On my previous post about the horrific fraternity/rugby team chants at the University of Mary Washington, I neglected to mention the most horrific part of it all. A woman, Grace Mann, was murdered. As Dave Futrelle explains today:
The rugby team was suspended in March. Mann, a prominent member of the group whose activism led to the team’s suspension, was murdered in April. The suspect, a returning student named Steven Vander Briel, was a former member of the rugby team.
It gets worse. Futrelle quotes an MRA who basically says she had it coming for joking about misandry.
Some days I don’t know whether to rage or cry. Better do both.
I noted the murder at the time of the previous thread, but I was in serious shock over that song, and then the thread went sideways, with everyone preferring to talk about ‘Greek life’, rather than the extreme objectification of women, allowing these men to feel easy about raping and murdering women.
This is terrifying. There’s no other word for it.
*Source: http://feminismisafraud.tumblr.com/post/118470091817/feminist-strangled-to-death-on-college-campus
It’s so repulsive and circular, this reasoning. It’s basically “feminism is bad because it makes misogynists want to kill you.”
It’s a clubhouse full of eternal man-children, who pout and sulk when they are expected to be responsible for their own actions. Instead, they blame women. The difference between them and African/Indian/Middle Eastern cultures (that also shame and blame women while men do anything they want) is one of degree, not kind.
Why are they so afraid to grow up?
So when men murder women the problem is actually misandry and not misogyny…
So when men murder women the problem is actually misandry and not misogyny…
Yes, because it makes men look bad! Therefore: misandry.
I think most ten-year-olds come up with that “I’m rubber you’re glue” moral nihilism, but most of us outgrow it. It does seem to crop up a lot, also in the form of “your stopping me from oppressing people is oppression!”
These are the people who accuse feminists of being humorless.
How fucking ridiculous is it that their response to credible rape threats is “can’t you take a joke?” and yet these are the same people who will respond angrily to the most benign jabs at men with extreme butthurt rants.
I’m just down the road from Fredericksburg. Why has this not blown up all over the media yet? I wonder….
Sometimes, it’s really frightening just how horrible some people can be.
@brucegee1962
Because femicide is not treated as a hate crime.
Brucegee1962:
Frat culture, aka The Future of America! culture vs some of those uppity women getting what’s coming to ’em. If only women would get back in their proper place, well, they’d be treated right (as slaves and servants), and they wouldn’t get in trouble. After all, everyone knows that for real good girls don’t have bad things happen to them. Ever. Nope.
Well, WaPo probably counts as media, but this piece from April 24 supposedly about Mann spends half its time talking about how normal and sweet the killer is.
At vigil, slain Mary Washington student recalled as a ‘force of nature’
His being on the rugby team is just mentioned in passing as one of his many interests. Nothing at all about Mann and members of Feminists United receiving threats, and nothing about the horrible chants of the rugby team. The only mention is this:
I’d say that’s the sort of whitewashing that Soraya Chemaly intended to call out with the Stop minimizing fraternity misogyny article. Without that she’s just another woman mysteriously killed by some normal sweet guy.
*spits*
It takes a special kind of arsehole to hear about the misogyny motivated murder of an innocent women, and then their first thought is how to try to turn this around and blame feminism for it.
The language from the nauseating quote is revealing on several levels. This nitwit considers a woman asserting that women are people too to be ‘throwing down the gauntlet’, which is a reference to a type of challenge associated with duelling. He really does seem to view anyone calling out his privilege to be equivalent to a challenge to personal, physical combat. That speaks volumes about how twisted and riven with hatred for women this guy really is.
He also acts as if an appeal for equality of the representation of interests in society amounts to a demand to be treated violently;
I wonder if he considers himself the full equal of, say, people with advanced unarmed combat training or military personnel? Careful there Oelke – what will you do if they decide to treat you ‘like an equal’ with ‘predictable results’ such as them beating you to death in cold blood? Shouldn’t you endorse ‘mutual appreciation’ where you show your appreciation for anyone stronger and/or more capable to inflict violence than you are by affording them more rights and social standing than you possess? While they show their appreciation for you by (probably, at least most days) not simply killing you on a whim? Perhaps only persons of a sufficiently proven capacity for violence should be allowed to vote or run for public office? I mean, it is not as though that could end badly or anything…
Then there is the fact that at least some women out there will be considerably better at this violence buisness than Oelke himself is. I wonder if he will be willing to bend a suitable ‘mutualy appreciative’ knee to them, should he meet them? Afterall, if he doesn’t, we would be in the territory of ‘predictable results’, and by his own logic he would deserve whatever he got.
I also find it interesting that by his form of words Oelke assumes that all feminists are women, completely ignoring the existence of feminist men. Oh, that’s right, in the world according to Oelke, there are no male feminists, just ‘mangina gender-traitors’ or some similar such bigoted pastiche of stupidity.
And then we get this ugly sentiment;
Which, especially with the part about licking tears, really does sound more like some kind of distorted, deeply repulsive sexual fantasy on the part of Oelke than anything else. I really do think this creep represents an unambiguous danger to women, and in a just society would be treated accordingly.
Gregory@12, I was thinking about these creeps this morning, and the thought came to mind that they’re a bit like the Dominionist Christians and other “power makes right” types. They think that when the revolution comes they’ll be the ones in charge. They never bother to think they’ll be the cannon fodder, servants, or even the useful idiots eliminated by the bosses after they’ve outlived that usefulness. In the case of MRAs they seem fond of putting people into hierarchies, so it seems reasonable that the most manly, “real” men would be in charge, and they of course all assume they specifically will be in that rank.
@timgueguen #13
Except some of them know they’re not in that rank, and whine many manly whines because they can’t get laid because the heartless bitchez all want Alpha Males.
I think they need women to exist as a permanent underclass. They do think heirarchically, and are anxious about their own place on the Man Ladder. That anxiety is assuaged and they feel much better about themselves if they can comfortably imagine themselves inherently superior to half of humanity because penis.
@timgueguen #13
Many of them are obsessed with rating themselves and other men as alphas, betas and the like. But I don’t think they all assume they rank high on the Man Ladder. Much manly whining is done because they can’t get laid on account of coldhearted shallow bitchez only want alpha males.
I think they need women to exist as a permanent underclass in part to assuage their anxieties about their own shortcomings. They need to feel superior to somebody–how convenient if they can be superior to half of humanity, no matter what they do, because penis.
(I had a better version of this comment but my phone ate it.)
testing?
@timgueguen #13
Many of them are obsessed with rating themselves and other men as alphas, betas and the like. But I don’t think they all assume they rank high on the Man Ladder. Much manly whining is done because they can’t get laid on account of coldhearted shallow bitchez only want alpha males.
I think they need women to exist as a permanent underclass in part to assuage their anxieties about their own shortcomings. They need to feel superior to somebody–how convenient if they can be superior to half of humanity, no matter what they do, because penis.
(I had a better version of this comment but my phone ate it. If multiples show up, please to forgive.)
Gregory
I swear if misandry exists it’s those guys who think that men are barely controlled brutes who are only kept from murdering people for the smallest perceived slight by:
-the possibility to end up being the one murdered (that’S with other dudes)
-the potential victim being all pleasing and demure and shit (that’s with women)
TW, for obvious reasons:
That’s a little too graphic with too much of a gleeful undertone to be the purely academic hypothetical that Mike Oelk is pretending it to be. Fuck this guy.
I wonder if the anti-SJW atheists will openly embrace this philosophy too. After all, they say people being feminist etc. is what makes the anti-SJWs send death and rape threats. It’s is the same “logic”. Women keep harming themselves by “provoking” our own abuse according to them.
I wonder if this MRasshole will be invited to speak at TAM.
Giliell,
You’re so right. No one hates men more than misogynists hate men.
timgueguen @ 13;
I agree with the various iteration of Lady Mondegreen’s post with regard to this (that smart phone is in need of a stern talking to) – the MRAs are most certainly obsessed with their imagined relative ranking upon the man-o-meter, but they aren’t confident that they will be at the top of this fictional hierarchy of manliness. A great many of them seem to believe that they aren’t accorded the status as men that they seem to think they deserve, either by other men or by women, and blame women in particular for failing to instantly fall for their… errr… I suppose the delusional MRAs would consider them to be ‘charms’. The perceived ability to look down upon all cis women, all men who don’t peform their masculinity in the conventional manner MRAs find acceptable, and all trans* persons and intersex persons as notionally inherently inferior to their supposedly oh-so manly manness eleviates any anxieties they have about their status among cis/het men. It is pathetic and toxic in equal measure.
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Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk- @ 18;
and Jackie the social justice WIZZARD!!! @ 21;
QFT – MRAs whine endlessly about ‘misandry’, and yet they are the ones who construct masculinity as being inherently and mindlessly violent, and in the process cast men as quite literally subhuman, and as lacking any faculty for socialisation, impulse control (especially with regard to sexual desire) or empathy.
Men – as they are defined by MRAs and other misogynists – can only really be called dangerous monsters; as brutal and bloodthirsty as any creation of fiction, and in need of being put down, or at the very least imprisoned in a secure location, for the good of society. That this is the ultimate conclusion that must be drawn from their arguments should be a cause of great concern for MRAs everywhere, but that would require a level of introspection and awareness of the full implications of their position they just seem to be incapable of.
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Thumper: Who Presents Boxes Which Are Not Opened
I should have put a trigger warning on the post where I originally quoted this poison. I apologies for my carelessness.
I does make you wonder about the kind of mind that comes up with such a worryingly specific scenario. I get the impression that Oelk thinks about this kind of ugly stuff a lot.
My sentiments exactly.
I think too much is being weighted toward MRAs. We aren’t talking about bitter, middle-aged men here, but college students who are considered to be fairly typical, often considered to be above average, favourite sons and all that. This is where the bulk of the backlash against feminism is taking place. These are young men who wish to seriously regress societal attitudes towards women, in the hopes of forcing women firmly back into not-quite-human status.
There’s privilege at work, and a lot of entitlement, too. This is where you find brotherhoods of toxic masculinity, deeply entrenched, entwined, and continually reinforced. Until such time as frats are no more, these houses will continue to trade in the degradation and humiliation of women, allowing for more rapes and murders, with (as Pteryxx showed in #11) people shaking their heads and murmuring how tragic it all is…for the murderer [or rapist]. This is rape culture in a microcosm.
Caine @ 23;
I am quoting your entire post for truth, because it is important and needs to be said again. I also agree completely that these are not MRAs in the sense of delusional woman hating ranters stuck on the political fringe with little in the way of ability to actualise their misogynistic fantasies. Instead, we are seeing a growing cult of violent woman-hatred among the very people that our broken society has annointed to be the future leadership (Western democracy is increasingly democractic in theory only so far as I can see).
They already have vast unearned social privilege (such that rape is just a little faux pas, and the murder of a woman is a cause for grief only because of the supposed ‘wasted potential’ of the murder), and in the near future some of them will wield very great power indeed. All that privilege and power in the hands of people who are apparently hell bent on returning women to the status of living sex toys and/or incubators is a very grave threat. Even if the majority of them find it expedient to brush their ‘youthful indiscretions’ (that is the hip term for rape these days, dontchaknow) under the carpet and pay idle lipservice to the notion that women are actually fully human afterall, these kinds of attitudes don’t just go away, and instead create space and a ready made support network for those among their number who won’t even bother to walk back their misogyny one bit, and instead will openly campaign to disenfranchise women and create cover for rapists and woman-murderers to act with impunity, and therefore make it easier to control women.
We will likely never see an actual bill entitled ‘The Rapist’s Charter’ but a body of laws that function as such is already partially in existence, and if these frats aren’t dealt with effectively, it will only get worse.
Frats exist to advance the careers of the men in them. They make connections and get a leg up from former students who are still considered “brothers”. Do we think men who leave these frats for the working world do not treat women like this outside the frat or the team? Of course they do. They are trained up in sports clubs and other manly man places where women are excluded and looked down upon. Then they graduate with a degree and a network of similarly trained up privileged men who send their sons into the same world to be trained in manliness. Of course their version of “manliness” is more than a little rapey, entitled and violent.
These men become professors, CEOs, coworkers, spouses and fathers.
I don’t just think orgs like this should be mowed down. I think they should be dug up at the root and the ground salted.