent, not for nothing facists are likened to sewer-dwelling rats and roaches…
The only consolation: there’s going to be a world-wide wild party, like nobody has seen before.
It is the Winter Solstice. We celebrate that the Winter Solstice as the deepest point of winter, in the knowledge that the world will awaken to spring in a while. At this time we enjoy the evergreens as signs that life still endures.
However, other than a handful of decent caring people who try, there is nothing in the grinding destructive machinery of human society that we can celebrate. Those whose lives are obsessed only with on acquisition of obscene amounts of money and power are the most destructive force in this deteriorating world they have created.
This Winter Solstice, the community that is my organization, takes some comfort in, and shares with you, consideration of the fundamentals of modern secular humanism which include these tenets:
Secular Humanism is ethical.
Secular Humanism is rational.
Secular Humanism supports democracy and human rights.
Secular Humanism insists that personal liberty must be combined with social responsibility.
Secular Humanism is a response to the widespread demand for an alternative to dogmatic religion.
Secular Humanism values artistic creativity and imagination and recognizes the transforming power of art.
Secular Humanism is a way of living aiming at the maximum possible fulfillment through the cultivation of ethical and creative living and offers an ethical and rational means of addressing the challenges of our times.
It is our hope that someday, in some unforeseen way, society will awaken from, and reject, this murderous debauchery and reverse the DEATH SPIRAL in which we are currently mired.
https://youtu.be/hsFmWmfuEyw?si=yP5AmOTYnSusHebg
The more things don’t change, the more things don’t change.
The Hague. Now.
I look forward to IT happening – hopefully in the way that would embarrass supporters the most – but I will be extremely worried about what happens next.
The vote was roughly 77 million to 75 million. Citizens won. Illegals lost.
Nobody is disputing the electoral victory. The point is that these people, like the women in Minneapolis, are not “illegals” and that it is dehumanizing and vile that so many citizens are favoring cruelty and ignorance.
77 million stupid people, like you, won. We’ve all lost.
Anyone who uses the term “illegals” is not a decent human being.
Winning an election is not supposed to nullify the Constitution entirely. Anyone supporting ICE is part of the mob of lawless barbarians.
Oh look, nomorefascism has decided to drop some fascism in this thread. Unsurprised, since they have been spouting racist nonsense for days in the I’ve been distracted thread.
@9 wrote “We celebrate that the Winter Solstice as the deepest point of winter….”
I’ll defer to more knowledgeable others, but as far as I understand it, the Winter Solstice is the start of winter, not the deepest point of winter. (And technically, of course, it is the shortest day and longest night of the year….)
@13 “The vote was roughly 77 million to 75 million. Citizens won. Illegals lost.”
You are referring to the Trump versus Harris vote — remember that more people voted against Trump in 2024 than voted for him.
We are not a free country. We are not a nation of laws. Growing up has been a process of realizing just how much America repeatedly fails to live up to its claimed ideals.
Executive orders tell law enforcement to treat me criminal because I was born with a disability and a terrorist for my lack of religion. The problem with YesMoreFascism is that they don’t realize they’ve lost, too. Eventually, the new regime will find an excuse to come for them, too.
Trump didn’t even get 50% of the vote.
He got 49+%.
A lot of those GOP voters have changed their mind since then.
“Trump’s Approval Rating Drops to 36%, New Second-Term Low”
Strangely enough, some GOP voters didn’t vote to destroy our democracy and don’t want to live in a wrecked wasteland once known as the USA.
5) @Akira MacKenzie
Sounds to me like you’d be right at home with the Christians whose idea of Heaven is front row seats to the eternal tortures of the damned in Hell.
.
If your blood-thirsty fantasies were to actually happen, it would probably be the final straw that made me give up on this country as the haven of irredeemable barbarians.
When I started reading the piece, I thought ‘IT’ referred to a Mad Max-style societal breakdown; took until I saw ‘Golfing mishap.’, when the penny dropped. A bit of a one-note thingy, there, O so coy!
—
shermanj, it is the Summer Solstice; the Winter one is on 21 June.
(Such parochialism!)
John @23: Sorry, mate. Your hemisphere has only about 10% of the world’s population. But your parochial concern has been noted!
I think “cruelty theater” is quite the appropriate term: They want to send a message to “undesirable” (law-abiding and aware of history) citizens and immigrants that the law is dead and will not protect us.
Facts are facts, Rob.
Parochialism is parochial.
Summer Solstice in one hemisphere, Winter Solstice in the other.
Antipodal symmetry. Always.
Percentages are a thing for you, eh?
UN 2023 estimate: US population 343 million out of 8.09 billion ≈ 4.24%.
(If our hemisphere doesn’t matter much at 10%, how much does less than half of that matter?)
@24. The Solstices are functions of geography and astronomy. The Southern hemisphere is 50% of the earth no matter how many people live there — it’s the Summer Solstice even in places with zero population.
Parochial is whinging that the vast majority of the blog readership reckons that Christmas occurs in winter, near the Winter Solstice. Before China is brought up as a counter to Christmas, I assure the Aussie that China does celebrate Christmas in its own fashion(sort of like Valentines Day) but their big winter solstice holiday is New Year.
No, Tethys.
Point is that Winter solstice marks the point of maximum darkness, so many cultures treat it as the hinge where the light begins to return. Pre‑modern societies attached it to scarcity and risk; the solstice marked survival of the darkest point. Rituals such fires, candles, gatherings functioned as signals of collective endurance.
It’s not about the date, but rather about the circumstances.
(Also, Christmas and the Solstice, O my!
We have ‘snowy’ Santas right now and Xmas lights all along our streets.
Waste of electricity, basically — point, it is indeed Xmas here, as well as Summer :)
@16
Exactly true – it’s pretty clear that Trump’s supporters, both the leaders and the rank and file, don’t care about the US constitution at all (except maybe the 2nd amendment).
Speak for yourself.
@23 John Morales wrote: shermanj, it is the Summer Solstice; the Winter one is on 21 June. (Such parochialism!)
I reply: Of course John is correct for his entire hemisphere. I must remember to think about ‘which end is up’.
And, regarding populations: who cares about percentages of population quantity, I am more interest in percentages of quality (of character) and I’ve not seen that reliably evaluated for either hemisphere.
Also, Those of us that take advantage of insolation to reduce heating costs and increase natural light in our buildings DO consider the Winter Solstice (December 21 in the Northern Hemisphere and on June 21 from John’s viewpoint) is the deepest point of winter, since every day after that has the potential for increased insolation heat and light for our buildings.
I feel the wish for IT HAPPENING is a distraction from the under.lying problem. After IT HAPPENS the forces pushing for IT TO CONTINUE will remain, the foolish voters that continue to choose it (over decades of decisions) will remain. The money and powerful people who WANT IT, still will. And IT HASN’T shocked the U.S.A out of it’s momentum towards… more. IT IS NOT IMPOSED, IT WAS CHOSEN. And why should anyone think the U.S won’t choose IT AGAIN?
#33
That is why I so very much want the ‘opposition party’ to be talking about exactly how they are going to fix things if/when they get power again. An attempt to restore ‘the old ways’ will, disastrously, not work. These are revolutionary times, revolutions are most efficiently won through voting – but winning an election is not a justification for assuming that the need for revolution no longer exists. The changes that we need all revolve around “people’s lives should suck less” (and “the rich pay more taxes” does not count as an increase in suckage – they’re still rich).
Oh look, the Time vampire wants to talk about winter/solstice. Don’t let him distract.
@Ridana Leaving aside your hyperbole about blood thirsty barbarians being not the Trump supporters for a moment. Actually, I will in just a sec. But for now LOL WTF ya smokin’? That is so not how reality is right now as to be genuinely hilarious. To be that far away from reality, to blame the repeatedly beaten dog before it bites back for biting back. Haha. Hahaha. Hahahahahahahaha.
OK, NOW leaving that aside: Just how much would you put up with to facilitate the fall, not even the IT HAPPENING, of Trump? Cos me, I’m with Akira and the absolute most I would do to prevent the most awful of IT’s HAPPENING to Trump would be would be an unenthusiastic ‘No, stop. Rule of law is good’. Once. Quietly. And then I’d help the IT facilitator escape or hide or whatever else I could do. But I would also accept that Drumpfy swine living a life of utterly satiated luxury for as long as medical science could keep him alive if it got him out of power. How ’bout you, where’s your trolley problem solution at?
springa73–
They don’t even care about the 2nd Amendment given the “well regulated Militia” bit.
Roughly 77 million Americans should be deported. Deport them now!
[I know trolling when I see it]
So do I. Bye, nomorefascism.
While even anticipatory schadenfreude might feel good, I have to throw cold water on the pre-celebration with one word – one that inexplicably hasn’t come up here yet: it begins with a V and rhymes with “rants”.
We will probably think of the day before IT as the good ol’ days within 24 hours.
Science might sometimes progress one funeral at a time, but politics and history need a bit more help.
And, goodbye to the barbarian cheering on the downfall of our piece of civilization.
@Pierce R Butler 40. I tend to agree, Long die the couch fucker. But I will still do my best to fight an aggressive cancer as hard as I can, even if it only is clearing the field for a good old fashioned catastrophic out of nowhere heart attack to take me down.
I think it is important to always remember that “IT” will happen to everything everywhere sooner or later. nothing will ever remain the same for ever.
the solstices and equinox have been marked out by people where ever they have been noticed as a great sign that things are always changing.
the “IT” of the moment will happen probably sooner then way later.
Democracy is not a passive thing nor a static thing it is something that by nature requires involvement not just once but continuously day by day everyday
December 21 (more or less) is not the beginning of Winter or Summer.
The longest or shortest day is clearly “in the depths” of whatever season.
Cross quarter days should be the beginnings / ends of our calendrical seasons.
oops
Feeling like a bit of pedantry after the fact: I’m sure YesMoreFascism’s number of 77 million includes several million Americans who were born in America and are thus American citizens. You can’t call that deporting because deporting implies taking them to the place they came from. Which would be, you know, America. Where they were born. Exile and human trafficking come to mind as less euphemistic terms. And then there’s the fact that ICE frequently targets legal immigrants by ambushing them on their court dates. When the judge rules against the absentee for not showing up, ICE retroactively justifies their abduction of the “illegal.”
Frankly, I wish all these fascists would have self-“deported” to Antarctica if they didn’t want anything to do with people who want a free, lawful society.
chigau @44
Why should the seasons respect human calendars? Especially since it’s comparatively recently that we have a fixed calendar rather than just observing the astronomical year.
Jazzlet, they don’t. Different places, different seasons.
Not Eurocentric.
Point is that a solstice is the moment the Sun’s declination reaches its maximum or minimum, and that happens regardless of what any region calls a “season”, and regardless of whether a region has four seasons, two seasons, or none in the temperate sense.
Here: https://www.csiro.au/en/research/indigenous-science/Indigenous-knowledge/Calendars
Duration of Daylight/Darkness Table for One Year: https://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/Dur_OneYear
@22
He’s a FUCKING FASCIST!
Anything that happens to them is far too good.
Calendars evolved from astronomical observations of both the sun and the moon. I think Caesar instituted the solar calendar we currently use, though it’s undergone some changes in the past 2000 years. Stone circles function as observatories at the very least. It would seem that marking the solstice was very important to multiple societies across the globe.
Yes. As the kids say, “THIS”.
All you fuckers who said you “don’t have a dog in the fight” when it came to the demonization of trans people, all you fuckers who blamed people who OPPOSED genocide (even when it’s done by a smiley Black woman) for the (re)election of Trump, all you fuckers with a racist orientalist fetish who put your stupid psuedo-Japanesey “name” in parenthesis and thought “it’s okay if I do it” – you are all collaborators. Your complicity has led to creeping acceptance of misogyny, racism, homophobia and transphobia as being more and more normalized. I only wish I had spoken out more.
The formulaic naming of the quoted user IDs “chuckkugler1646” and “dianehaines1220” casts doubt on whether either account represents an actual person with such a name.
Re: thread discusion on Solstice: if you heat and cool something (in this case a hemisphere, not the whole planet) with a roughly sinusoidal input, the temperature will be (roughly) pi/2 out of phase. From a climatology/weather side, with mid-latitude weather (UK, erm.. New Zealand?) ‘winter’ (a wooly term) is assumed to stretch from solstice to equinox. The toughest time for wildlife is also Feb-March, when, e.g. raptors are having a hard time hunting the clever mice and voles because the stupid mice and voles have been eaten. Perhaps that’s dipping back into the IT will HAPPEN side of the thread… or something.
@54 astringer. How much the temperature would be out of phase with the heating depends on the object’s thermal inertia. The maximum daily temperature of the ocean surface may be five hours past peak solar heating, but the maximum daily temperature of the sand on the beach can be just a couple of hours after solar noon.
The statistically coldest day of the year is after the shortest day of the year, the Winter Solstice, by a variable number of days, depending on location.
In San Francisco, CA it is December 27, 6 days later.
In Portland, OR it is December 25, 4 days.
In Seattle, WA it is December 23, 2 days.
In Morris, Minnesota it is January 15, 25 days.
3) @indianajones: “Leaving aside your hyperbole about blood thirsty barbarians being not the Trump supporters for a moment.”
Where did you get the idea that I think Dump and his supporters aren’t barbarians? I like to think we non-fascists still think torture is criminal, no matter who does it, and I’m not on the same side as anyone who thinks it’s ever justified, let alone would watch with salivating glee.
Here’s a map of the average coldest day of the year for each weather station across the US.
https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/interactive-map-coldest-day-year-across-united-states
That was supposed to be @35. (My keyboard is dying and I have to use the keyboard viewer to type 5tgb and -[ It’s a pain in the ass to post.)
Jazzlet #47
“Why should the seasons respect human calendars?”
I didn’t say that.
I have an expensive bottle of fine cognac waiting to celebrate when it happens.
Silentbob @52: Go fuck yourself, you obnoxious, disingenuous prat.
Silentbob @52
pustule, did you ever find those links to EVERY comment where I pretend to be Japanese?
Do you really consider being bilingual to be racist?
also, speaking of racism
違う is not “psuedo-Japanesey”, it is an actual Japanese word that is different from my original ‘nym.
and since English also gives you problems try “pseudo” next time and you won’t get the squiggly red underline.
chigau @63: Silentbob is our very own Trump. Never explain anything. Just attack, reason and substance be damned. Rinse and repeat. An ignorant coward and a creep.
‘let alone would watch with salivating glee.’
@ridana 57 . The barbarians being on the non dump side of the equation was your forming of the terminology. Do you really think the barbarians on both sides are equivalent? Oh dear. And as for the part I quote above, who says anywhere they would do that? I claim, pretty non-controversially I think, that Trump deserves some pretty heinous shit to happen to him. No one wants to watch it happen. I’ve said a bunch of times that some folks deserve execution, yet I would prefer not to have executioners in my society. Meaning I have to settle for something else.
I don’t know, but I guess you are unlikely to have your door kicked in by ICE. Me too, white, middle aged, male, domiciled in the wrong hemisphere that I am. But these people have been known right now to
ALL THE BABY TRIGGER WARNINGS
separate toddlers from their parents and leave them on cold concrete floors, crying until they die of exposure, thirst, neglect, heart break, something else, take your pick, Those are the right fucking now barbarians not the ones you imagine would like to ‘gleefully watch’ and would be the harbingers of societal collapse. And while these people, their bosses, and their defenders will not be, and would not be under my regime, tortured to death and executed via razor blades and lemon juice, there’s no doubt at all that they deserve such horrors 6 different ways every day for a good long time.
indianajones:
Wow.
(Tour imagination regarding proper torture is feeble. Just as well!)
Fuck off etc Morales.
Was there a script or something that’d let you block out certain users so you simply don’t see their posts, or was that for a different blog. It’s been a while.
My imagination doesn’t take me further than a nice glass of Amontillado.
Maybe a case.
No worries, O shining example of ethical virtue: surely I will not be (nor would I be under your regime) tortured to death and executed via razor blades and lemon juice, though I possibly deserve such horrors 6 different ways every day for a good long time.
(Do you not get how you thus reveal yourself?)
Point being, problematic as desiring someone’s death may be, consider whether desiring it by means of torture but enforcing the will power to not indulge in it is even more so.
(Do you know why paper cuts hurt more than their equivalently-deep razor cuts? Hint: nociception and wound pattern — and of course, different chemical irritants can apply)
—
Yup.
Of course, it takes a really cluey person to be able to find or remember those, rather than ineffectually wistfully wishing for them.
(If you strive, you might make it there!)
@52. Silentbob :
Whose complicity exactly?
What precisely do you think you should’ve spoken out more about and said that you haven’t already? Also where?
Do you mean attacking someone without evidence on this blog regularly for no good reason accusing them of being another gender and group ie chigau (違う)? Has that been in any way helpful or constructive or done any good?
Or constantly defending a troll and quite possible Trumpist – certainly a Trump enabler – who when it mattered most to unite behind the ONLY option for stopping Trump at the ballot box argued for de facto in reality supporting Trump and his re-election by constantly attacking that ONLY real option and undermining her – and her predecessor as Democratic party nominee? Specifically ‘beholder’ (& Vicar & a few others) whose advocacy was never against Trump and only nominally in favour of a third party spoiler who we already know from past history had zero chance of success and would ONLY help Trump in actual practical terms. Has that been in any way helpful or constructive or done any good?
Or supporting Trump puppet master and genocidaire Putin in his invasion of Ukraine along with the other Tankies? Has that been in any way helpful or constructive or done any good?
Is that what you mean you should’ve spoken out about more?
Who the fuck here said that precisely or argued in favour of ignoring the demonisation of trans people exactly? Names? Examples?
The ones here who especially pointed out other issues such as the impact of Trump on Transpeople, Climate, Democracy, stopping exactly the sort of evil fascism we are now seeing as pointed out in the OP meant it was vital to vote against Trump (and thus for Kamala in the shitty binary system the USoA has) said the very opposite of what you seem to be implying they said.
You Silentbob, (& others too) should’ve spoken out more in OUR favour and Kamala Harris’s favour and less in favour of those undermining & attacking her & ignoring the ONLY alternative when we needed to stop Trump. That’s fact. That might’ve been actually helpful, constructive and done some good. Sadly, we’ll never know because instead you did, well see the first part of this reply which is now history.
You still don’t have the courage to accuse me directly by name do you coward. Nor answer my questions to you which have included the very basic :
“What part of there were two choices last year Fascist and non-Fascist NOT three and that advocating for 3rd party spoiler was effectively, in practice, in reality, de facto a vote for fucking Trump’s fascism don’t you get?”
Its been pointed out & asked by me to you enough times now that I reckon you either do get it and just wanted Trump to win with all the subsequent predicted consequences or, well, what exactly? You tell me. really. Please do.
Oh and NO Kamala Harris and former President Biden did NOT commit genocide. Netanyahu and his govt are the ones responsible for that. As well as Putin and other examples outside of Gaza that get far less attention and action taken e.g. the Chinese against the Tibetans and Uyghurs. Biden and Kamala called for restraint, they sanctioned Israeli extremists and they withheld weapons from Israel. Measures that Trump reversed – as we fucking warned you he would. As stated before here :
https://proxy.freethought.online/pharyngula/2025/12/01/somebody-got-paid/comment-page-1/#comment-2285716
Whose complicity again here? Those who stood and argued and attacked and undermined Kamala Harris and her campaign for election versus Trump.
That.
Is.
Who.
Is.
Complicit.
In.
Trump’s.
Election.
Here.
66) @indianajones: “And as for the part I quote above, who says anywhere they would do that?”
Did you skip over Akira’s post @7 to which I originally replied? In which they wrote, “Made to walk a gauntlet of whip-wielding LGBTQ+ folks who will flog him bloody before being handed off to a surgical team who will vivisect him sans anesthesia. Republicans would be forced to watch as their messiah is rendered down organ-by-organ as he screams and begs for a mercy that will not come.” That’s what I was calling barbaric. Given that they spent the time writing up such a detailed fantasy, I don’t think they needed to specifically say that they’d enjoy watching if it came to pass, since they clearly enjoyed watching it in their head.
@73 Ridana. I did in fact miss that post @7 I think there were 40 or so posts when I first saw this thread. Still, no excuse for me there..
I would say that such things are deserved. I’d even call them (suitably) barbaric. I wouldn’t want to watch or listen or anything else, But noting that I did miss that as context before, I shall give you more benefit of the doubt in the future. And read more carefully too.
@ tedw :
Quoting for truth. Seconded 100%.
No human being is illegal.
I wanted IT to happen with Trump -trhe convicted felon POTUS rotting in jail ignored and repudiated, abandoned by his followers, kept out of news for yeras and convicted on multiple crimes including sedition, insurrection , rape etc..and sentenced to ie injail ie life sentence. After having his moneyand assets and power taken from him.
Reckon that would’ve happened had Kamala won. Itwa shappeneing slowly -far tooslowly thanks pathetic USoA sluggish a sfuick legal system.
Clarity fix & expansion : It was happening slowly – far too slowly thanks pathetic USoA sluggish as fuck legal system.
Justice delayed really has been justice absolutley denied.
I will never understand why Trump was arrested and thrown in jail on Jan 6th and kept there permanenlty afterwards.
There was a window there when even the Repugs briefly saw reality and were condemning him and what he did. Reckon they could’ve impeached him the next day – well , okay, within the next few days. Bloody well convicted and removed him then too.
Why don’t we live in the timeline wherre that happened or he was never POTUS in the first place (thanks Stein, West, other spoilers and dropkicks, the EC, Comey, Assange, etc..) rather than this utterly awful one? Sigh.
As a torture survivor, I honestly don’t know what to say to some of the participants in this thread. I want this regime ended (and yes, I’m under threat from them both as a queer non-binary person, and as a mentally ill person), but torture can never be a part of that.
Torture is never justice. Torture is never justifiable. If you’ve read Orwell’s 1984, then you may well recall this line from O’Brien: “The object of torture is torture.” That might seem a meaningless tautology, but it’s not. Torture is not the means to an end, torture is the end. The purpose of torture is simply to cause suffering and harm for suffering and harms sake, with the end result being a broken person.
It’s an impossible task, but I’m going to try to put into words the essence of what it means to be broken:
You have no will. None. You want nothing, you care for nothing, you believe in nothing. You’re a quivering mass of flesh that suffers, nothing more. You have no identity. You live only for your torturer. When they hurt you, you cringe and cry and promise them anything and everything to make it stop, and when they do stop, you thank them and you mean it with every fiber of your being.
In some ways, later on, that’s the worst part. Not the remembered pain or even the betrayals. No, it’s the obsequious, fawning gratitude. In that moment when the pain stops for just a little while, you worship and even adore your torturer in a way you fear you’ll never feel for anything or anyone else. You don’t hate them for what they’re doing to you- the hate only comes later- because they’ve taken that capacity from you.
You live for your torturer. They, the pain they cause you, and the few moments of blessed surcease, are your entire world.
And that is where description fails me. If you’ve never been there, and I sincerely hope you (whoever you are, and whatever you’ve done) never are, then you can’t imagine the self-loathing you’ll feel later, assuming you survive. The sense of degradation, violation, and disgust is overwhelming even decades later. Writing about it now, I literally feel sick. It’s honestly a little hard to resist the urge harm myself, to just fucking die so that I don’t ever have to think about that or feel that way ever again.
But I won’t. I will keep writing about this whenever I am able, whenever I feel it’s necessary, because there is never any justification for torture. Torture has never, and will never, dissuade those who would use torture. Torturing a torturer does not in any way ameliorate the harms they’ve done. It is not justice. It does not balance the scales or right any wrongs. Every act of torture compounds harm with harm, piles evil upon evil, and makes the world a worse place than it was before.
vucodlak @78
Thank you.
With no direct experience, I think torture is also for the pleasure of the audience.
Because there will always be an audience.
Recursive Rabbit @69
Yes. There was a killfile / hushfile.
There was also scrolling past without reading.
Which is quite easy.
I’m standing firm on “Massive diarrhea, resulting in a heart attack, during a live broadcast.”
It would be such a fitting end. Just a big pile of shit.