Comments

  3. Private Ogvorbis, OM says

    (From Pervious Thread)

    Private Ogvorbis, you know that I meant Walton and KG and the fucking royal family line.

    No, I didn’t. If I had known what you meant, I would not have asked. I am not my Wife. I have no superpowers.

    Sorry.

  7. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Not a dinosaur at all. It’s a relative of Diplocaulus, Diploceraspis, Peronedon Keraterpeton and Batrachiderpeton – probably an amphibian, but that’s the very question my research is about.

    Oh, cool! I once had a bizarre dream about diplocaulus as a small child, before I knew what it was called but knew that it was an amphibian (five-six maybe?)

    I dreamed I found a cleared area in a forest with some weedy shallow ponds/puddles, and little diplocaulus were swimming around in it. It was photorealistic, like, they weren’t freaky monsters or weirded out or anything, they moved exactly like aquatic salamanders do and had boomerang heads. And that made it incredibly surreal to remember. It feels in my head like something I actually saw rather than a dream.

    And so I will always love diplocaulus and its relatives.

  8. Private Ogvorbis, OM says

    And I am now on my 16th email with a man who will not take yes for an answer about the design of one of the locomotives. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!

    Out of a cigar.

  9. says

    Janine:

    who starts needling Walton when he starts his royal navel gazing?

    Everyone? Honestly, the last two incarnations being eaten alive by a few people stamping their feet over Tolkien was enough, without the same old royalty crap again.

  10. Private Ogvorbis, OM says

    Private Ogvorbis, who starts needling Walton when he starts his royal navel gazing?

    What makes you think I remember these things? For Pete’s sake, I work in a place in which we wear nametags for a reason!

    On another subject, who is Pete?

  11. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Honestly, the last two incarnations being eaten alive by a few people stamping their feet over Tolkien was enough, without the same old royalty crap again.

    Truth.

  14. Rey Fox says

    Okay then. Harry Potter: Classic literature, or hackneyed money-making scheme? GO!

    Good news, skin cancer seems to be about beaten for the nonce. Go Team!

    In the Super Bowl of life, health is the (Team in Your Area), and cancer is the New England Patriots. Sis boom bah!

  15. janine says

    Kropotkin, Bakunin and Tolstoi were all Russian nobles who became anarchists of very different types. They did not seem to spend much time talking about royal linage.

    It would be nice if Walton followed their examples.

  17. dontpanic says

    Okay then. Harry Potter: Classic literature, or hackneyed money-making scheme? GO!

    yes.

  18. dontpanic says

    Rey Fox,
    That is to say I don’t necessarily see that question as containing a exclusive-or. At this point I think it qualifies as both.

  19. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    Last Thread:

    Beatrice, *hugs*. That’s all kinds o’ suck, right thar. Reminds me of our own Bad Old Days, which hopefully will not come again. *knock on simulated wood-grain plastic*
    –
    Jeffrey, you had/have skin cancer? *gulp*
    I am aghast. But pleased that the beast is beaten.
    –

    Or explain exactly how the Queen is related to the former ducal House of Teck. :-p

    Well…wasn’t Princess Mary of Teck her grandmother? *sneaks a peek at Wiki*

    Yep.
    –
    –

  20. Private Ogvorbis, OM says

    Okay then. Harry Potter: Classic literature, or hackneyed money-making scheme? GO!

    Would you accept: A fun read with multiple layers of plot in which I notice something new each time I read the series? Which is also the way I’d describe Herbert’s Dune series (the original, not the space operas of his son). As to whether Harry Potter is to be classified as literature, who knows? If it is still being discussed and analyzed 20 or 50 years from now, we still may not know.

  21. pHred says

    That would have been a much better video if he had managed to impale himself with the sai.

    The heating system in the building has just lost its mind and the radiator behind me is now banging loudly and repetitively – making it impossible to do either the proof reading that I need to be doing or to actually think with the proper level of zenitude to read more of the endless thread. Arugh!

  22. Private Ogvorbis, OM says

    The heating system in the building has just lost its mind and the radiator behind me is now banging loudly and repetitively

    But does it have a beat? And can you dance to it?

  23. says

    So, sometimes Gawker is funny. Like this article, in which the reporter called up a bunch of different chain restaurants/food producers and asked if they had aborted human fetii in their products. Those who answered “No” straightforwardly get the “NO FETUSES!” stamp; those who declined to respond get the “MAYBE FETUSES!” stamp.

    The comments are hilarious, too. I giggled at this anecdote for five minutes:

    I used to wait tables at Houston’s in NYC and we served a pork chop that came with Polenta. A man asked me what polenta was so I explained it was a cornmeal product.

    He replied “I thought polenta was the stuff that comes out after the baby is born.”

    After a moment of stunned silence his wife said “You can just walk away” And I did.

    A little off topic, but sorta fitting.

  24. Private Ogvorbis, OM says

    Ms. Daisy Cutter, Feral Fembeast:

    I’ve never waited tables (I’ve worked in kitchens and washed dishes (I was best at washing dishes (make of that what you will))) but Wife and Sister did. And that type of awkward there-will-be-no-tip-from-this-table type of situation is, well, not normal, but it happens.

  25. walton says

    Kropotkin, Bakunin and Tolstoi were all Russian nobles who became anarchists of very different types. They did not seem to spend much time talking about royal linage.

    True – indeed, apparently Kropotkin stopped using his princely title at the age of twelve, and would even rebuke his friends for referring to him as a prince. His father also later disinherited him, so he received none of the family fortune.

    On an unrelated note, he also had an extremely impressive beard, as did many of the great nineteenth-century Russian intellectuals. I only hope that some day my own facial hair will attain similarly voluminous proportions.

    It would be nice if Walton followed their examples.

    Awww… *sigh* Ok, I’ll stop now. I apologize for indulging my passion for royal geekery; given the significance of the date, I couldn’t help it. :-)

  28. janine says

    Ok, I’ll stop now. I apologize for indulging my passion for royal geekery; given the significance of the date, I couldn’t help it.

    And what was your excuse for all of the other times?

  29. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    I only hope that some day my own facial hair will attain similarly voluminous proportions.

    I hope so, too. The small birds and small furry animals need lots of space to nest. And with a really good beard, if you are hungry, just comb it out and have soup.

    This is meant in jest. Really.

  30. janine says

    Littlejohn, the answer is simple. As long as it is a public institution and receives federal funding, they have no right to deny services.

  31. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    If I were a patron at that table, I’d have tipped extra, out of embarrassment.

    Both Wife and Sister have told me in the past that a feuding couple, or a couple experiencing and ultimate what the fuck moment, tended to fail to tip. Or tip really well. Nothing in between.

  32. Owlmirror says

    “I thought polenta was the stuff that comes out after the baby is born.”

    Maybe he was thinking of a piñata.

    …Or a pimento?

    …Would’ja believe… a placebo?

  33. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    Maybe he was thinking of a piñata.

    …Or a pimento?

    …Would’ja believe… a placebo?

    A Placido?

  34. Predator Handshake says

    I scored big at the record store the other day: picked up Dead Winter Dead by Savatage (the guys behind Trans-Siberian Orchestra), the remaster of Rush’s Exit…Stage Left, and the re-release of Bad Religion’s How Could Hell Be Any Worse.

    The How Could Hell re-release is interesting because it includes a couple of EP’s from a few years after the original release and you can hear Greg Graffin’s voice change as soon as the later tracks start.

  35. walton says

    And what was your excuse for all of the other times?

    Sheer geekery and nerdhood? (But perhaps you’d prefer it if I’d taken up collecting Pokémon cards instead.)

  37. mcwaffle says

    @36

    Although, it only rhymes if you anglicize the pronunciation of “karate.” I just wonder what that guy was doing in the showers with the geisha… doesn’t he have a karate wife and two karate children at home? Or, I guess, at the dojo?

  38. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    That’s some strange Japanese …

    Ichi, ni, san, yon/shi, go, roku …even if it is romanji, the correct spelling can be important.

  41. Brownian says

    What do I do with someone who sent me an email complaining that the Date of Death field in a dataset I sent is an integer, rather than formatted as a date. In Excel.

    Or the nurses who keep asking me to update a map for them, including removing some towns and “implying others”?

    I have an art’s degree, for fuck’s sake, and yet I know that Excel (and many other systems, if not all) stores dates as integers, and simply applies a format that can be set with a few mouse-clicks. And that physical and political geography does not exist at one’s beck and call.

    Sigh.

    I really wish I’d stuck to waiting tables, sometimes.

  42. Sili says

    Anyone here have experience with 3TB external harddrives? I’ve tried the Googletubes for a solution, but reformatting and making smaller partitions doesn’t do anything to let Windows write a backup to the thing.

    Sorry to be so needy lately.

  44. jamesmichaels1 says

    Hey it’s been too long guys and girls! How you doing?

    So I’ve thought of a new sort of counter-argument to fallacies, specifically ones that say “You haven’t researched X so you can’t criticise Y”. Basically, I’ve been reading over the massive Be Scofield thread, as well as some of my initial inane comments from when I first came here (again, I can’t apologise enough for those *shudder*) and essentially it has to do with theists who will say that you should research religions/philosophies in order to criticise religion and say its bad.

    So I thought of another rather good structured textbook response, besides the “Emperor’s New Clothes” response, that would also fit well. Here it is, and some feedback would be handy on what you think :) :

    “No, we don’t need to do those things. Because when you became a (insert name of faith here), you clearly didn’t do the level of philosophical or religious research that you demand of us before we criticise religion otherwise you wouldn’t be here spouting this crap. Hell, you might not even have ended up a believer if you’d truly researched those things. Besides, even when we do research those things that theists like you ask us to research, we almost always find that this “evidence” you produce for (insert claim particular theist is making here) to be woefully lacking and produces nothing like the sort of earth shattering revelations that you obviously expect to turn us into converts the moment we view it.”

    So yeah, feedback on that style of response would be awesome. For lack of a better name for this counter-argument, I suppose you can always call it “The James Michaels Reply” if you wish.

    Meanwhile, in the UK, there’s a mixed bag of fortunes with the Church of England and gay marriage: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16848402 On the one hand, we have the CoE ignoring government law and wanting the authority to sanction gay partnerships to be the role of the General Synod (the sort of religious position of disrespecting the law which I’m sure is familiar to many atheists and secularists within the US), but on the other hand even members of the CoE clergy are calling the Church out on this shit, which is certainly a good sigm

  45. jamesmichaels1 says

    *Ahem*: “sign” that should be.

    Also, I apologise for when Simon came along, he and I don’t talk any more. And muchos thanks to those who were very kind about me being so tolerant of his views even when they were downright offensive. :)

    James

  46. says

    HI there
    Wow, my friend learned that people aren’t mean to her when they’re running late for a good reason and her mobile is turned off so they can’t tell her.
    That’s progress.

    David M.

    My dad is for gay marriage, IIRC, but against adoption rights for gay couples. Why? Because teh ghey might be contagious. *sigh*

    Hach, us pesky secular Europeans.
    They need other bad reasons why gays aren’t at least our kind of people.
    What does he think about lesbians with bio-children?
    Yes, teh ghey is contagious, that’s why straight people always raise straight children ;)
    My lesbian friends are already making plans about what drama to stage if their daughter should bring home a boy ;)

    Dhorvath
    Cool stuff. Can parents get involved, too?

  47. Dhorvath, OM says

    Giliell,
    Already in the works. We have a number of people with skills and or contacts who are down as part of the curriculum options. The curriculum is not set yet, as I said it’s a trial program, so we will see what ends up fitting and what doesn’t. For instance, I do bikes, not every five year old can ride, so I will need to see what kind of fit I can offer within my speciality.

  49. Richard Austin says

    Dhorvath:

    For instance, I do bikes, not every five year old can ride, so I will need to see what kind of fit I can offer within my speciality.

    Mechanical engineering – gearing, levers, pulleys, whatever. Basic concepts, obviously, but even if you can’t ride bikes, you can show them how things work. Which I think would be super-awesome.

  50. Therrin says

    Thomathy (re joed),

    That’s some strange Japanese …

    I thought ze was saying something about zis perverted older sister, but I only know anime-prominent words.
    —
    Sili,

    Windows XP? 32-bit OS has a limit. It looks like if you have a newer machine that can do the partitioning, you can then use it in the older one (haven’t tried it myself).

  51. changeable moniker says

    Mrs M says it should have been “Ichi, ni, san, shi, let’s go everbody!”, and she has a black belt so I can’t disagree.

    Roku on!

  52. Rey Fox says

    I mean my post about Harry Potter was a joke. About the LOTR arguments recently.

    Maybe it’s time I got out of the comedy biz.

  53. frankb says

    littlejohn #27

    Is the Catholic Church right to refuse to comply with orders to provide contraception, blah, blah, blah

    That would make me so angry if they did. Employees don’t have to use that service and it is none of the employer’s business if they did. Just another example of christian love.

  54. janine says

    Also, I apologise for when Simon came along, he and I don’t talk any more.

    No need to apologize, Simon is free to comment as he wants. I just hope that you now have better people to talk to.

  57. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    I’m not sure why Walton gets such a hard time for geeking out about royal trivia. I mean, I see giving him flak for endorsing monarchy, but general royal trivia?

    Plenty of us have topics we occasionally get geeky about at length (like whoever was talking about wasps, amphibians and dinosaurs in the last thread, which frankly made my eyes glaze over, but more power to him).

    Isn’t that what the “hide comment” button is for?

    Anyway I think it’s kind of cute. I like trivia about historical figures. But maybe there’s history I’m missing here.

  58. KG says

    Hey! Congrats to JeffreyD (just noticed that one when I went back to the last thread). And hi, jamesmichaels1, welcome to TET. I’d tend to amke the reply more of a question, e.g. “How much research have you done on Islam/Scientology/the 30,000 Christian sects you don’t belong to?” But that’s just a matter of taste. If I’m ever informed that “Jesus is alive today!!”, whether in person or by a street preacher preaching to the passing multitude, I ask for his email address.

  59. says

    Mechanical engineering – gearing, levers, pulleys, whatever. Basic concepts, obviously, but even if you can’t ride bikes, you can show them how things work. Which I think would be super-awesome.

    Seconded!

    And now I’m off to bed
    Good night

    *wanna go camping wanna go camping wanna go camping*

  60. frankb says

    Dontpanic #17 made a joke of answering yes to an either or question. My family was at a restaurant when the waitstaff asked me, “soup or salad?” Super salad sounded good so I said “yes”. My wife rescued the situation.

  61. janine says

    If Walton were to start lecturing us about the proper ways to address the Koch brothers, the Du Ponts and other members of the financial elites in the US, about linage and how fucking magical it was, kristinc, I would also give him shit.

    It is not just geekery, like collecting cards; it is about celebrating an inherently unfair system. Walton claims to be human rights and claims that he finds himself inching to a more anarchist view of politics. If that is so, enough of this classist shit.

  62. janine says

    Also, kristinc, Walton has talked about the Hapsburg regaining their crown under a constitutional monarchy. And half jokingly suggested that the US adopt some stray royals.

    Walton is being very disingenuous when he suggests he should be geeky about card collecting. The card collecting does not lead people to celebrating accidents of birth.

  64. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    If Walton were to start lecturing us about the proper ways to address the Koch brothers, the Du Ponts and other members of the financial elites in the US, about linage and how fucking magical it was, kristinc, I would also give him shit.

    Yeah, and he’s done that before, but it’s not what he was just doing. He was spouting obscure trivia about historical public figures. Who cares? You could just as well justify making a fuss over someone geeking out about classic cars.

  67. dontpanic says

    Rey Fox,
    Sorry to harsh on your joke. I knew it was a joke, but I chose to answer (semi)seriously because I’m sure that very question is asked seriously by some (not necessarily here) and I gave the answer that I expect will come to pass in 40-50 years. You said “classic literature”, not “great literature”, and so I expect it to be still around and beloved (by some) when most of the other contemporaneous fiction has long been forgotten; staying power will define its ‘classic-ness’ even if people disagree about ‘quality’.

    tl;dr: yes.

  68. janine says

    Kristinc, I gave my reasons and you have not addressed them. And, yes, I am one of those radicals who wants all forms of royalty to be gone. And I see no reason to show respect for someone because they are royalty.

    And so what if Walton is not lecturing us about how to address royalty now. He has one so repeatedly in the past. You cannot just handwave that away. It is not just obscure trivia, Walton wants the rest of us to share in his belief that monarchy his magical. And, yes, he recently said that monarchy is magical.

  69. says

    How Madonna and I are alike: Both of us had random, petty internet assholes spitting their venom at us on Super Bowl day.*

    How Madonna and I are different: Income.

    *Two notes: Thank you to Walton, Classical Cipher, pteryxx, Caine, chigau, kristinc, Antiochus Epiphanes, and Tethys.

    To dontpanic – I neither know nor care who you are or why your working conditions would cause you to maliciously misrepresent and otherwise attack me in that manner. I could not care less what you think of me or my style. But know this: if you think comments like yours are going to out me off posting about any subject – corporations, animals, imperialism, industrial agriculture, inequality, epistemic ethics, or any other damn thing – you are sorely mistaken.

  70. walton says

    Janine, I really don’t want to get involved in yet another debate about the merits of monarchy. It will take over the whole thread, and I have nothing to say about it that I haven’t already said, and no desire to repeat myself. (I mention this to make clear that I’m not deliberately ignoring you; I just don’t want to discuss it here. My own views on the matter can be found at my blog, and you’re entirely welcome to respond there if you really want to argue about it.)

    I’m sorry I mentioned monarchy at all. On this occasion I was not intending to express any political opinion; I was just noting a current event of historical significance (namely, the Queen’s diamond jubilee) in which I thought some people might be interested, and KG and I were joking about it. But I’ll happily stop now and leave the subject alone.

  71. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    OK, whatever, I’m willing to accept that I just don’t see it, partly because I haven’t been here for 3 years of it and partly because … I just don’t get it.

    FWIW, yeah I would find information about the private lives of the Koch family or the Du Ponts, or the Kennedys or whoever as interesting as trivia about members of European royal families *shrug* I just fundamentally don’t stop finding people in unusual positions interesting because they happen to be privileged positions. Maybe I would after 3 years of hearing about them but I doubt it.

    Whatever, I concede, I don’t understand but I concede.

  73. says

    My previous posts on this thread got eated. Why?

    One of the them was about The Walton. Walton (hi Walton!;-) usually only talks about royalty when asked a direct question. He was asked several.

    I read the ones in the last thread, normally I skip them, but I found out some interesting things.

    I would prefer we not excise peoples most fond, arcane, knowledgeable, areas because they bore someone.

    I was Bored of the Rings, Ulysses I found to be dreck, Finnegan should beginagain, but I like trains, so I spacebar thru a lot of posts.
    +++++++++++++++
    “the remaster of Rush’s Exit…Stage Left”

    Ah, because Snagglepuss always exits stage right?
    ++++++++++++++
    “Anyone here have experience with 3TB external harddrives?”

    Yes. Don’t do that. Chances are (and I will be corrected) your puny machine can’t even partition it much less address it.

    Besides, they are untrustworthy. (At least I don’t trust them. I specify 3 1TB drives. They’re cheaper and less traumatic when they shit the bed.)
    +++++++++++++
    Jeffrey, grand news! (echoing Caine)
    ++++++++++++++
    Nerd, relatively good news! Thanks for keeping us informed.
    ++++++++++++++
    I too have an HVAC problem at work. They didn’t exactly design the system back in the day for all computers we use now. And the system has been malfunctioning for awhile.

    So now they have to go floor by floor and clean/replace the old components and set up a mini-clean room around each area they’re working in. Oh, did I mention we’re optics intensive and have to keep working thru this SNAFU?

    Luckily, (my boss hired me for a reason), I have experience.
    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
    WARNING WARNING: ROCK & ROLL STORY FOLLOWS … YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED … ENTER ALL YE WHO DARE

    On a national tour in ~1996 I worked with an international band that completely relied on bleeding edge tech. Racks of hardrives back when they were giant multiple platters you had to swap out with a handle. Digital processors in racks of heat producing chips.

    All very sensitive to heat and dust. They went under the stage. Sometimes in outdoor arenas.

    I became very adept and using visqueen, gaffer’s tape, an air conditioner and an exit fan to keep that shit cool & clean enough to do the show. I even got to run sound a bit.

  74. walton says

    To shift to an entirely different topic: John Fleming, Republican Congressman, Falls For Onion Planned Parenthood Joke

    It’s particularly amusing to me because I just mentioned this article, and the number of people who thought it was real, the other day.

    John Fleming, a GOP congressman from Louisiana, fell for a months-old joke on Monday when he cited an article from The Onion as a real news source.

    Fleming shared a link on Facebook to an article from the satirical newspaper headlined “Planned Parenthood Opens $8 Billion Abortionplex.”

    “More on Planned Parenthood, abortion by the wholesale,” he wrote.

    The GOP congressman isn’t the first to fall victim to an Onion joke. When the abortion piece was first published last year, hordes of angry Facebook users took the article at face value. In 2002, a Chinese newspaper infamously republished an Onion story about Congress demanding a new Capitol building with a retractable dome.

  75. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    I would prefer we not excise peoples most fond, arcane, knowledgeable, areas because they bore someone.

    This. I have a scroll bar and a killfile and I can use them if I get that sick of it. So many people here have the oddest and most fascinating stores of knowledge and experience — heck, there you go, look at Sailor with his stories. And Og. And neither of them (as Sailor noted) need to be asked a direct question to get them started.

  76. ChasCPeterson says

    …um… no. There isn’t actually a word spelled relic.

    that’s incorrect.
    relic
    relict

    swallow that condescending ‘…um…no’ along with your serving of crow.

  77. drbunsen le savant fou says

    Wow, an actual rockstar story. Are you at liberty to name the act in question, Sailor?

    –

    My use of LoTR and the Moorcock article was not for the purpose (on my part) of arguing that LoTR is crap, but to illustrate something about writing and textual analysis. LoTR was just the example.

    Full disclosure: I read LoTR in my early teens, loved it, and re-read it every few years after that, sometimes annually. After skipping a few years, I picked it up again more recently and made it about halfway through. It bored me witless, to whit – enough with the bloody walking already! Something changed, and it wasn’t the text.

    I’ll get around to a more coherent argument at some point, but for now, just this:

    I think (and Moorcock implies) that JRRT’s somewhat limited worldview (to a reader from a 21st century multicultural city of 4 million) and (as walton described) political naivety – is intimately connected to the (IMHO) banality of his writing. It’s not propaganda, nor is it a misreading of the text; it’s that the (relatively) privileged worldview of JRRT is so taken for granted, so assumed to be the norm – so unquestioned by the writer – that it becomes a part of the bedrock of the writing – and that to a reader from outside (or from an awareness of) that privilege, it simply rings false, grates, and irritates – like the “physics” of Star Trek might irritate anyone with a passing familiarity with actual science.

    Moorcock does a far better job of articulating that irritation – at style, content and politics – than I was able. Fiction is ultimately about people (or, yanno, elves n shit) – and an understanding of people and how they work that draws from such a limited world must lead to limitations in the text.

    But again – LoTR was just the example. I tried earlier to use Illuminatus and Foucault’s Pendulum to illustrate what I was (and still am) stumbling towards.

    Ender’s Game: repeatedly recommended to me as OMG best book evar must read! I read it, thought it was pretty good, for what it was, certainly not “the best ever” – but again, vaguely irritating for reasons I couldn’t put my finger on. The feminist(?) analysis which was posted here a while back (after one of Card’s outbreaks of public hate speech) – of Ender, not as a victim or a hero, but a self-centered bully – really opened my eyes. I ought to dig it out and have another go at it in that new light.

    And one of these days, have a go at Ulysses, or at least Finnegan’s Wake (by a roundabout coincidence, Robert Anton Wilson’s favourite book).

  78. janine says

    Use your own advice, kristinc, and scroll past my comments when I point out to Walton, yet again, that his monarchy obsession contradicts his advocacy of human rights and anarchism.

  79. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    February fucking sucks.

    I hate everything about it. I hate the sickening mud-weather, and I hate how nature constantly reminds us that “Spring is JUST around the corner…. OOPS SURPRISE SNOWSTORM FOLLOWED BY RAIN! Hahaha!” There’s just something in the air that makes people feel unpleasant and unpleasant to be around too much.

    I especially hate the fact that it’s almost impossible to hate February and especially the 14th without people assuming it’s because you’re some bitter lonely asshole, and that as soon as you find a sweetie you’ll love it like everyone else.

    Bullshit, says I. Even if I believed in soulmates and found mine, I’d still find VD-day an infantile meaningless stupid holiday.

    But…

    This unnaturally warm, springlike weather over the past few days has ensured that this is literally THE least shitty february of my life, at least within memory. So far.

    Feels good, man.

  80. Rey Fox says

    I too missed my comedic beat, sigh.

    We’re both going to need to drown our sorrows in some Patton Oswalt.

  81. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    Except you pointed out no such thing, janine. You went UGGGGGHHHH WALTON IS TALKING ABOUT SOMETHING I DON’T LIIIIIIIIIKE. Prompting my questions.

  85. janine says

    There is a history here, kristinc. This is not just me picking on Walton out off the blue.

    You went UGGGGGHHHH I DO NOT KNOW THE HISTORY HERE AND I WILL TELL YOU HOW TO ACT.

    Prompting my reaction.

    (Care to play this some more? I don’t.)

  86. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    Jeezus, janine. Yes I did inquire about the history. Yes I did say I didn’t see a difference between Walton’s quirky obsession and the quirky obsessions of several other regulars. And then I explicitly conceded the point since obviously there was something going on I didn’t fully understand, but that wasn’t enough for you.

    I’ve gotten the answer loud and clear now: Walton’s quirky obsession is one that you, personally, don’t care for, and there is No Questioning Allowed Of Your Supreme Ruling. Enough already. I hear you.

  87. changeable moniker says

    Oh, as usual, I’m posting in the middle of a flamewar.

    Umberto Eco:

    “I could write the political history of those years based on how Red Label gradually gave way to twelve-year-old Ballantine and then to single malt”

    Subtle bastard, him. ;)

  88. Part-Time Insomniac, Zombie Porcupine Nox Arcana Fan says

    Can’t quite escape the V-Day shit. We’re having a party in class that day, and I think lots of kids are expecting get at least one valentine, plus candy. If J says anything, I’m telling him, “Save it for my birthday, if I can manage to meet up again that week.”
    —————————————-

    Daisy Cutter: Mom has a high threshold when it comes to pain, but this had her in tears. I don’t know what, aside from painkillers and being careful about moving around and sitting, would be suggested. The pain’s not as bad, although I’m not sure if that’s the Percocet or if her body is fixing the problem on its own.
    —————————————-

    So, after much consideration, I think I’ll skip the “wait until you’re good enough to perform live” part and just get a new guitar. Taylor is one brand I’m familiar with, but how does it it compare to, say, Gibson or Epiphone? Mind you, we’re talking about acoustic guitars, not electric.
    —————————————

    Christ, paranormal romance seems like a niche market. Maybe I should shelve my latest short story for another time. It’s not all about the romance, but towards the end there is a shift in that direction.
    ————————————–

    Um . . . snargle?

    Yeah, I got nothing.

  89. janine says

    Walton’s quirky obsession is one that you, personally, don’t care for, and there is No Questioning Allowed Of Your Supreme Ruling.

    Why, yes, I make it a habit to run roughshod over people here.

    It was not because you questioned me. It is because you dismissed Walton’s intellectual blind spot as a charming quirk and told me how I should handle this.

    (Great, I see you want to play this.)

  90. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    I dunno, I think a paranormal romance with a werewolf (think Wolf from ‘The Talisman’ though) could be entertaining.

    “Oh, that’s a gorgeous dog you have there! And so unique looking!”

    “That’s my boyfriend!”

    And we could have a scene for the trailer where she tells him off for bringing her half a dead bird, so next time he brings her a human arm instead.

    And think of all the butt-hair jokes!

    It could be the greatest romantic comedy ever.

  91. says

    PTI: If your mom’s pain seems to be resolving on its own, that sounds like a good sign. Mine was horrendous and continually worsening, so I had laparoscopic surgery. That was more than a decade ago, and while my back will never be what it used to be, I’ve been free of any truly debilitating pain.

    *

    The House of Lords has dismissed calls for Alan Turing to be posthumously pardoned because, basically, at the time he was convicted, being gay was a crime. WTF.

  92. Rey Fox says

    Christ, paranormal romance seems like a niche market.

    A lucrative niche market! Or I dunno, it might be in its waning days by now.

  93. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Rey Fox: I’m gonna make a prediction.

    I predict that, like in the waning days of the Universal monster movies, we’ll start seeing more and more goofy parody and outright monster comedy featuring our perennial favorites, the Vampires, werewolves, and zombies. It’s already kinda starting with the zombies.

  97. walton says

    kristinc, it’s ok. For what it’s worth, I understand Janine’s point of view and the reasons for it. Plenty of people on the left would argue that monarchy is a relic of a long history of class hierarchy, racism, imperialism and institutionalized state violence. And that the ceremony and ritual surrounding monarchy is just a propagandistic way of dressing up the reality of authoritarian state power, and that showing deference to royalty is a degrading act of submission to an unjustly-privileged ruling class. (Which is not necessarily an unfair judgment, if one wants to look at it that way; though of course no nation-state, including those which are republics, comes out looking terribly good if one looks at its history.) And on that basis they tend to consider monarchy (even a powerless symbolic monarchy) to be a living reminder of oppression, and would prefer it to be abolished. All of that is an entirely reasonable point of view, and one for which I understand the reasons. I personally disagree with that view, but I just don’t really want to argue about it now; I’ve done so in the past, ad nauseam, filling several threads, and I don’t think I have much to say that I haven’t already said before.

    ===

    I think (and Moorcock implies) that JRRT’s somewhat limited worldview (to a reader from a 21st century multicultural city of 4 million) and (as walton described) political naivety – is intimately connected to the (IMHO) banality of his writing. It’s not propaganda, nor is it a misreading of the text; it’s that the (relatively) privileged worldview of JRRT is so taken for granted, so assumed to be the norm – so unquestioned by the writer – that it becomes a part of the bedrock of the writing – and that to a reader from outside (or from an awareness of) that privilege, it simply rings false, grates, and irritates – like the “physics” of Star Trek might irritate anyone with a passing familiarity with actual science.

    Yes, and I think you’re being markedly fairer to Tolkien than Moorcock was. Pointing out that he was relatively privileged and utterly politically naive is entirely fair criticism, and I think it’s true that this showed through in his work. I’d add that he was also particularly prudish and conservative when it came to sexuality, even by the standards of his generation, and this is likewise something that shows through in everything he wrote, without his intention. But I can’t help liking LOTR nonetheless; I’ve loved it since childhood, and it’s hard not to admire the sheer feat of creative imagination that it represents.

    I’ve had the experience you describe – loving a book as a child, but finding it banal and grating as an adult – much more with C.S. Lewis than with Tolkien. With Lewis, his books become tiresome once it becomes apparent that he’s preaching at us, and, for that matter, preaching a set of dogmas with which I vehemently disagree. It’s a shame, because I do think Lewis was a talented writer, no less so than Tolkien; but I find his dogmatism irritating, and his characters to be annoying one-dimensional caricatures rather than realistic people. (Much like Ayn Rand, although Lewis was a far better writer than Rand when it came to crafting prose; Atlas Shrugged is doubly annoying, both for the political preachiness and for the turgid writing.)

    Ender’s Game: repeatedly recommended to me as OMG best book evar must read! I read it, thought it was pretty good, for what it was, certainly not “the best ever” – but again, vaguely irritating for reasons I couldn’t put my finger on. The feminist(?) analysis which was posted here a while back (after one of Card’s outbreaks of public hate speech) – of Ender, not as a victim or a hero, but a self-centered bully – really opened my eyes. I ought to dig it out and have another go at it in that new light.

    Interesting that you should mention this. I read Ender’s Game, found it dull and distasteful, and never finished it. But I read it in my late teens; I suspect people who read it as children or young teens probably had a different initial take. (Which, in turn, makes me wonder how my feelings towards Tolkien or Lewis might differ if I hadn’t read both authors in early childhood.)

  98. janine says

    Thank you, Walton, that was very fair. Which is why I do not understand your fascination with protocol and titles.

  99. Dr. Audley Z. Darkheart, liar and scoundrel says

    Did somebody say “zombies”?

    TLC:

    It’s already kinda starting with the zombies.

    A bit, yes. But the satirical Z films (Zombieland, Shaun of the Dead, Undead, for example) have been good zombie flicks in their own right.

    But, then again, that might just be really good satire. :p

  100. Tethys says

    Christ, paranormal romance seems like a niche market

    **cough, cough, Jesus, cough, Mithras, cough, cough, Leda, cough**

  101. walton says

    The House of Lords has dismissed calls for Alan Turing to be posthumously pardoned because, basically, at the time he was convicted, being gay was a crime. WTF.

    A slight correction: it’s not the House of Lords that made the decision. The power to pardon is a Crown prerogative power exercised, in practice, by the Secretary of State for Justice. (Much like in the US, where it’s an executive power exercised by the President.) It seems the government has decided not to go ahead with the pardon, and Lord McNally (who is a Liberal Democrat junior minister at the Ministry of Justice, and probably didn’t make the decision personally) announced it in the House of Lords on behalf of the government.

    Obviously it’s a terrible decision, but we’re used to that in British politics. (Our present government is an utter clusterfuck, and generally seems to invent policy on the spur of the moment without bothering to think it through; see, for instance, Andrew Lansley’s plans to redesign the NHS, which appear to have been drawn up over lunch on the back of a napkin, and are currently being reviewed after people who actually work in the NHS pointed out how idiotic they were. Meanwhile, the Leader of the Opposition is busy waging a one-man war against the scourge of cut-price Terry’s Chocolate Oranges.)

  102. Richard Austin says

    I liked Illuminatus! precisely because it’s pretty universal in pushing as many triggers as possible, regardless of who you are or your socioeconomic background. That’s kind of the point of the book, but I admit it’s for a limited audience.

    … I should also mention that I read Lord of the Rings for the first time in my twenties one Saturday. Er, yes, one Saturday, as in, I started around 9 am and finished that evening, only stopping briefly for bio breaks*. Whether you like it or not, its impact on the genre of fantasy can’t be denied; from that aspect alone, it’s a significant book. Hell, half of D&D is taken from Tolkien’s versions of traditional fantasy elements, and most computer games are based on the D&D model nowadays.

    * I then read The Silmarillion the following day. I read fast.

  104. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    Hi right back atcha, jamesmichaels1. :)
    –
    walton’s royalty fan-clubbing irks me less than some others’ burning passions; I just scroll past.

    Let no one, however, diss tabletop RPGs, or cozy up to the Horses!
    ;)

    (Full disclosure: I geek out over ancient Egyptian royalty (without endorsing a return to monarchy in Egypt)(in any way), as The Husband has learned to his sorrow. I’ve also been known to geek out over English royalty (ending at about House of Hanover time, at which point I lose interest)(though I make an exception for Anno Dracula). I’ve always thought of it as being more on par with a mania for baseball statistics.)
    –

    But that’s just a matter of taste. If I’m ever informed that “Jesus is alive today!!”, whether in person or by a street preacher preaching to the passing multitude, I ask for his email address.

    And has The Big J no Facebook account?!?
    *tsk*

    (Or…maybe he (excuse me; I do mean ‘He’) just hasn’t Friended you….)
    –

    I was Bored of the Rings,[…]

    But…but…Bored of the Rings is awesome!!!

    “And since that day it’s said by all
    In ballad, lay and poem,
    ‘Only trust an elf or dwarf
    As far as you can throw ’em!'”

    Epic! *sigh*
    –

    I would prefer we not excise peoples most fond, arcane, knowledgeable, areas because they bore someone.

    Me three!
    –

  105. Tethys says

    I’ve always been a voracious reader, and I’m a huge mythology geek. I found Tolkien to be somewhat tedious. I enjoyed his books but they were always a bit of a slog for me.

    I remember reading this series by Susan Cooper as a child and really enjoying it.

    The Dark is Rising

  106. Part-Time Insomniac, Zombie Porcupine Nox Arcana Fan says

    Tethys: Jesus in paranormal romance? Been done, I’m sure, and well, how interesting can that be made anyway? At least with the Devil you could have a bit more fun regarding what he can get up to, without his dad peering through the keyhole, or from the roof.

  107. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    I studied Greek mythology in my 5th grade Waldorf class, which was an idyllic year for me, and I studied it in beautiful books of a kind I had never before seen in a school, so it’s sort of forever burned in my mind as something to think of fondly. Even though most of those guys were complete assholes, and the Greek culture that even my little 5th grade self was exposed to was horrific with regards to women and, you know, anyone not a free Greek dude.

  108. Tethys says

    Tethys: Jesus in paranormal romance?

    I was referring to Jesus being the product of a paranormal romance,(using a patriarchal value of romance) and getting a good chuckle out of the niche market comment.

    Paranormal romance, mythic journeys, dysfunctional families, and war seem to be timeless themes.

  110. Part-Time Insomniac, Zombie Porcupine Nox Arcana Fan says

    I was referring to Jesus being the product of a paranormal romance,(using a patriarchal value of romance) and getting a good chuckle out of the niche market comment.

    Paranormal romance, mythic journeys, dysfunctional families, and war seem to be timeless themes.

    Ah gotcha. Now that you mention it, can Christian romance books be classified as an extension of the paranormal romance market? Or is that reaching?

    As to the second part of your post, I’d guess this comes from most people being familiar with most, if not all, of those themes.

  112. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    Ah gotcha. Now that you mention it, can Christian romance books be classified as an extension of the paranormal romance market? Or is that reaching?

    And where does the fang-porn come in? Supernatural romances seem to always turn into fang-porn, these days.

    Hmm…maybe there’s something to be done with that whole Satan tempting Jesus in the desert thing?
    –

  113. Ray, rude-ass yankee says

    Dhorvath, OM@94, It might be, but what do I know about that? I’m married. I know, I know, something about “marriage, you’re doing it wrong”.

    I need to join the non-comedian club, I guess

  114. janine says

    If only monarchies were just stories that people told each other, kristinc, a relic of a distant past, like the Olympian gods.

    At no point will I ever say it is a good idea to just gloss over history that I do not like, I would have to dismiss 99.99999999999% of history.

  116. says

    DrBunsen:

    the (relatively) privileged worldview of JRRT is so taken for granted, so assumed to be the norm – so unquestioned by the writer – that it becomes a part of the bedrock of the writing – and that to a reader from outside (or from an awareness of) that privilege, it simply rings false, grates, and irritates

    Indeed. But may I remind you of your own privilege? You didn’t have to learn to either get past that or give up reading for pleasure – as women readers must perforce from the age of, oh, 6. We’ve had *lots* of practice in appreciating the merits of privileged writing, while setting aside the privilege to a low background hum.

  121. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    omfg lice. Younger kid was at her friend’s house today, and despite my instructions they traded clothes, and when she came home the kid complained suddenly of itching and I found two adult lice on her, but no nits or eggs.

    Come to find out, the friend had lice about a month ago, which they claim to have treated, but I think they still have an active case over there. It may even have been where our family originally got the lice from!

    Commencing sanitizing procedures AGAIN. For those playing along at home this is time #4. I hadn’t even worked through the backlog of garbage bagged, washable clothes from the last go-through.

  122. Part-Time Insomniac, Zombie Porcupine Nox Arcana Fan says

    Damn, those lice are tough little fuckers. I’m glad that I’ve never had to deal with them so far. Stay sane, kristinc.
    ——————————-

    Just ordered a couple of shirts from that store linked to a while back, in support of Jessica Ahlquist. I was assured there would be no indication on the package that the order was connected to the JA College Fund. Since I’m having them deliver to my workplace, that’s a huge relief for me.

  124. Nutmeg says

    Tethys: The Dark is Rising was my absolute favourite between ages 9 and 12. It’s still one of my favourites – the entire series is on my bookshelf, even though I’m 23 and far too old for kids’ books.

    I hate the idea that we’re ever too old for kids’ books. The ones that are actually good will still be good when we’re adults.

    (Oh dear, I’ve strayed into the discussion of what makes a book good. Abort!)

    kristinc: That’s very frustrating about the lice. Have a pumpkin chocolate chip cookie (linky: http://allrecipes.com/recipe/pumpkin-chocolate-chip-cookies-iii/ ) to take your mind off things.

  125. Nutmeg says

    I like the “This is what a scientist looks like” tumblr. Sure, I sometimes wear a lab coat and gloves. But more often, I wear jeans and a T-shirt, or chestwaders and a backpack, or camouflage, or a ski jacket, or a skirt and heels.

    Unfortunately, it’ll take more than a tumblr to change the public perception of science as “big scary work done by nerds in lab coats”. But it’s a nice tumblr anyway.

  129. Nutmeg says

    Chigau: Which one? Well, yes to all, I guess. Except maybe the skirt and heels, that’s a pretty rare occurrence.

  130. says

    Ing I snortled.
    +++++++++++++++++++
    Lab safety:
    DANGER LASER RADIATION! Avoid direct exposure to the beam!
    “Please, sit here and stare directly into this laser. Now, don’t blink.”

    “Never stare into a laser with your remaining good eye.”

    “Of course this isn’t an animal lab!
    We use grad students, they’re cheaper and we don’t have to feed them.”

  134. says

    @Ibyea

    I copied it for a game I’m running…it’s the standard warning a teleporter gives commuters.

    I think that makes it more disturbing than it’s original context.

  137. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    [last version TET]

    @ Ms Daisy Cutter 618

    It’s not that conservatives used to be environmentalists; it’s that environmentalism used to be conservative. It arose out of the desire of elites to keep their hunting playgrounds pristine.

    Oh. On the other hand, some small amount of good ever did come of the GOP. My mistake is to assume that they are heading into the moral and ethical gutter in linear fashion. I have thus tried extrapolating back to an Arcadian Age in which they might have come across as marginally tolerable.

    [this version TET]

    @ James 45

    Also, I apologise for when Simon came along, he and I don’t talk any more.

    You are not responsible for other peoples’ actions. You are welcome here. Shout if I (we) can pass you more ammunition.

    ….

    Lawdy but I love me Korean food. Is kimchi addictive? Alternatively, if I stop eating the stuff, will my life still be so wonderfull?

  138. Nutmeg says

    Chigau: Again, everything but the skirt and heels. There’s a picture somewhere, but all you’d see is a little pale face staring out from under many many layers of clothing and gear.

    The life of a grad student is indeed glamourous.

  139. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    I can’t stand it. I can’t fucking stand it. How many stupid D00D men in the “skeptical community” have to turn out to be raving frat boy misogynists? Does it EVER end?

    FUCK YOU PENN JILLETTE.

  140. firstapproximation says

    Hello all. Yes, I’m still alive. Been busy.

    Anyway, I read this interesting article in the New York Times: ‘We the People’ Loses Appeal With People Around the World. Since we’ve had discussions here before about whether there should be a new US constitution (mostly theoretical, since it probably won’t happen any time soon), I thought I’d share it.

    The rights guaranteed by the American Constitution are parsimonious by international standards, and they are frozen in amber. As Sanford Levinson wrote in 2006 in “Our Undemocratic Constitution,” “the U.S. Constitution is the most difficult to amend of any constitution currently existing in the world today.”

    Other nations routinely trade in their constitutions wholesale, replacing them on average every 19 years. By odd coincidence, Thomas Jefferson, in a 1789 letter to James Madison, once said that every constitution “naturally expires at the end of 19 years” because “the earth belongs always to the living generation.” These days, the overlap between the rights guaranteed by the Constitution and those most popular around the world is spotty.

    Canadians should celebrate:

    Mr. Barak, for his part, identified a new constitutional superpower: “Canadian law,” he wrote, “serves as a source of inspiration for many countries around the world.” The new study also suggests that the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, adopted in 1982, may now be more influential than its American counterpart.

  141. ibyea says

    @1st Approximation
    I just read part of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. Woah, it is certainly more impressive than the American bill of rights. Canada is freaking awesome.

  142. says

    Good morning
    Today, 50 years ago a mine near here exploded and 299 miners died. At that time, it was thought to be the safest mine around, even now nobody knows how it could have happened.
    Explains why my gran forbid my grandpa to work extra hours. She said that the money wasn’t worth her worrying if he was working late or dead.
    And in the year 2012, we close the last mine here, where for years now there weren’t any serious accidents and import cheap coal from China and Russia, where children dig it out and where regularly people die.*

    Dhorvath

    February is great for fucking. Oh wait, that’s not what that sentence meant.

    Your boy was born in November?

    *Yes, I know, we need to stop burning coal. We’re not going to achieve that tomorrow, so until we achieve that I’d rather not have people dying

  143. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Josh

    PENN JILLETTE.

    Yeah, he is a real loose cannon. If it was up to me, I’d throw him overboard “lock, stock and barrel”.

    (PS: You have email)

    @ firstapproximation

    Thanks for the linky. It would seem, as you say, that the US constitution is well passed its sell-by-date. It is smelling iffy. (And it has NEVER guaranteed basic human rights.)

  144. ibyea says

    @Josh
    He was a libertarian moron from the beginning. I am not surprised that he would go that way.

  145. Beatrice, anormalement indécente says

    It’s not appropriate in the Worst valentines thread so I’ll comment here – thanks pelamun for linking to Zehn kleine Jägermeister song!

    I haven’t heard it since high school. We only understood bits and pieces, but it never stopped us from singing. *fond memories*

  146. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    God, another Underworld movie.

    As a werewolf afficianado, I have to say the werewolves in the Underworld series were incredibly goofy looking. Why did they have to have those deformed looking weasel-heads and stupid flat faces? Why did most of them exist just to have their heads ripped off by stupid willowy vampires?

    Say what you want about Van Helsing, at least the three werewolves portrayed in that one look completely different from each other. I hate when werewolf movies with multiple lycanthropes have them all transform into identical wolves.

    Can’t I get a werewolf movie where the werewolves reflect their human forms? At least a little variety? I wanna see blonde people turn into blonde wolves, I wanna see fat people turn into fat wolves, and I wanna see bald people turn into mostly hairless wolves.

    Wouldn’t that be more interesting than this Underworld shit?

  147. drbunsen le savant fou says

    All of that is an entirely reasonable point of view, and one for which I understand the reasons. I personally disagree with that view

    I am well aware of the bounty of evidence for evolution, and the complete lack of evidence for creation; I simply choose to believe what I believe.
    .

    Paranormal romance, mythic journeys, dysfunctional families, and war seem to be timeless themes.

    The Brothers Karamazov’s Twilight Journey to the Western Front. Coming soon.
    .

    Alethea H. Claw:

    Indeed. But may I remind you of your own privilege? You didn’t have to learn to either get past that or give up reading for pleasure – as women readers must perforce from the age of, oh, 6.

    Yes, you may. /bows

    Related: did you read any John Wyndham as a youngster, and if so, how do you feel about the proposition that he wrote “strong female characters”?
    .

    Part-Time Insomniac:

    Just ordered a couple of shirts / in support of Jessica Ahlquist. I was assured there would be no indication on the package that the order was connected to the JA College Fund. Since I’m having them deliver to my workplace, that’s a huge relief for me.

    That this should be necessary is enormously sad :(

  148. drbunsen le savant fou says

    Ms. Daisy Cutter, Space Stallions is simply the greatest achievement of human artistry ever and anyone who denies it is a fool. I would pay cash monies for an ongoing series.

    I mean, how can you fail with a keytar-sword?

  149. says

    I ♥ janine.

    As to “Evil little thing” t-shirts, I ordered a couple, only to be told that they couldn’t calculate my postage since it’s out of the US. They eventually sent me a link with the postage, but the only option to pay this was via creating a PayPal account, which I wasn’t prepared to do. So no business for them, and no shirts for me. Seems silly, in 2012.

  153. birgerjohansson says

    The American Injustice System
    https://proxy.freethought.online/dispatches/2012/02/06/the-american-injustice-system/
    Next time someone says “but Obama has been doing so much good” introduce them to this link. It made me swear out loud.
    — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — —
    Kropotkin did a genuine service for geographic science during his youth. He did not need any feudal titles.
    .
    The Swedish prince Sigvard Bernadotte (1907 -2002) lost his title after marrying a commoner. He went on to make a name for himself in industrial design and illustration. During his last years he tried to regain his prince title since our current top bloke married a commoner without losing his title.
    K bloke refused, which is one of many reasons I hold him (the K bloke, not Sigvard) in very low esteem. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Count_Sigvard_Bernadotte_of_Wisborg
    — — — — — — — — — — — — — — —
    Spider-pig parodies better than new Spider-man trailer? http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/02/07/spider-pig-parodies-spider-man-trailer_n_1259275.html?ref=uk
    Dead Man Found In Foreclosed Home 4 Years After Suicide
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/06/david-carter-dead-suicide_n_1258367.html

  154. birgerjohansson says

    The most remarkable karate superpower of all is the ability to make your 20 enemies attack you one at a time.

  155. Weed Monkey says

    ibyea:

    Say, anyone from Finland here? I want to know whether Finland’s conservatives being elected is a good thing or not

    First of all, presidential powers have been severely diluted in recent decades, to the point it’s more of a ceremonial post.

    Niinistö (and the whole Coalition party) is a centre-right liberal conservative, not a far-right raving maniac. His expertise is generally considered to be finance, and he served as Finance Minister 1996-2003, after which he became vice-chairman at the European Investment Bank. His dedication to things like human rights remains to be seen.

    So I’m not afraid, just disappointed. We had a chance to elect a Green peacemaker, we got the banker instead.

  157. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    Took Wife (and Girl) out to dinner last night. Because Girl is vegan, we decided to go to one of the mid-scale chains as they are usually pretty accommodating for different diets. We went to TGIFridays. Big mistake. Girl ended up ordering some sides. That was about it. For Pete’s sake, they can’t even toss a package of black bean burgers in the freezer for the occasional vegan?

    I asked about their beer selection (bottled). The response? “We have Miller, Miller Light, Budweiser, Bud Platinum, Coors, Coors Light . . . .” While the waitstaff was recited this list, Girl was almost in tears trying not to laugh. I finally got an admission that they had Yeungling, so I got a bottle of their lager. When the coast was clear, I asked Girl why she was trying not to laugh. She told me that the look on my face, as the waitstaff listed the beers, was priceless — I looked like I had swallowed a sour mouse.

    The food was mediocre. The service was good. The beer was expensive (holy crap! Four bucks for a bottle of Yeungling? A six-pack is only $5.99! And a four-pack of Tadcaster is only $11.99!). We shant return.

    My family was at a restaurant when the waitstaff asked me, “soup or salad?” Super salad sounded good so I said “yes”.

    I always have to fight down the urge to reply ‘yes’ when I am aked, “Is that for here, or to go?” I am not always successful.

    relic
    relict

    Shit. And I even checked (though I didn’t check Wikipedia, I checked an old dictionary.

    Not that I was right (I was actually wrong in what I though ‘relic’ was), but I’ll definately forget this again in the future.

    Ender’s Game

    I still think the original short story is best.

    walton’s royalty fan-clubbing irks me less than some others’ burning passions;

    Which is why I preface all Fire Stories with a warning.

    For those playing along at home this is time #4.

    Fourth times a charm?

    Grad Student: Isn’t this dangerous?
    Sailor: I’m wearing goggles

    Grad Student: Yeah, but what about me?
    Sailor: You’re here to learn, right?

  158. carlie says

    Blog plug: I’ve recently discovered Captain Awkward, and it is fantabulous.* Today’s entry on strength pretty much made me cry, and a couple of days ago there was one with a Gotye video. :)
    It’s written as a general advice blog, but with super good actual advice.

    *apologies if it was already here that I found it from

  161. Psych-Oh says

    Carlie – that’s a fun column. I wonder if the writer’s had any success with screenplays.

    Laughing Coyote – I can’t take those Underworld movies. If the hubby wants to watch them, he is on his own.

  162. walton says

    It’s helpful that at the same time Crommunist is posting about Islamophobia, StevoR is offering such a perfect illustration on the “Say what, Ron Paul?” thread.

    Ugh. I just visited that thread.

    He seems to have a bizarre fetish for violence. This is the same guy who was advocating the death penalty on another recent thread. I don’t know what it is that makes him so eager for the state to kill more people.

  163. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Josh, Official SpokesGay, seconded @ #139. Not incidentally, I am presently wondering about how you as a gay man feel about the standard defence of douchebag as an insult.

    I’m bothered by it.

    Also, I feel that I’m somehow doing something wrong by even stating my opinion, my feelings on the matter. I don’t think I’ve ever been dismissed out of hand here at Pharyngula for expressing my feelings or opinions as a gay man (that is, from my perspective as a gay man), and it hasn’t happened at Blag Hag as of writing this post, but something makes me feel guilty or wrong somehow about even posting anything like that. As though, I guess, my experiences shouldn’t really matter. It’s irrational, of course, here, but it has happened elsewhere.

    Gosh, I hope that even makes sense. Anyhow, how do you feel about that and do you ever marginalise yourself because of some nagging feeling that somehow you’re afraid that others might dismiss your experience as a gay man out of hand? It’s just something that I worry about every time I post something like what I posted at that link.

  164. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Questions are also extended to other queers. I’m just most familiar with Josh, Official SpokesGay.

  165. walton says

    All of that is an entirely reasonable point of view, and one for which I understand the reasons. I personally disagree with that view

    I am well aware of the bounty of evidence for evolution, and the complete lack of evidence for creation; I simply choose to believe what I believe.

    Eh… no, I do have reasons for rejecting that view. I just don’t want to go into them now, because I don’t want this to turn into another Monarchy Thread, and there are more important things to discuss.

  166. says

    Hey does anyone remember which recent thread had a link to a Xian-Right type guy who made hilariously OTT paintings depicting Obama throwing money on the ground and “the forgotten man” sulking on a park bench?

  169. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    Fuck Penn Jillette indeed.
    :(
    –

    Which is why I preface all Fire Stories with a warning.

    There may be those who really appreciate this courtesy, though I’ve yet to find one of your Fire Stories annoying or dull. :)

    (Do I need to start including an “Execration of Horses Warning” where appropriate? Maybe a “Post of Righteous Loathing of Peas”? What say you, oh Reading Public?)
    –

    Grad Student: Isn’t this dangerous?
    Sailor: I’m wearing goggles

    Grad Student: Yeah, but what about me?
    Sailor: You’re here to learn, right?

    Experienced Thief : “Hey, kid, check that door for traps.”
    –

  170. carlie says

    Thomathy – your link doesn’t work. :(

    I’m interested in what you’re trying to get across, because I don’t know of any intersectionality at all between douchebags and gay men (disclaimer: I’m not a gay man). A priori, the term is used because douches are something marketed at women by telling them that their bodies are unclean and gross and needing of improvement, and therefore unequivocally a Bad Thing to be. I’ve never really liked the term or word itself just from an aesthetic standpoint, but as gendered insults are culled they have to be replaced with something, and that’s one that fits the bill. So I’d be interested in your link whereupon you discuss it more.

  173. birgerjohansson says

    ” I read Ender’s Game, found it dull and distasteful, and never finished it”

    But the following trilogy, with the group mind of the surviving insectimorph alien species is fairly good.

    — — — — — — —
    “The Dark is Rising was my absolute favourite between ages 9 and 12”
    And try John Bellairs “The Face in the Frost”

  177. says

    ” I read Ender’s Game, found it dull and distasteful, and never finished it”

    I only hate Enders Game mostly because Scotty boy spent so much time removing the ambiguity of the ethics and cheer leading the genocide. Not only is it a ra ra ra for abuse and (a)moral relativism but it’s insulting that Card frankly doesn’t trust the reader enough to judge the situation on their own. Although I guess he apparently was right since I figure most people believe what was done to Ender and what Ender did were horrible atrocities rather than tough love.

  178. carlie says

    Thomathy – ah. My reaction was the same as Sas, that I automatically refer to what you described as an enema.

  179. says

    Josh, a friend of mine had to stop watching Bullshit! after the episode on taxes, in which Penn & Teller invited Grover Norquist on as a “moderate.”

    Firstapproximation, that’s an interesting article. And it reminds me of this one that appeared in the Boston Sunday Globe: “Can censorship help heal Rwanda?” In short, the country’s doing much better than most people would have expected less than 20 years after the genocide, but there are strict laws against criticizing the government and discussing ethnicity. The argument is made that freedom of speech in the U.S. sense is quite ahistorical and may not be practical in all countries, but the reporter ends on an ambiguous note.

    Rev. BDC, Handel’s resignation has a distinct flavor of BAAAWWWW.

  181. says

    Also, look what Marcus Ranum made me do….

    You’re the top!
    You’re a New Age slurry,
    Full of slop
    Like a sewage curry
    You’re a gullible twit consuming shit and woo,
    You’re a quack’s favorite mark,
    Content in the dark,
    You sucker, you.

    You believe
    All you hear on “Oprah”
    You’re a dweeb,
    You are Depak Chopra.
    Your ability to reason is a flop,
    But, baby, you’re not the bottom — you’re the top!

  182. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Hmm …fascinating. I wonder how this will play out. Am I just whiny, or does the fact that in my community we use the word douche matter at all? I mean, if we’re talking about context and if words are supposed to have larger cultural meanings, I should really expect that my perspective should be respected and I don’t really think that I’m being very controversial in suggesting that there’s a better excuse to use douche as an insult considering> my perspective.

    If it even matters, my experience is hardly isolated to myself as Dan Savage also refers to it as douching and also uses it as an insult for the very reasons I do and he even defends against the use in relation to women just as I do. Clearly, if such a popular public figure is using the word, it’s hardly uncommon in the vocabulary of very many people. But my point is to illustrate that my use of the term is hardly unique to me, not to engage in some argument from authority.

    In any case, whether what I describe is automatically thought of as an enema by you, doesn’t change the fact that it’s largely understood to be douching, so I have to wonder what it says that someone has to write, ‘It may have less to do with dismissing the experiences of gay men and anal aficionados and more to do with the common use of the term “enema” for anal rinsing.’ I mean, it’s not obviously true that enema is the more common term. In fact, I would argue that it’s not. Perhaps there’s a blind spot there. I’m not surprised, but I’d rather see some thoughtful response rather than, ‘That’s not my experience, so …’.

  184. Happiestsadist says

    Thomathy: I’d always heard that specifically referred to as an enema as well. The moar I know!

    I like the term as an insult myself, but then I only was aware of the term as applied to a useless product sold to remove the vagina-ness from icky, scary vaginas.

  186. says

    For Penn and Teller Bullshit the straw for me was the realization that Scientology and Islam were too big and scary to go after! But we’re fine bitching about how cripples get special parking spots and how it’s SUCH an unfair burden to put on businesses to accommodate a guy in a chair.

    Not just assholish, but cowardly.

  187. Happiestsadist says

    Thomathy: I definitely did not mean to sound like I was discounting your own experience! Though I as a not-male buttsex fan have never come across the term, that doesn’t mean it’s uncommon or not an equally valid meaning for the term.

  188. says

    If it even matters, my experience is hardly isolated to myself as Dan Savage also refers to it as douching and also uses it as an insult for the very reasons I do and he even defends against the use in relation to women just as I do. Clearly, if such a popular public figure is using the word, it’s hardly uncommon in the vocabulary of very many people. But my point is to illustrate that my use of the term is hardly unique to me, not to engage in some argument from authority.

    In any case, whether what I describe is automatically thought of as an enema by you, doesn’t change the fact that it’s largely understood to be douching, so I have to wonder what it says that someone has to write, ‘It may have less to do with dismissing the experiences of gay men and anal aficionados and more to do with the common use of the term “enema” for anal rinsing.’ I mean, it’s not obviously true that enema is the more common term. In fact, I would argue that it’s not. Perhaps there’s a blind spot there. I’m not surprised, but I’d rather see some thoughtful response rather than, ‘That’s not my experience, so …’.

    Interesting. Will consider.

  189. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Happiestsadist, I’m starting to become bewildered at the lack of knowledge of language use that I find commonplace. I know I’m a gay man, living in a gay community and I have a deep, scholarly fascination with language, but douche as used to describe anal cleansing is not so niche as to be not encountered virtually anywhere in the English speaking world. I find this very odd.

  190. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Thomathy-

    FAGPUTING

    FAGPUTING

    FAGPUTER HAZ ANSWER:

    It’s always hard when we’re talking about intersectionality. It’s easy to feel like one is barreling toward the Oppression Olympics when there’s an issue of two viewpoints from two different minority/oppressed groups. They don’t have to be in competition for Most Oppressed(TM), of course, but it is necessary to try to apply some sort of discretion when weighting potentially competing claims.

    As far as douchebag as an insult goes, I tend to agree with what Sas and Carlie said. By far the dominant meaning assigned to douches is vaginal, not anal. ‘Enema’ is the term most people associate with washing out your backal region. So, the standard defense of douchebag as an insult makes sense to me. (Lord, I feel precious even typing this!)

    Having said that one of my most vivid and fond memories of getting guidance on matters intimate from a “gay uncle” type figure involves this very word. When I was a teen I had an adult friend I turned to for advice on how to be a gay guy in the world. Nervous about a potential sexual encounter in the near future, I asked Bob, “Um. . . what do you do to make sure. . ermmm. . things aren’t. . umm. . .messy.”

    Bob cocked an eyebrow and said, “Josh, my dear, polite faggots douche.”

  191. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Oh, happiestsadist, I don’t mean that you or anyone here is discounting my experience. Gosh, and you’re such a nice person! No apologies from you.

  193. carlie says

    whether what I describe is automatically thought of as an enema by you, doesn’t change the fact that it’s largely understood to be douching,

    That’s the reason I disclaimed that I’m not a member of that group; I simply wasn’t aware of that usage. My gut feeling is to say that there is some threshold…somewhere… as to whether a term used in a specific good or neutral way would be a common enough one to then not use it as an insult, but damned if I know where that line is. Obviously if it’s “my friends and I use it that way” it’s on the side of not common enough, and if it’s “everyone in this category of people know this as the primary definition” it’s on the side of hell no we shouldn’t use it as an insult any more, but all the middle is entirely arguable.

  194. walton says

    Firstapproximation, that’s an interesting article. And it reminds me of this one that appeared in the Boston Sunday Globe: “Can censorship help heal Rwanda?” In short, the country’s doing much better than most people would have expected less than 20 years after the genocide, but there are strict laws against criticizing the government and discussing ethnicity. The argument is made that freedom of speech in the U.S. sense is quite ahistorical and may not be practical in all countries, but the reporter ends on an ambiguous note.

    Ugh. I hate those kinds of cultural-relativist arguments. Freedom of speech isn’t just an American invention,* nor is it an idea unique to one particular culture. It’s a good idea everywhere. Of course governments everywhere will always use any available excuse to clamp down on political dissent and silence opposition leaders, but that doesn’t mean we should buy into it. Freedom of speech is not a luxury; it’s a basic liberty which is indispensable in any sort of free society. And giving any credence to this kind of argument is very dangerous: the Singaporean and Chinese governments, in particular, have been particularly fond of using cultural relativist arguments to justify their authoritarian practices, including continued use of the death penalty.

    (*In fact, there has been plenty of suppression of free speech in American history, often with the willing complicity of the courts. Look back at Schenck v. United States and Debs v. United States, for example, in which the Supreme Court willingly allowed the pretext of WWI to be used to silence and jail socialists, anarchists and draft-resisters who spoke out against the war. I don’t have any patience for the exceptionalist claim that the United States is some sort of unique bastion of liberty, and it annoys me when the expression of pro-free-speech views is conflated with that sort of childish exceptionalism.)

    Yes, direct incitement to genocide should be prosecuted, and is in fact recognized as an international crime; several people associated with Radio Milles Collines were prosecuted before the International Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda for this reason. But call me a cynic, but I’d suggest that Rwanda’s present laws are aimed not so much at preventing a recurrence of genocide but at suppressing opposition to and criticism of Paul Kagame’s government. (According to the 2010 State Department human rights report, statutes forbid expressing “contempt for the head of state of Rwanda”, among other things; one journalist was arrested for comparing Kagame to Hitler, and another for accusing a government official of having an extramarital affair.)

  195. Happiestsadist says

    Thomathy: I don’t even know how I missed the term. I read gay male writers most of the time, read about sex (including predominantly, but not limited to, the kinds I prefer to have myself), used to hang around with mostly queer folks until I moved and now hang around with mostly nobody, and live on the internet, but have not more than once come across the term. Dunno what to say here.

    I think the predominant meaning of the term is, well, predominant, but that doesn’t make the less-common definition any less of a thing.

  196. says

    Walton, I didn’t say I agreed with that article. I said it was interesting.

    If one were conspiracy-minded, one could ponder the coincidence of two mainstream-news articles questioning the universal validity of the U.S. Constitution in the same week. Like They’re™ trying to persuade us that we don’t really need all those rights that haven’t yet been taken away from us…

  197. Happiestsadist says

    Thomathy @ #191: It just struck me that I was possibly unintentionally doing the “well I don’t know that meaning, so it’s not a thing!” thing. Which is enraging to me, so clarification seemed an idea. Though I think you may be the first to call me a nice person in recent memory.

    I suppose now I should ask you what you would like done with the term, now that I know more about its use. (Clean ALL the lower orifices!)

  198. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Josh, Official SpokesGay, thank you. And intersectionality. I must have words! Thank you, again.

    But you just did it, didn’t you? And you know what you just did, I think. It seems to me, given your post, that there’s a strong divide between hetero and gay language use that doesn’t seem to largely intersect. In that case, I can admit that enema is probably more common, but then that’s only because there’s so many more straights, not to mention significantly more straight women who learned about douching as being just one kind of thing.

    So, as to intersectionality, how does one work there? I mean, it’s obvious that us fags (and probably some fag-lovers) are using the term douche to mean one thing and without playing the Oppression Olympics, I really think that people ought to reconsider why they use douche as an insult. After all, my main problem has always been and is only with the statement that some people make that, ‘douching is bad for everyone’. It’s obviously not …so …? Well, that’s my whole problem.

  199. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Carlie, I’m not saying that we shouldn’t use douche as an insult, I think we should, I just think people may need (and I’m being generous) to adjust their reasons for using it as an insult. I agree with everything else you said and I don’t know where that line would be in regards to any other given word.

  200. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    Wow, I really struggle with the format of nested replies, such as on blaghag and crommunist.

  201. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Well, Happiestsadist, as I said, I want it to be used as an insult. I think it’s a great insult for all the reasons at that link above. I just think people need to adjust their reasons for using as an insult for one very specific reason.

    As Josh, Official SpokesGay, said, I don’t want to play in the Oppression Olympics and this matter of intersectionality is hard, but I think I’ve answered my own question as posed in post #198. In light of the fact that there is a plurality of people who use the term in a specific way, the standard reasons for using the term as an insult should be adjusted so as not to marginalise the group that so uses the term to describe a quite polite (wink, Josh) thing to do.

    That makes sense, right?

  202. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen, they hurt so very much! I can hardly follow conversation in which I’m a part. It usually difficult enough to tell if someone is responding directly to you, but it’s nearly impossible there. The flow is just awful. It’s a disordered mess that impedes any kind of natural style of conversation.

  204. Matt Penfold says

    Wow, I really struggle with the format of nested replies, such as on blaghag and crommunist.

    They would be much easier to read if (1) the nested comments were collapsible, and (2) collapsed nests that have new comment since your last visit or refresh were bolded.

  205. walton says

    Walton, I didn’t say I agreed with that article. I said it was interesting.

    Oh, I know. I was arguing with the article’s author, not with you. Sorry if that wasn’t clear.

  206. Richard Austin says

    Odd. I’ve never heard the term “douche” used to describe it. “Enema”, “flushing”, “cleansing,” yes. I’ve been out for over 20 years, and hanging out in West Hollywood for almost 20, and though this isn’t exactly dinner-table conversation material, the topic does come up. That isn’t to say anyone is wrong about the use, but merely that it may not be as pervasive.

    It might be more of a generational thing (e.g., the older gay commuinty might use the word “douche” where the younger community might just say “enema”). But that’s just a random guess.

  207. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Happiestsadist @ #197, exactly the opinion I’m coming to in regards to the term. It’s becoming clear that the term is somewhere in between niche and common and not everyone will have heard it used in regards to anal cleansing.

  208. carlie says

    If no one else imagined Josh’s anecdote as exactly like that old hilariously infamous “not fresh” commercial you have no souls

    Oh, in my mind that entire interaction took place on a beach, with both of them wearing gauzy white flowy clothes, while the wind blew gently around them.

    I guess Josh’s post (that crossed with mine) indicates that yes, there is pretty common usage of it. But my gut still wants to go “my bad word! mine!” – somehow it feels weird for a word that is so bad to one group to get claimed by a different group as a good word. (Intersectionality, how does it fucking work?)

    But that said, I didn’t use douchebag much in the first place, so it’s easy for me to say ok, I won’t use it any more and will stick with asshole.

  209. Matt Penfold says

    It might be more of a generational thing (e.g., the older gay commuinty might use the word “douche” where the younger community might just say “enema”). But that’s just a random guess.

    There also seems to be a difference in acceptance and usage when it is a verb as opposed to a noun. To douche something is a usage I have seen used without any connotation of insult, it just meaning to drench a part of the body with water to wash away contaminants.

  211. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Thomathy/Matt

    Oh good, I am not the only one. (Matt, it was actually your comments I was trying to read.)

    It is practically impossible as it is, never mind if one wants to refresh. Perhaps if we petition them to adopt a TET like format? I find I can follow hundreds of disparate comments here. And TET is the biggest thing I ever come across. If things are spread out, one can always refer to comment numbers like we do here.

    (Perhaps being on a small netbook is part of my problem, I shall try again tomorrow on the PC.)

  216. says

    Carlie:

    Oh, in my mind that entire interaction took place on a beach, with both of them wearing gauzy white flowy clothes, while the wind blew gently around them.

    Funny, I envisioned them in the same clothes, but running through a meadow of mostly white flowers in bloom…

  217. Matt Penfold says

    Oh good, I am not the only one. (Matt, it was actually your comments I was trying to read.)

    You did not miss much, as I repeated myself quite a bit since Groc seems unable to understand that if he makes a factual claim he has better be able to support it with evidence.

  218. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Richard Austin, if anything it’s the other way round. I’m only 26, and I’ve only used that term and by people younger than me all the way up to people of advanced years. And judging by Josh, Official SpokesGay’s anecdote, it’s been used for quite a long time.

    I can’t come up with a good model for how the word’s usage is split. It’s used by Dan Savage, a middle-aged American male and by Josh, Official SpokesGay’s much older (I assume now) uncle figure, but not by the West Hollywood queer. It’s used by a young-adult in an ultra-urban environment, but not by Happiestsadist who comes from a typically Canadian urban environment. I can’t see a pattern that characterises its use.

  219. Happiestsadist says

    A slight correction: I come from a typically Canadian small-town environment. I’ve only been here in TO for two years.

    I can’t seem to find a pattern either.

  221. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Ms. Daisy Cutter, Feral Fembeast, I refuse to ignore that wayward comment. Now, just who here is a tone troll? :P

  223. says

    I really think that people ought to reconsider why they use douche as an insult. After all, my main problem has always been and is only with the statement that some people make that, ‘douching is bad for everyone’. It’s obviously not …so …? Well, that’s my whole problem.

    Hm. I think you might be misunderstanding. It seems to me that when people are objecting to gendered slurs against women, sometimes the question of “douche” is raised – not, in my experience, usually by the people objecting to the gendered slurs against women. They argue that “douche” should also be objectionable to those people because douching has historically been associated with women. Those defending its use then sometimes argue, among other things, that it’s different because douching is something that’s been foisted upon women in very misogynistic ways. In other words, I don’t think the defense is that “douches are bad for everyone,” but that “douche” isn’t objectionable as some claim simply due to its association with women, because that association is itself problematic. Now, I’ve never really found this necessary: I think of “douche” as akin to “scumbag” or “dildo,” and while I think some people have pointed to historical uses that were misogynistic, that hasn’t been how it’s used in my experience. (In other words, the insult doesn’t derive from the association with women or women’s bodies, much less with gay men.)

  224. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    But Happyiestsadist, given the typical size of a Canadian city, that has to count as a typically Canadian urban environment. Toronto is anything but typical. There’s really only one analogue to it in the whole country and begrudging so, even.

    I grew up in one of the largest cities in Canada and there are almost 100 American cities bigger than Windsor. There are only 19 in Canada. Further, the 100th largest Canadian city (population 46,000) has at least 275 American cities larger than it, the smallest of which is population 100,000. If you’re not urban Canadian, then the Red Green Show is true. Do you really want that?

  225. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    SC (Salty Current), OM, I agree largely, but I have seen people defend the term by saying that it’s bad for everyone. The fact that someone said that over at Blag Hag is what spurred me to finally try to discuss it. Otherwise, we’re in complete agreement! Haha! No, really, that’s sincere.

    (You know, most people say that and it’s just blatantly oxy-moronic, because they don’t really agree with anything you’ve said at all …for someone reason that strikes me as particularly hilarious right now.)

  227. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    California ban on same sex marriages ruled Unconstitutional by San Fran appeal court.

  228. says

    Rev @168

    Lynna will know that link. Pretty sure she posted it.

    http://www.mcnaughtonart.com/artwork/view_zoom/?artpiece_id=379

    And here’s the painting that first attracted PZ’s attention… and scorn:
    http://www.mcnaughtonart.com/artwork/view_zoom/?artpiece_id=353

    Post from October 6, 2009:
    http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2009/10/the_goggles_they_do_nothing.php

    There’s more, but I’m sure Pharygulites will enjoy cruising through McNaughton’s website without a guide. There are horrors around every corner.

  234. Happiestsadist says

    Thomathy, if you combined the Red Green Show and the Trailer Park Boys, you’d have most of my family and neighbours. So uh… yeah.

  235. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Rev. BigDumbChimp, Yay! But, does can this ruling be appealed to a higher court?

  236. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Happiestsadist, really? I shudder at the thought. Actually, you remind me that the last trailer park in Windsor was recently torn down.

  238. Rey Fox says

    Warning: This comment may contain peas.

    Karen Handel, VP of Komen just resigned.

    Sweet.

    California ban on same sex marriages ruled Unconstitutional by San Fran appeal court.

    Also sweet.

    ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
    ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
    oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

  239. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    I found a 2010 Moby Dick movie online.

    On the box cover, Moby appears to be sporting pecs and biceps. Try to imagine that, if you will… a sperm whale with pecs and biceps.

    This is gonna be either awesome, or the stupidest damn thing I ever saw.

  241. Happiestsadist says

    Dude, I’m from New Brunswick. Actually, as much as I facepalm at the place, I am pretty fond of where I’m from and the many very strange, occasionally awesome people I’m related to and otherwise connected to. It was nice to be able to go into the woods as a broke student and forage up some produce. Moonshine and lemonade is a perfectly valid cocktail. Seeing wildlife outside (and I mean like deer) from your window while you live downtown is pretty cool. Also, knowing how to fight, and fight dirty if need be. Always reassuring when you’re queer and gender-nonconforming.

  243. says

    Hey does anyone remember which recent thread had a link to a Xian-Right type guy who made hilariously OTT paintings depicting Obama throwing money on the ground and “the forgotten man” sulking on a park bench?

    Here’s my post from 30 January 2012 at 11:24 am.

    Excerpt from that post:

    One of our favorite producers of schlock art, Jon McNaughton, is at it again. This guy is also a mormon, and he sells lots of “art” in the morridor. You too can pay $940 for a framed painting of Obama keeping everyone in chains.

    To get the full effect, you have to click to enlarge, or view the “Read More” provided with each painting.

    http://www.mcnaughtonart.com/page/view_collection/New%20Releases?artpiece=419

    http://www.mcnaughtonart.com/page/view_collection/New%20Releases?artpiece=379
    This second painting shows Barack Obama standing with his foot on the constitution, while pointedly ignoring the “Forgotten Man” on the park bench.

    A satire of one of McNaughton’s paintings was featured in October 2009 on Pharyngula:
    http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2009/10/gosh_i_think_ive_got_a_new_des.php

  244. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    It’s turning out to be a good news day!

    Can’t argue with that! Two thumbs up so far.

  246. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Happiestsadist, I’ll never knock moonshine or deer. Deer ruin cars, after all. They are monsters. There are lots of stars to be seen in Toronto. Well, a couple hundred at least. On clear nights. Well, Orion and the Big Dipper usually, at least …fine, you win.

  248. says

    In other Mormon Moments of Madness, we find that the LDS Church is selling guns. I should make it clear that it is the for-profit arm of the LDS Church that is selling guns. And that will be the defense offered by lawyers on the church payroll.

    They will say that the non-profit church has nothing to do with the for-profit activities, but that is bullshit. A lot of the General Authorities of the LDS Church sit on the boards of these companies. Faithful mormons are chosen to run the companies. Sweetheart deals are made, and tithes are funneled to the church.

    Mormon Church owns one of most active gun sale sites on web, according to Mayor Bloomberg report

    The Mormon Church in Salt Lake City owns one of the most active and unregulated gun sale portals on the web, according to a new report.

    An undercover investigation released in December by Mayor Bloomberg’s office named KSL.com the third most active gun listings site on the Internet.

    The online hub came under scrutiny Monday when the news website Buzzfeed revealed Deseret Media Companies, the for-profit arm of the Mormon Church, operates it.

    The mayor’s report said the site — where 1,327 handguns and 1,003 rifles were listed for sale Monday — allows buyers and sellers to complete a gun sale without identifying themselves.

    Undercover agents performed “integrity checks” on the site, trying to buy guns while declaring openly that they could not pass a legit background check.

    In eight of 12 attempts, the seller happily sold the gun to the shady buyer ….

  249. Happiestsadist says

    Maybe I once dragged The Mr. out onto the rooftop excitedly last summer when I could see all of four stars.

    I remember one time I was drunkenly wandering home back in NB, and I happened to look up. There was an amazing meteor shower going on. So I stood there, staring at the sky. Some random person asked what I was looking at, then ended up watching with me. And another joined. I got a crowd of a half-dozen strangers all silently watching the meteor shower together before I decided I wanted water and sleep and wandered off.

    I like small towns sometimes.

  250. Richard Austin says

    Thomathy:

    The decision can be appealed directly to the full 9th district or, theoretically, directly to the Supreme Court.

    This is a very narrow ruling: a major point hinges on the fact that, in California, civil unions are “everything but the name” of marriage; the majority of the arguments are that, in denying just the name and nothing else, there’s an unfair distinction being drawn. So, I doubt this would affect most other states. At the same time, that means the Supreme Court may be less inclined to take up the case, since it’s such a narrow ruling and wouldn’t affect the rest of the country.

    Also, while everyone is reporting it as a 2-1 decision, that’s only technically true: all three judges agree with upholding Walker’s decision (that 8 is unconstitutional), but the concurrent opinion did so for different reasons (though, honestly, reading the opinion, I can’t figure out what exactly those reasons were). My only supposition is that the concurrent opinion is there just in case the Supreme Court doesn’t want to allow for strict scrutiny in this case (since it argues on a rational basis only).

    Anyway, appeals will be attempted regardless; my “optimistic” hope is that SCotUS declines to accept and the ruling stands.

  252. Happiestsadist says

    I want to live in cities forevermore, but I remain glad that I got to grow up somewhere that wasn’t a city.

  253. Richard Austin says

    Happiestsadist:

    Here. That’s on top of Haleakala on Maui. And that’s me in the picture (yay for delayed shutter, though I should have upped the ISO and dropped the exposure time a bit; too much drag). If you look carefully in the bottom right, you can see the dome of the observatory in the distance.

    It may not need to be said, but I was literally crying when I got out of the car and saw so many stars. I’m so going back up there next time I visit.

    (Side note: I printed that up in poster size with this written down the left side. It’s hanging on my wall.)

  254. Thomathy, now angrier and feminister says

    Richard Austin, thanks! I also hope that the ruling stands. I’m still baffled that it has come to this in any case, though.

  257. carlie says

    Side note: I printed that up in poster size with this written down the left side. It’s hanging on my wall.

    You sell copies and we buy? (puppy-dog pleading eyes)

  258. Happiestsadist says

    Richard Austin: That is astonishing. Thank you.

    When I was very, very small, my Dad would, very rarely and if I was very good, wake me up in the middle of the night, and we’d go out with his telescope and look at Northern Lights, meteor showers, or just really good starry skies. Or some summer nights, we’d go out and watch the bats going out for their dinner. Those were so amazing to me, and were part of why I was so into science and skepticism (why make shit up when we have stuff this amazing?) as a kid.

  259. Richard Austin says

    nigelTheBold,

    Thanks :) I’ve got a few more from up top that I still haven’t uploaded (bad Richard! BAD!). I should probably do that tonight. Mostly, though, I spend 3 hours freezing in the darkness (it was about 40 degrees with a constant 20-30 mph wind) staring at the sky.

  260. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Neil deGrasse Tyson and Bill Nye are at the White House right now with the pres doing a day of science education. They’re taking questions on twitter via #WHChat

  261. sisu says

    Since the bad art has been sourced, can someone help me with this query? A while back, PZ posted his reading list for his Biology of Cancer course. The only books I recall off it were The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks and The Emperor of All Maladies. I’ve since read both and really enjoyed them, and was hoping to get some more recommendations. Unfortunately my Google-fu has failed me and I can’t find that post. Anyone?

  262. Richard Austin says

    Carlie:

    The full-size JPEG’s up on Flickr (it’s 4288×2848, so it can be blown up reasonably large without much loss). You can do what you want with it, as long as you aren’t charging anyone :)

    I know I still have the raw file somewhere, and I might actually have the source for the poster image still, but I’d have to check when I get home. I just used PosterDog to print it out. I had it blown up to 36×54, which is kind of expensive and absolutely huge but, hey, it’s my picture :) I’m more than happy to help anyone else, though, if you really want it (with no charge or markup; I do this for fun, not profit, I just want to make sure no one else profits off my work either).

    If people really want it, send me an email at dstarfire at hotmail and I’ll see what we can do.

  263. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    Visitor: What’s the budget here?

    Me: Our unit of the XXX has a budget of about $5 million per year.

    Visitor: Does all of that come from fees?

    Me: No. The fees cover the operation of trains and a few other parts.

    Visitor: So your park loses money?

    Me: Sir, parks were not set up as money making operations. They exist to preserve and protect those areas, ideas, and pieces of the past that are important.

    Visitor: So your park does not bring in enough to cover the costs?

    Me: Nope. Not meant to, either.

    Visitor: If it don’t make money, then it isn’t worth having, is it?

    Me: Could be. But you’ve been here for three hours. Have you enjoyed your visit?

    Visitor: Yes, but that’s not the point.

    Me: Actually, that is part of the mission of the agency — furthering public understanding and enjoyment.

    Visitor: They need to sell all of them on the open market, and those that make money should be kept.

    Me: But to do that, a park would have to charge extremely high fees which would mean that they would no longer be for everyone.

    Visitor: Well, maybe they should be for those who can appreciate them.

    Me: Do you think affording them and appreciating them are the same thing?

    Visitor: Yup.

    Me: Well, sir, thank you for visiting. I hope you have a pleasant day.

    The kicker? They guy got in with a senior lifetime pass.

  265. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    If no one else imagined Josh’s anecdote as exactly like that old hilariously infamous “not fresh” commercial you have no souls

    I was right there with you, Ing.
    :)
    –

    California ban on same sex marriages ruled Unconstitutional by San Fran appeal court.

    *confetti* and *champagne*
    –

  270. Nutmeg says

    birgerjohansson: I read all of John Bellairs’ stuff in about grade 3, a year or so before I encountered Susan Cooper. They were the first decent-sized chapter books I read on my own, and one of my first exposures to fantasy. I should find some of those books again and see if they’re still good, reading them as an adult.

    Richard Austin: You’re making me jealous. I go camping enough to see decent stars fairly often, but nothing like that.

    I still have a vivid memory of the first time I really saw the Milky Way. I was a teenager at summer camp, and we’d left the main camp to tent in the woods for a couple of nights. When you got away from the campfire, turned off your flashlight, and just looked at the sky, it was amazing.

    Of course, it was a Bible camp, so we heard lots about the beauty of God’s creation and all that jazz. But now, when I’m an atheist camping in the middle of nowhere, the stars are just as beautiful and even more awe-inspiring.

  271. says

    PFC Ogvorbis @263

    The kicker? They guy got in with a senior lifetime pass.

    If one is poor enough, (and I often am), even the relatively low entry fees for National Parks are too expensive for me. I’m always looking for a place to camp outside the N.P., and perhaps some BLM or Forest Service land that offers a back door, a way that I can walk in without getting caught.

    Native Americans have pointed out to me that tribe members who live right on the border of National Parks, as happens in Utah and Montana for example, cannot afford to cross the N.P. boundary line. They are cut off, financially displaced, from some of their ancestral lands.

    The idea that public lands should be accessible only to those who can afford it really pisses me off.

    In some cases, the very people who would most benefit from a visit to a National Park are excluded.

    Public lands are just that, public. They should be subsidized by our government even more than they already are. I think of them as part of our educational system, and as a totally unique resource that we are obligated to preserve. I hope the taxes I pay help.

  272. Nutmeg says

    Ogvorbis: I’m envious of your ability to argue with idiots off the top of your head. And politely, too. I could do one or the other, but not both.

    Can I book you for my next discussion with illogically conservative friends?

  273. carlie says

    Ogvorbis – so I suppose they guy is willing to pay tolls by the foot for every road that he drives on? Because those roads don’t pay for themselves, you know.

  274. Owlmirror says

    That’s on top of Haleakala on Maui.

    Flashing on watching “Cosmos”, and Carl Sagan explaining what the Milky Way was called by some aboriginal peoples:

      “The Backbone of the Night”.

    Excellent picture.

  275. says

    I’m so pleased about the ruling in San Francisco about Prop 8. This is definitely a step in the right direction. I note that the vote was 2-1, with two judges appointed by a Democrat voting that Prop 8 was unconstitutional, and 1 judge appointed by a Republican dissenting.

    Meanwhile, Canada was quite reasonable last month, showing the USA up, as usual.

    The Harper government will change the law to legally recognize the marriages of thousands of foreign gay couples, even if the laws of their home country do not.

    The legislative change will apply to all marriages performed in Canada regardless of the laws of the jurisdiction in which the couple live,…

    Link.

  277. Pteryxx says

    I’m not only TET-bankrupt but FTB-bankrupt… that should pretty much be assumed for me from now on, I guess. So, welcome to whoever is new, *hugs* for whoever needs ’em, and @SC: I have no idea what you’re thanking me for, but you’re welcome.

    Stars: I once caravanned cross-country with a bunch of volunteers who had mostly never been out of a city before. Four hours out on completely dark rural roads, without so much as a streetlight, we pulled over (freaking them out, since they assumed someone’s car had broken down). The country there’s all sagebrush and lava, with only a few low hills to break the lines, and it was all over stars from horizon to horizon as if we would fall up into it from the blank earth. Twenty young SF nerds piled out of our vehicles to marvel and howl at the sky.

  278. carlie says

    When I was a kid, we could only really see a lot of stars (and a smear of the Milky Way) at my aunt’s house in the country, where we went for vacation once a year.

    I tried to give my kids a good stars moment this summer. We went camping in Maine, and one night I was up in the middle of the night to use the restroom and noticed that it was pretty fantastic. No good milky smear, but pretty darned close. Definitely better than we ever get at home. So the next night I woke the kids up in the middle of the night to go look at it. There were a few shooting stars that one child didn’t see, and that made him sad, but hopefully he has a good image in his head of the rest of it. Every night after that was rainy all night, so it was our only go at it.

  279. David Marjanović says

    but here I get into the Torosaurus flamewar… *flee*)

    So, are you a lumper, or a splitter?

    This isn’t a question of splitting or lumping. This is a question of whether any of the (many!) known Triceratops specimens are adult, whether any of the (few!) known Torosaurus specimens are anything but adult, and whether their distribution in time and space allows them to be growth stages of each other.

    nectridean (thanks for the correction on the family

    Nectridea has never been considered a family. The names of families must be derived from the name of a genus they contain and must end in -idae. Nectridea traditionally consists of Scincosauridae, Diplocaulidae and Urocordylidae, after Scincosaurus, Diplocaulus and Urocordylus.

    Diplocaulidae has often been called Keraterpetontidae (after the diplocaulid Keraterpeton), but the name Diplocaulidae has priority because it’s older.

    Diceratosaurus is a diplocaulid.

    which is a primitive amphibian

    See, that’s the very question.

    Carroll* uses it in the traditional way, as “limbed vertebrates that aren’t amniotes”. This spares him the question – although a large part of the book presents his answer to it anyway.

    * Robert, not Lewis. The author of The RISE of AMPHIBIANS, yes, all-caps in the title.

    Don’t get too excited. I think that’s about it on that particular animal.

    Found it. You’re unfortunately right, there’s no explanation of those bones (or the rest of the animal). Well, I can have a look at the cast next week (no time now)… :-)

    The etymology in the OED for “relic” –lacking the final “t” — goes back to Anglo-Norman, Old French (relique), and classical Latin (reliquiae), for pity’s sake.

    Oh, that. I’m not sure if I’ve ever seen a discussion of dead Catholic saints in English – and “relic” hasn’t acquired metaphorical meanings in German or French, unless you count the most obvious ones (“cherished like a relic” or so).

    Relict is from Latin relictus/-a/-um, “left behind”.

    The heating system in the building has just lost its mind and the radiator behind me is now banging loudly and repetitively

    Screw it open if possible, see if air comes out. (Hold a glass over it when you do that.)

    And what was your excuse for all of the other times?

    Stop playing threadcop, just scroll by. What do you think I do with your* music videos almost all of the time?

    * Or anyone’s.

    My lesbian friends are already making plans about what drama to stage if their daughter should bring home a boy ;)

    :-D

    Isn’t that what the “hide comment” button is for?

    That’s in an add-on that not everybody has, to be fair. It’s not a feature of Freethoughtblogs itself.

    swallow that condescending ‘…um…no’ along with your serving of crow.

    *puzzled*

    Oh, so you’re like that colleague of mine who thinks it must be a huge deal to me when I’ve been wrong.

    It’s not. I appreciate the correction and simply move on. ~:-|

    …Oh. Now I get it, maybe. A misunderstanding of tone over the Internet. “um” indicates a pause for thought. I don’t fake such things.

    It could be the greatest romantic comedy ever.

    X-D

    The House of Lords has dismissed calls for Alan Turing to be posthumously pardoned because, basically, at the time he was convicted, being gay was a crime. WTF.

    *Picard & Riker double facepalm*

    February is great for fucking.

    It’s wasted on me, then.

    Plenty of people on the left would argue that monarchy is a relic of a long history of class hierarchy, racism, imperialism and institutionalized state violence.

    BTW, Chas, this is a case where I’d say ein Relikt rather than eine Reliquie in German, because this seems to compare monarchy to an archeological item rather than to crumbs of dead saints. So, I’d spell (and pronounce) this one with t in English.

    Obsession with monarchy is to collecting Pokémon cards as theology is to Sudoku.

    :)

    Now this I like. :-)

    Other nations routinely trade in their constitutions wholesale, replacing them on average every 19 years. By odd coincidence, Thomas Jefferson, in a 1789 letter to James Madison, once said that every constitution “naturally expires at the end of 19 years” because “the earth belongs always to the living generation.” These days, the overlap between the rights guaranteed by the Constitution and those most popular around the world is spotty.

    Fun example of being right for the wrong reasons! A generation was 19 years in 1789? I should be a grandfather now!

    Also from there:

    Americans […] are outliers in prohibiting government establishment of religion.

    o_O Isn’t the separation of church and state, in so many words, part of most constitutions?

    BTW, Austria’s explicitly protects science and its teaching. :-)

    Spider-pig parodies better than new Spider-man trailer?

    ROTFL! Well, probably! (No sound here.)

    I think good parodies are always better than the original. That’s simply because they’re funnier, or at least point out how much hilarity is hidden in the original.

    Yeungling

    ue, not eu.

    Jüngling = poetic German for a male youth the age of a young Greek hero.

    If one were conspiracy-minded, one could ponder the coincidence of two mainstream-news articles questioning the universal validity of the U.S. Constitution in the same week. Like They’re™ trying to persuade us that we don’t really need all those rights that haven’t yet been taken away from us…

    Why? The NYT article makes clear that many constitutions protect more rights than the US one does.

    Oh, in my mind that entire interaction took place on a beach, with both of them wearing gauzy white flowy clothes, while the wind blew gently around them.

    Funny, I envisioned them in the same clothes, but running through a meadow of mostly white flowers in bloom…

    …Amazing.

    ~:-|

    California ban on same sex marriages ruled Unconstitutional by San Fran appeal court.

    *clenched-tentacle salute*

    In other Mormon Moments of Madness, we find that the LDS Church is selling guns. I should make it clear that it is the for-profit arm of the LDS Church that is selling guns. And that will be the defense offered by lawyers on the church payroll.

    Usual series of headdesk, crush, headfloor.

    (Yes, I am tired.)

    Here. That’s on top of Haleakala on Maui.

    Ooh. It looks three-dimensional!

    Visitor: If it don’t make money, then it isn’t worth having, is it?

    Good you didn’t ask “Why?”. Exploded heads are not pleasant to clean up. Yuck.

    I just found a picture of Walton.

    I hate you.

    (A few good comments on that site, though.)

  280. opposablethumbs, que le pouce enragé mette les pouces says

    Pterryx that must have been a wonderful sight!

    Can I book you for my next discussion with illogically conservative friends?

    Hell, I’d book PFC Ogvorbis for any and all discussions if he were bookable :-)

  281. says

    Sex education is failing to reduce adolescent birthrates in conservative states, according to a new study.
    Link

    I know some parents who take their kids out of class when sex education they disapprove of is being provided. A lot of schools where I live have a policy of notifying parents when the terrifying subjects of conception, condoms, and STDs are going to be discussed. Parents are notified in advance so that they can send a note excusing their child from the class.

    The schools are pretending to provide comprehensive sex education, while not actually providing it.

  282. says

    I grew up not far from a major observatory, so light pollution laws meant you could still see the stars even though it was a well-populated area. Every time my dad drove me home after dark, he would get out of the car, look up, and start pointing out constellations and planets.

    My current residence is near a downtown district, and it never seems to get completely dark outside. There is always light, and I can never see the stars.

  283. David Marjanović says

    Sili – Walton is the Crown Princess of Denmark?

    Except for the beard and the make-up… :-)

    Only if Algernon is the first gentleman of Finland.

    ROTFL! Subthread won.

  284. David Marjanović says

    …erm… his beard and her makeup…

    My current residence is near a downtown district, and it never seems to get completely dark outside.

    It never gets seriously dark in my apartment, which is in Berlin but really not in the center.

  285. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    I know some parents who take their kids out of class when sex education they disapprove of is being provided

    My sister did that. “I don’t want them to learn that picking up someone in a bar and having sex with them is an option. It’s NOT an option!” Raeg.

    (And then, of course, her teenage daughter got knocked up and instead of having a bright life with a good education did “the right thing”, married an abusive loser, got divorced, and ended up with you know pretty much no future except being a minimum wage worker. But that has nothing to do with her mother’s refusal to let her learn about safer sex and contraception. Not at all. Completely unrelated.)

  286. says

    David M:

    “Eating crow” is an American idiom.

    Walton is a better person to ask about most constitutions, but I would say that a country with an “official religion” does not have formal separation of church and state. Not that this makes them worse than the U.S. in regards to freedom from religion. That bit of our constitution was championed by theists who didn’t want other brands of theism competing with their own.

    What the NYT article says or doesn’t say about other constitutions and their protections isn’t necessarily relevant to the actual effect it will have on political conversation in the U.S., which is already highly charged and dominated by the politically paranoid. (Personally, I’m OK with revisiting certain long-standing aspects of U.S. law, such as having a senate.)

    The comments about Josh and his conversation with his uncle are playing off very old, very trite commercials in the U.S. about “feminine hygiene products.” These ads are full of the symbolism of “purity.” Oftentimes, they show a grown woman giving advice to a newly menarchal girl. Others notoriously feature one woman complaining to another that, sometimes, she experiences a “not-so-fresh feeling.”

  287. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    I finally recieved my summer cowboy uniform hat (which at wear at forest fires) for the third time. They finally got the size right. I ordered a 7 1/2. They sent a 6 1/2 (yes, it did look fucking hilarious). I sent it back and ordered a 7 5/8 (I figured I should go with the slightly larger size so it won’t tighten up when it gets hot and wet). They sent a 7 3/8. I sent it back. They finally sent a 7 5/8. It is a little big, but I can deal with that with some velcro.

    I figure they blew the entire profit for that one hat on all the shipping charges.

    Lynna:

    The taxes we all pay help. But congress is big on cutting taxes which means that things are underfunded which means increases in user fees which, of course, hits the poor and middle class hardest (as it is designed to do).

    I’m envious of your ability to argue with idiots off the top of your head. And politely, too. I could do one or the other, but not both.

    The uniform helps as it proscribes my available options and keeps me in control.

    Can I book you for my next discussion with illogically conservative friends?

    No.

    This is a question of whether any of the (many!) known Triceratops specimens are adult, whether any of the (few!) known Torosaurus specimens are anything but adult, and whether their distribution in time and space allows them to be growth stages of each other.

    Ah. A lumper.

    Seriously, though, I understand the difficulties, especially with developmental differences plus sexual dimorphism. Then again, there are lots of species extant which, skeletally are identical but, because of behaviour, mating, and colouration are considered different species, so I suspect it all evens out.

    This spares him the question – although a large part of the book presents his answer to it anyway.

    However, I am using it for both entertainment and to get a basic (very basic) understanding of amphibians and thus the origion of amniotes and dinosaurs. So whether his definition of amphibia is correct or not, it is still useful for me as a layman.

    Oh, so you’re like that colleague of mine who thinks it must be a huge deal to me when I’ve been wrong.

    But it is a big deal precisely because it happens so rarely. This is like the kid in Little League baseball, who everyone knows will go on and play either college or pro ball, who drops an easy pop fly (trust me, in the US, this makes sense). It is a big deal because it is so unusual. It is a complement.

    ue, not eu.

    You are, as almost always, right. But it is still good cheap beer.

    Good you didn’t ask “Why?”. Exploded heads are not pleasant to clean up. Yuck.

    Luckily, I am neither in maintenance – custodial, nor am I trained in hazmat, so it would have been an SEP.

    (An SEP is Somebody Elses Problem. Which, according to Adams, is why we do not see UFOs. They are, almost by definition, SEPs.)

  288. Rawnaeris says

    So, I just finished a half hour long panic attack in the middle of my workday. My GP has me on anti-anxiety meds, which I thought were pretty effective, as the meds had gotten the attacks considerably less frequent….
    Fuck I’m about to fall back into one… I’ll have to finish this post later.

  290. PFC Ogvorbis (Yes, they are first class) says

    I don’t think lying is an appropriate principle for a payroll administrator.

    Oh, c’mon, that’s like an open invitation to fleece the sheeple! Tithe them, damnit, tithe them!

  291. chigau (違う) says

    We have coyotes in my neighbourhood.
    Recent sighting have them within a couple of blocks of me.
    And they are not timid.

  292. walton says

    These days, the overlap between the rights guaranteed by the Constitution and those most popular around the world is spotty.

    This is very true. Although there’s substantial overlap between the rights guaranteed by the US Constitution and those guaranteed by international human rights instruments, there are also major differences. For this reason, among others, the US tends to be slow to ratify international human rights treaties, and when it does, it tends to make extensive use of reservations (i.e. opt-outs from part of the treaty). This is exacerbated by the fact that ratification of treaties in the US requires the consent of two-thirds of the Senate, which is usually difficult to obtain. The US didn’t ratify the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR) until 1992, for instance. Such treaties are also usually declared to be non-self-executing, which means they can’t be enforced directly in US courts. There are several other human rights treaties which it still hasn’t ratified; for instance, the US is one of two states (the other being Somalia) which haven’t ratified the Convention on the Rights of the Child, and it’s also repeatedly declined to ratify the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination Against Women (CEDAW). (The Senate came close to approving ratification of CEDAW in 2002, but it never got from the Foreign Relations Committee to the Senate floor largely because the Bush Administration came out against it.)

    In some respects the American position is more liberal than the international human rights position, particularly on freedom of speech and religion. For instance, the ICCPR and other human rights treaties allow states to criminalize hate speech – indeed, the ICCPR in Article 20 actually appears to require states to criminalize “propaganda for war” and “advocacy of national, racial or religious hatred that constitutes incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence”. And there is nothing in the ICCPR, the ECHR or most other human rights treaties to prohibit states from having established churches or state religions, or from criminalizing blasphemy. All of this would be unconstitutional in the US under the First Amendment, which provides much broader protection for freedom of speech and absolutely prohibits the creation of an established church.

    On the other hand, America has been far behind the rest of the developed world on some other human rights issues: for instance, until the Supreme Court decision in Roper v. Simmons in 2005, the United States was one of a handful of countries in which it was legal to execute people for crimes they committed when under the age of eighteen. Indeed, when ratifying the ICCPR, the US made a reservation opting out of the prohibition on the juvenile death penalty. This is very reactionary; almost all other countries recognize the execution of juvenile offenders as a breach of human rights. In Europe, the death penalty itself has been generally abolished, except in Belarus, and most states have ratified Protocol 13 to the European Convention on Human Rights, which outlaws the death penalty absolutely in all circumstances.

    The US, given its commitment to market capitalist ideology, also tends not to be keen on any explicit international recognition of social, economic or cultural rights (like the right to food, shelter, housing, union representation and so on), as distinct from traditional civil and political rights (fair trials, freedom of speech, freedom from torture and so on). It still hasn’t ratified the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights, for instance, and probably never will; and when it nearly-but-not-quite ratified CEDAW, the Senate planned to add reservations and understandings ensuring that the US could opt out of the requirement to guarantee women paid maternity leave or to provide free maternal health care.

  293. walton says

    (Sorry for all the acronyms, btw. Lawyers seem to love acronyms, and international human rights law is chock-full of them.)

  294. Rey Fox says

    If it don’t make money, then it isn’t worth having, is it?

    PUNCH KICK STRANGLE

    I would figure the twilight years of one’s life to be when one really gets a sense of how meaningful some things are, and how you can’t put a price on them. I mean, how (I’m not going to say spiritually, I’m not going to say spiritually) experiencially impoverished do you have to be to reach that age in life and think that the only value out there is money?

    Aw, fuggit. I gotta go feed the birds now. Tuppence a rat.

  295. Jerry Alexandratos says

    These are so off-topic that I had to find the nothing-is-off-topic Endless Thread(tm).

    The Surviving the World comic has a hilarious post today on what constitutes “natural sex”, aimed squarely at the conservative mindset.
    http://survivingtheworld.net/Lesson1316.html

    On a more serious note, the U.S. President’s website has several petitions urging the President to take action supporting the separation of church and state, and supporting equality for LGBT. I recommend Pharyngulites (sp?) take a look at and “sign” these petitions. (It requires registering on the website.)
    http://www.whitehouse.gov/petitions

  296. Rawnaeris says

    Ok. Now that I can think straight again;

    I have panic attacks that are severe enough to last from 30 minutes to an hour and are completely disabling. My doctor and I thought we’d gotten them under control with some low dose anti anxitey meds, but today proved that that hasn’t been the success we thought it was.

    She recommended I see a therapist, but as I live in Texas I have no idea how to go about finding one that isn’t affiliated with some church or other.

    Anyone have a recommendation for finding a therapist that won’t try to shove god down my throat?

    Thanks.

  297. says

    Good news on Prop 8 and Komen! Yay!

    @Dr Bunsen, re childhood books…
    It came to me overnight that one of the reasons I liked the Narnia series was the female characters. The children were always both male and female and the girls were active and strong. Susan even got to fight, as an archer. I really liked Jill, too. And Aravis, who even had a character development story arc. (Of course, I ignored The Last Battle, it was totally stupid.) So there’s one way that the otherwise inane Lewis beats Tolkein!

    @Thomathy, re: douchebag. That was me that you’re referring to in the blaghag thread. I have also never heard the gay usage. And I do expect that I would have, if it were common in the .au gay community before the year 2000. (Not necessarily if more recent; I’ve fallen out of queer circles since I moved to Canberra.) Nor have I encountered it either in the gay fiction I’ve read. “Enema” was the term everyone seemed to use. That’s certainly what they sold the equipment as, in the sex toy shops – both the queer- and straight-focussed ones.

  298. Jerry Alexandratos says

    Rawnaeris,
    The American Psychological Association has a decent website. The page on anxiety has a link “find a doctor” that lets you search for counselors in your area. http://www.apa.org/topics/anxiety/index.aspx

    The Texas Psychological Association also has a website, not quite as pretty as the APA, with a “find a doctor” page.
    http://www.texaspsyc.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=389

    Some counselors have short biographies along with their contact information, so you can weed out the overtly Christian-oriented ones without having to call. Best of luck.
    Jerry

  299. Moggie says

    Therrin:

    I don’t think lying is an appropriate principle for a payroll administrator.

    Haven’t you heard? At the YMCA, you can do whatever you feel.

  301. Rawnaeris says

    @Jerry Alexandratos: thanks for the links. On the Texas one, there is someone reasonably close to me who has some speciality with panic attacks. I appreciate the help with find ing a place to start.

  302. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Rawnaeris –

    (NOTE-If you type the names of known pharmaceuticals in a response here be sure to fuck up the spelling and subsitute a symbol for a letter or your post will get sucked into a hole and never appear)

    I too suffer from anxiety and have had panic attacks that were nearly hallucinatory. I get that it’s a living hell.

    I’m concerned when you say “low-dose anti-anxiety meds.” Just how low a dose? Sometimes you need more for a time. There’s a real bias among many doctors against prescribing a sufficiently high dose of benzodiazepines (X*nax, v*alium, kl*onopin, ativ*an, etc.). The fear of “creating addicts” takes over the sensible use of effective dosages and it pisses me off. Also the states are breathing down doctors’ necks about all sorts of controlled substances, so they get extra cautious. Bottomline: too many of them are unwilling to prescribe enough meds to alleviate suffering and it’s unacceptable.

    I’m not your doctor, obviously. But if I were you, the first thing I’d do is insist on trying a higher dose so long as that’s not contra-indicated by real (not misplaced addiction-a-steria) factors. No, I’m not saying it’s a long-term solution, and no, I’m not saying you shouldn’t find a therapist. But I am saying it’s totally, completely, non-negotiably UNACCEPTABLE for you to have these debilitating panic attacks and wait (!) for talk therapy to maybe help. The suffering is now.

    I don’t know what you take, but I highly recommend X*nax for a short-acting, works-quickly tranquilizer. I’ve taken between .5 milligrams and 2 milligrams (the latter only for a very severe panic attack on a plane) at once from time to time. It’s miraculous.

    Kl*nopin is in the same class, but it’s longer acting with a slightly slower onset. But it tapers off smoothly with less immediate rebound anxiety (actually never had a prob with that with X*nax) either. During college after a panic attack that led to a complete breakdown I was on 3 mg of Klon. a day for several months. I needed that stability and freedom from panic to calm down more systemically and stop anticipating an attack every five minutes.

    Today my anxiety is pretty well controlled with Z*loft at 200 mg a day, but that is NOT a drug for acute anxiety. It takes weeks to work. It is not a replacement for when you need something fast. I take probably .5 to 1 mg of Klon*pin about four times a month, which is nowhere near problematic.

    Sorry for the tealdeer, but this is close to my heart and I can feel your suffering. If you want to talk about it privately my email is spokesgay at gmail.

  303. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Rawnaeris – Also, assuming there’s nothing that prevents you medically from taking benzos, get on the phone NOW. Right now. To your doctor’s office, explain the situation, and insist politely but firmly on having a script for X*nax or another anxiety benzo for short term before you’re next evaluated. Disabling panic attacks are an emergency and you should not feel you have to wait and suffer the dread of the next one. I’m not joking. And if I had a panic attack as bad as what you just had I’d get my ass to the emergency room.

    People who’ve never had one don’t understand how indescribably horrifying they are. It’s not “being nervous” it’s being in utter, mortal, existential terror.

  304. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Sorry, I’ll stop making this thread all about you and me, I promise, but I just sympathize so much. If you want a friend to talk to if you have an attack email me and I’ll give you my cell number. Sometimes I want that, sometimes I want to be all alone. No pressure, just an offer. It can be hard to find people who understand.

  305. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    You do what you need to do, Josh. I sympathize too, but unlike you I have no experience with panic attacks and pretty much nothing useful to say about it.

  306. Dr. Audley Z. Darkheart, liar and scoundrel says

    Rev,

    California ban on same sex marriages ruled Unconstitutional by San Fran appeal court.

    I just saw that over on Wonkette*.

    I would woo hoo!, but I’m kind of frightened of what will happen when the case reaches the Supreme Court. :-/

    *I’m usually more of a news junkie, since I listen to NPR all freaking day at work, but my local station is in the middle of their fund drive. Blech.

  307. changeable moniker says

    A subthread led me to this:

    [Mary hits E.T. with the refrigerator door]
    Gertie: Here he is.
    Mary: [absently] Here’s who?
    Gertie: The man from the moon. But I think you’ve killed him already.

    It made me smile … then frown. Thirty years ago?! Aiiee.

    —

    The Founding Fathers were libertarians? No (via, I think, Brad DeLong).

    —

    “not fresh” commercial? you have no soul

    I have no experience of this American culture of which you speak. Apparently I have no soul. But I do have rhythm. ;)

    Is this the shit Stephen Jay Gould’s wife mocked with her suggestion of a male equivalent called “Cocksure”?

  308. Pteryxx says

    seconding everything Josh said about panic attacks and meds, less the phone number. I still have enough anxiety that random phone calls are not a great thing for me right now. Also, beta blockers can work for panic attacks too, and they’re cheap and non-addictive so physicians are less paranoid about prescribing them. I take one just before doing something highly likely to produce an attack, such as public speaking back in grad school. They also help with PTSD, if I remember I have the darn things.

  311. says

    IRT to sky viewing:
    I never knew what people were talking/writing about “the man in the moon” until I got my first glasses in 7th grade. I thought it was just a jolly thing to say. I walked out of the optometrist’s office and went ‘Wow!’

    Not once during the previous screenings in school (not very often and not very good) did they catch I couldn’t motherfucking see. I tell this remembrance to our 3rd years who do great work going out to rural schools in our Opt school van.

    Since then I’ve seen the night sky in zero light pollution, and it is 3D and the Milky Way is amazing. Adding to that my knowledge that I’m looking at the center of our galaxy is AWESOME!
    ++++++++++++++++
    ‘Tis, I have a minor bone to pick with you.

    On another thread SC was asked if she was a sailor by [some commenter I can’t remember] and you answered you were the only one here. ahemmmmmm, that’s not quite correct. [I’m a gonna add a smiley face here];-)

    I was in the Navy, I have a DD214. I also have sailed solo in blue water, (the FL Keys to the Bahamas count, right?), crewed on green water races, and spend my time away from work on my boat during the sailing season.

    It’s a 25’ 30 year old O’Day with a head and a galley. And an asymmetric spinnaker. I’m still competitive because on corrected time I’ve won more than once.
    ++++++++++++++++
    I think/hope that the 9th Circuit ruling was so restricted that the SC doesn’t bother with it. 1% of cases submitted get taken.

  312. says

    Jesus, Rawnaeris, I’m sorry. If you don’t find a decent therapist via Jerry’s links, I wonder if any of the atheist orgs in Texas (there are a few according to Google) might be able to help you with that?

    Josh:

    But I am saying it’s totally, completely, non-negotiably UNACCEPTABLE for you to have these debilitating panic attacks and wait (!) for talk therapy to maybe help. The suffering is now.

    Damn straight. I agree with Maia Szalavitz that our country’s puritanical streak makes people wring their hands about “quick fixes” when, to be blunt, sometimes a quick fix is entirely appropriate.

    That said, I should add that while I wouldn’t worry about becoming addicted to a benzodiazepine, it’s not hard to become habituated to one, and the dosage doesn’t have to be that high. I have never had classic panic attacks but I’ve had some pretty horrendous anxiety; years ago I was using Kl0n0pin for both that and for insomnia. I topped out at 1 mg. When I stopped taking it, I got flu-like symptoms: fatigue, nausea, mental fog. (My shithead psychopharmacologist didn’t recognize them as withdrawal symptoms. BTW, he worked at A Highly Prestigious Institution.)

    I resorted to chopping the pill into very tiny pieces with an X-Acto knife and bringing the dosage down slooooowwwwllllly over the course of a few weeks. Eventually I did start taking it again p.r.n., but fortunately I need it only on rare occasions; I can make a scrip for 30 pills last a couple of years or more.

    Anyway, Rawnaeris: Take it as needed, but if you end up taking it regularly and you want to discontinue it, cold turkey might not be optimal.

    BTW, Josh, you posted the same link twice. I gotta say, that ad gives me some serious déjà vu…. and also reminds me of Brenda Vaccaro and Cathy Rigby.

    (High school joke: You insert a long, thin piece of paper into your waistband, then lean slightly backwards with your arms up in the air and palms outward so that the paper sticks out. “Who am I? I’m Cathy Rigby after a backward flip.”)

  315. changeable moniker says

    Tidying up, @Giliell, child-the-tiny hides behind my legs, waves, and shyly shows you her new scar (of which she’s secretly quite proud).

    —

    And again, I come home to find the boiler on the blink. The “I have electricity!” LED is dark. Power is cycled. No dice. Fuse is replaced. No dice. Fuck. £85 call-out charge for a plumber, we fear.

    No heat. Overnight forecast is -4C.

    To the internet! And, lo, I find that the LED only lights up when it’s using electricity, and this can be caused by a comms failure with the control system. Comms system is reset. No dice. Wireless thermostat is reset. And there is an LED!

    But there’s no activity. No heat, no hot water. No dice.

    Then, as prophesied, my slowcoach brain kicks in and I remember what to do. Boof!, there is heat. Day saved. I get to wear the clever trousers. ;)

  317. Part-Time Insomniac, Zombie Porcupine Nox Arcana Fan says

    drbunsen @ 147:

    I work in a Catholic school. If they ever got wind of me supporting an atheist in any form, I think I’d get a lecture, or upon refusing to back down, lose my job. Maybe I’m just paranoid, but better safe than sorry.

    I got an email from the seller after they got my order. They mail the packages out with no indication of the purchase being made to support Jessica. I was then commended for working where I do, though for different reasons than the staff might want to hear.

  318. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Ms. DaisyCutter –

    Yes to the idea that a quick fix is often just the thing! How in the world that’s not obvious to people flummoxes me.

    Yes also on the habituation. This is a well-known characteristic and something my doctor already knew would happen. But, because she was a reasonable person, she agreed that, um, taking a little time to get off the drug was a “price” worth paying for me not to suffer in terror and drop out of school. She directed me to do just what you did—the medical jargon is “titration.” My experience of it was just as yours. It took several months but I had no problems gradually ceasing.

  319. Rey Fox says

    I saw the funniest protest sign today while escorting at Planned Parenthood. “We Can Save You Money!” Oh man, that’s rich. Anyone have the latest figures for how much it costs to raise a kid to age 18 these days?

    They were also claiming that PP couldn’t charge anyone today, I’m not sure what that was all about. We’re not actually performing abortions today, but doing preliminary exams.

  320. Weed Monkey says

    IRT to sky viewing:
    I never knew what people were talking/writing about “the man in the moon” until I got my first glasses in 7th grade. I thought it was just a jolly thing to say. I walked out of the optometrist’s office and went ‘Wow!’

    With my glasses on, or with binoculars, I still can’t find any facial features on the Moon. I’m somewhat familiar with pareidolia and have tried to figure it out, but just can’t find a face there.
    *shrug*

  321. carlie says

    I never knew what people were talking/writing about “the man in the moon” until I got my first glasses in 7th grade. I thought it was just a jolly thing to say. I walked out of the optometrist’s office and went ‘Wow!’

    The first thing I saw with my glasses (4th grade) upon walking out of the optometrist’s was branches in the trees. Individual branches, with space between them, in such beautiful patterns.

    I still have a soft spot for gazing up in trees.

  323. janine says

    I did not get my first pair of glasses until my sophomore year in high school. It allowed me to move from sitting in the front seats to sitting in the back of the class. I could finally read the blackboard.

  324. Weed Monkey says

    What actually bothers me a bit is how hard it is to see craters on the Moon as holes in the ground instead of bumps. Unless the light hits them just right I have to do some intense brain gymnastics to switch the vision the right way. The problems of a ground dwelling ape…

  326. Weed Monkey says

    I had my first glasses when I was 8 or 9 years old. Now I would be pretty helpless without them. Plus my father and both his brothers have had cataract surgery between 50 and 65 years of age. But I’m not worried, it’s a treatable condition nowadays.

  328. Weed Monkey says

    carlie:

    The first thing I saw with my glasses (4th grade) upon walking out of the optometrist’s was branches in the trees. Individual branches, with space between them, in such beautiful patterns.

    I still have a soft spot for gazing up in trees.

    I felt the same way when I last ate ‘shrooms. Shiny! :)

  329. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    I’ve always had near perfect vision, with a sensitivity to movement. Pred-o-vision, I like to call it, because it sounds cooler than saying “I see good and it aids my hunting.”

    On top of that, I’ve done incredibly stupid things with my eyes (including regularly forgoing safety goggles… not forgetting, foregoing) and always escaped lasting damage. I thought I’d fucked myself when I was attempting that spearhead and it flipped up and hit me in the eye while red hot, but nope. Nothing.

    These posts on getting glasses and finally ‘seeing the world’ have ensured that I will never take my deadlights for granted again. Especially this one:

    The first thing I saw with my glasses (4th grade) upon walking out of the optometrist’s was branches in the trees. Individual branches, with space between them, in such beautiful patterns.

    They are beautiful, aren’t they?

  330. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Make that ‘Still hot’, not ‘Red hot.’ let’s not exaggerate now. That was a brainfart.

  333. Rawnaeris says

    Re: New glasses, I remember my first pair of glasses when I was 7. I could see the leaves and branches on trees clearly for the first time. Whenever I get a new ‘script I still look at trees first. :-))

    And to Josh and Ms. Daisy Cutter, my GP seems aware of that as well. She started me on Zol0ft and has switched me to Pr0zac to control side effects.

    The reason we’d started on low dose was we initially thought it might be caused by PMDD on the mild side of the spectrum. I am due for an evaluation exam next month. I will take the advice to call the docs office tomorrow, as they were already closed here.

  334. firstapproximation says

    I know the joke is old, but the mental image I got from a BBC headline got me giggling mad: Romney duels a surging Santorum.

    BTW, Austria’s explicitly protects science and its teaching. :-)

    *jealous*

    Of course governments everywhere will always use any available excuse to clamp down on political dissent and silence opposition leaders, but that doesn’t mean we should buy into it. Freedom of speech is not a luxury; it’s a basic liberty which is indispensable in any sort of free society

    QFT.

  336. Nutmeg says

    My first pair of glasses (age 10) made me realize that the world is 3D. My brain had started to block the signals from my bad eye, reducing my depth perception. Maybe that’s why I’m so bad at sports…

    My brother’s first pair of glasses, around the same age, made him realize that trees have leaves.

    My parents felt like they had failed both of us. They, lucky bastards, didn’t need glasses until their 40s. My brother and I each got a bunch of annoying recessive genes.

  337. Rawnaeris says

    Hey, Josh, there’s an email in your inbox for you.

    I seem to say something like this every time I have some kind of crisis, but you all, the commentariat of Pharyngula, are among the best and kindest people I’ve ever had the privilege to meet.

  338. kristinc, ~delicate snowflake~ says

    I had pretty good vision as a kid but once I hit 30 I started getting nearsighted; when I finally got glasses I wasn’t surprised to see leaves more clearly, but the first snowfall blew me away. I completely forgot how snowflakes are all these itty bitty distinct objects.

  342. Pteryxx says

    but you all, the commentariat of Pharyngula, are among the best and kindest people I’ve ever had the privilege to meet.

    Shark tank. SHAAARKS. With frickin’ lazer beams of skepticism on our heads. SHARKS.

  343. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    Also…I saw one headline that said “Santorum explodes from behind”… Or maybe I made it up.

    The news is simultaneously scarier and funnier with that guy around.

  344. ChasCPeterson says

    slowcoach

    the charming English euphemism for ‘tortoise’, I believe.
    They’re actually among the most intelligent of the ‘reptiles’.

  345. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    During the drought of last summer an ornate box turtle periodically visited our patio and would sit looking in the door until we fed it strawberries.

  346. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    Rawnaeris, you have my sympathy. Unfortunately, that is all I have to give. Apart from *hugs*, that is.
    –
    Giliell, wait; lack of employment follows a torn sweater/stupid mother/snow combo?
    O-o
    –
    Josh, how much does X*nax or such cost? Just this last Saturday, my daughter-in-law shared that she’s having some pretty heavy-duty, baseless (as far as we can tell) anxiety that has had her going entire days without eating. Not good. :( :( :( Their medical insurance kinda sucks, Son is on meds that they have to pay for out of their own pocket, and she’s got extra dread over the prospect of the possible added expense.
    –
    I think I was in 4th or 5th grade when I first got glasses. That’s when I discovered that the picture frames in the hall weren’t all black; they had some gold detailing.

    The glasses were pink.

    I hate pink.

    Always have.
    –
    Butbutbut…police commisioners’ sons who are also TV anchors just never do that kinda thing!
    –

  347. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    The point being that Testudines are as charming as they are intelligent. Or a least can be with sufficient motivation.

  348. says

    cicely:

    she’s got extra dread over the prospect of the possible added expense.

    So just thinking about the cost of getting well is actually making her sicker? Reason #427,239,754 why we must have universal national health care now! If only we weren’t in the thrall of worshippers of the almighty private sector…. <sigh>

    ***
    All:

    For (most recently) reasons I heard about in my inbox today, I second Rawnaeris’ comments about how good and kind this crowd is. Y’all rock (as I’ve been informed).

  349. Dhorvath, OM says

    SC,

    They are beautiful, aren’t they?

    They must be destroyed. What kind of atheists are you?

    Heresies already?

  350. dianne says

    Santorum dominates Missouri, there’s Santorum spread all over Minnesota and Colorado looks spotted with it too. Should be an…interesting election.

  351. walton says

    Santorum dominates Missouri, there’s Santorum spread all over Minnesota and Colorado looks spotted with it too.

    Ewww. What a mess.

  352. says

    I can’t believe the GOP made such a mess with Santorum! I thought the whole purpose of using a douche like Romney was to prevent such a mess!

    ((Sorry, I couldn’t help myself. I know it’s awful))

  353. firstapproximation says

    Decided to search for ‘Santorum’ in Google News. Some headlines:

    – Romney Camp Prepares for Santorum Threat in Votes Tonight

    – Santorum Over Obama in a Landslide [hehehe] Among Financial Advisors

    – ‘Definitely a Santorum night’‎

  355. firstapproximation says

    The most disgusting headline was “Santorum: Prop. 8 ruling hurts ‘foundation of our society'”.

    Yeah, I don’t feel bad about identifying his name with ass juice.

  356. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Cicely:

    X*nax is wicked, wicked cheap because there’s long been generic versions.The drug (not brand) name is Alpraz*lam. Like, $15 for 90 1mg tablets (way more than most people would need) at drugstore dot com, for example. Call a few local pharmacies and they can tell you. Actually, all those I mentioned above have cheap generic versions.

  357. Rey Fox says

    Oh shit, that’s right, the primary was today. I considered voting (open primary), but I just couldn’t in good conscience vote for any of those jackasses. There was an “uncommitted” option on the sample ballot, which I was considering, but only if it meant the same as “no confidence”.

    Wait, Santorum won? BLEAH. I was hoping my new home state was just full of garden-variety Romney idiots, not hateful Santorum idiots.

    (a little research later)

    Wow. Apparently, this is a nonbinding primary because they couldn’t schedule it this early without breaking some rule or other. And Gingrich isn’t on the ballot. Bloody hell.

  358. says

    During the drought of last summer an ornate box turtle periodically visited our patio and would sit looking in the door until we fed it strawberries.

    I love everything about that sentence and story.

  359. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Thomathy

    [douche/douchebag] And judging by Josh, Official SpokesGay’s anecdote, it’s been used for quite a long time.

    IIRC, George Orwell talks about the use of a douchebag in his book called “Keep the Aspidistra Flying” from 1935 (Pffft). There certainly was an undercurrent in the book that it is considered a thing to be frowned upon (implicitly used by “loose” women). I do not have a copy, so perhaps one of the horde can help here. (If it helps to find, the protagonist in question was called Rosemary.)

    The word douche I know simply as “shower”. eg: “Gaan douchen.” (“Have a shower.”)

    (… and FYI Josh is not old!)

    Prop 8

    Yin and yang… Things improve for humanity in California but get worse in Uganda. :'( Link: Uganda revives anti-gay bill but drops death penalty. (why don’t they grow up and drop the whole fucking thing?)

    But let me at least congratulate you USAians out there. It appears that your (IMO) jaded and flyblown constitution really can do some good after all. I am impressed.

  364. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ chigau

    How is (are) everyone?

    All the better for hearing your dulcet tones.

    (I was going to transpose this somehow to the interwebs but teh brainz is not up to it. Hugs anyway.)

  366. chigau (違う) says

    theophontes
    *hugs* to you, too.
    and a big bowl of home-made baked beans (if you like)

  367. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ chigau

    *FARTS*

    {theophontes waves hand back and forth in front of nose}

    Delicious, but I best not try your beans when the horde is crowded into this enclosed thread.

    ;)

  369. says

    Good morning

    This, my friends is the archetypal American commercial about douching, the fountainhead from which gushes much humor and mockery:

    What, wait, baking soda? Fucking bakind soda? In a vagina? Baking soda neutralizes acidity and if you want one thing down there it’s a low ph. Neutralizing that is the best way to actually get a nasty smelly infection.

    changeable moniker
    Well, I still have some scars I regard with fondness and a good story to tell (like when I almost killed my cousin after he almost killed me)

    cicely
    Ehm, indirectly
    Lack of employment might follow from snow keeping people indoors so they don’t come to my classes.
    Torn sweater results from “art”. I don’t judge, but sharp mirror shards glued to a wall are a health hazzard.

  370. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ janine

    sigh…

    We have sunk to the lowest form of humor.

    {theophontes buttercups janine, runs away}

    kekekeke…

  371. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Theophontes: For christ’s sake, quit fucking around and get serious, will you?

    Let’s see you light one.

  372. chigau (違う) says

    I fixed it.
    I deleted ALL of my current Pharyngula bookmarks except for The Endless and Molly.
    I am going to be SO sorry in the morning.

  373. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ TLC

    Let’s see you light one.

    What if I assplode? :'(

  375. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    OK people I’ll stop now.

    But can you really blame me when I have to click news links that say things like:

    Romney duels a surging Santorum.

    or: Santorum hat-trick (Not that I want to know what either of these things are. I was shocked enough to learn what santorum is.)

    @ chigau

    Teh horde can always help if you need to track back.

  378. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Minnie et al

    Yeats: Sailing to Byzantium

    Here is an interesting piece about Euripides that blends well with Yeats’ golden bird of the muses. The discussion is of Euripides himself as an old man, a “Gerontes”:

    The “Graces” or Charities are the spirits of fulfilled desire, the Muses are all the spirits of “Music” or of “Wisdom”—of History and Mathematics, by the way, just as much as Singing and Poetry. “I will not rest. I will make the spirits of Fulfilled Desire one with the spirits of Music, a marriage of blessedness. I care not to live if the Muses leave me; their garlands shall be about me for ever. Even yet the age-worn minstrel can turn Memory into song.”

    Memory, according to Greek legend, was the mother of the Muses; and the “memory” of which Euripides is thinking is that of the race, the saga of history and tradition, more than his own. The Muses taught him long ago their mystic dance, and he will be theirs for ever; he will never from weariness or faint heart ask them to rest. He was thinking doubtless of the lines of the old poet Alcman to his dancing maidens, lines almost the most beautiful ever sung by Greek lips: “No more, ye maidens honey-throated, voices of longing; my limbs will bear me no more. Would God I were a ceryl-bird, over the flower of the wave with the halcyons flying, and never a care in his heart, the sea-blue bird of the spring!”

    Euripides asks for no rest: cares and all, he accepts the service of the Muses and prays that he may bear their harness to the end. It was a bold prayer, and the Muses in granting it granted it at a heavy price.

    Euripides identifies the moment of downfall of the Athenians as an incident late in the Peloponnesian war, when they attacked and killed the people of Melos (fellow Greeks) for not capitulating:

    “Ye have slain, ye Greeks, ye have slain the nightingale; the winged-one of the Muses who sought no man’s pain.”

    Yeats would certainly have been familiar with all this and far more. Perhaps our struggle to fully understand him is more an indictment of ourselves and our loss of our sense of history than any failing on his part.

    Free book: Euripides and His Age by Gilbert Murray (It is also free on Amazon). I shan’t go into it here, but there is a lot of pertinent thought with regard to the problems of democracy and empire, that give one new perspectives on these issues for contemporary USA.

  379. opposablethumbs, que le pouce enragé mette les pouces says

    Rawnaeris, I hope you find a therapist who can help (without godbothering) and get the right meds for you as well. (A bit late due to computer having indigestion, but just wanted to send good wishes. And agree, the horde is amazing).

  381. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    Also from Gilbert Murray … you would swear he was talking about the GOP, or fundagelicals, and not the problems Euripides was forced to contend with:

    In every contest that goes on between Intelligence and Stupidity, between Enlightenment and Obscurantism, the powers of the dark have this immense advantage: they never understand their opponents, and consequently represent them as always wrong, always wicked, whereas the intelligent party generally makes an effort to understand the stupid and to sympathize with anything that is good or fine in their attitude.

    Or on Democracy (how pertinent right now!):

    We must distinguish carefully between the two notions, Enlightenment and Democracy. They happen to have gone together in two or three of the greatest periods of human progress and we are apt to regard them as somehow necessarily allied. But they are not.

    Doubtless Democracy is itself an exalted conception and belongs naturally to the ideas of the Enlightenment, just as does the belief in Reason, in the free pursuit of knowledge, in justice to the weak, the wish to be right rather than to be victorious, or the hatred of violence and superstition as such. But the trouble is that, in a backward and untrained people, the victory of democracy may result in the defeat of the other exalted ideas.

    The Athenian democracy as conceived by Pericles, Euripides or Protagoras was a free people, highly civilized and pursuing “wisdom,” free from superstition and oppression themselves and helping always to emancipate others. But the actual rustics and workmen who voted for Pericles had been only touched on the surface by the “wisdom” of the sophists. They liked him because he made them great and admired and proud of being Athenians. But one must suspect that, when they were back at their farms and the spell of Pericles’ “wisdom” was removed, they practised again the silliest and cruelest old agricultural magic, were terrified by the old superstitions, beat their slaves and wives and hated the “strangers” a few miles off, just as their grandfathers had done in the old times.

    (It is actually a very short book and a joy to read. I highly recommend it.)

  382. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    Ok, one last quote and then I will shut up:

    He accepts the Athenian ideals of free thought, free speech, democracy, “virtue” and patriotism. He arraigns his country because she is false to them.

  386. Ichthyic says

    well, while I wait for someone in the States to buy me the tablets I want, I at least went out and scored a Sony touch wifi reader today.

    I have to say, these things are more impressive than I expected they would be.

    a little slow, but then I did expect that. What I really didn’t expect was that it would also actually connect up and display wepages quite nicely, display pictures and slideshows, and also do mp3/mp4 music playback.

    I’m looking at Pharyngula right now on it, and typing this message on it.

    seems to work pretty damn well, condisering it’s all in B&W.

    of course, being in NZ, I apparently am excluded from both google and amazon bookstores on the thing, but I’m sure I can work around that easily enough.

  387. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    Ichthyic

    You can open an Amazon account and read books on a PC … it seems a bit strange you can’t do the same on that device (cutting off one’s nose to spite one’s face…). Are they blocking the option? What format are you on?

  388. Weed Monkey says

    Janine’s The Jam links reminded me of Jam, so I’m downloading a few episodes to re-watch.

    This must be my favourite sketch in its bleak absurdity.

  389. birgerjohansson says

    “Valentine’s Day Pie With ‘Aphrodisiac’ Bull Testicles” http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/02/07/bulls-testicle-pie-valentines-day-ocado_n_1259517.html?ref=uk -Who comes up with these ideas? Carl Pilkington at “Ricky Gervais Show”?
    .
    “Journalist recovers video of his arrest after police deleted it” http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2012/02/journalist-recovers-video-of-his-arrest-after-police-deleted-it.ars

    “Colorado: While Immigration May Not Be a Major Issue for GOP, It May Be Decisive with Latino Voters” http://www.huffingtonpost.com/adam-luna/colorado-while-immigratio_b_1260512.html -So the GOPers have been shooting themselves in the foot?

  390. says

    Neil deGrasse Tyson and Bill Nye are at the White House right now with the pres doing a day of science education. They’re taking questions on twitter via #WHChat

    I got that tweet too, and showed it to the megahot new resident : “Look, I know someone who is in the White House right now !”

    Marianne Faithfull – Sister Morphine

  394. says

    While chapter #5243784051 of the “cunt” argument rages at blaghag, I have just been over to dispatches and read the most unbelievably disgusting and shocking insult I’ve ever seen. Lampshade. Really. My jaw fell on the floor and I still haven’t managed to pick it up yet. I am not in any way joking, I am utterly aghast that this can possibly be real.

    I don’t even think reading cute overload can scrub my brain clean enough now. Global warming? Armageddon? Extinction? Bring it on, we just fucking deserve it as a species. (Yes, sorry, I am aware of the irony in jokingly advocating genocide because I’m horrified by genocide jokes. My brain has gone numb and refuses to process this better.)

  395. says

    Why is it so hard for me to remember to drink water? *sigh*

    I just spent two more sick days on having horrible dehydration. I was fatigued because of a combination of an insane feline until midnight and just general fatigue. I have this ill feeling in the pit of my stomach like I’m going to barf all the time. My joints and muscles all hurt. I had a wicked headache last night that I felt from head to hips. Toss all that into a blender with the general depression I’ve been feeling and it’s a recipe for another nervous breakdown which I’m not prepared to have.

    And the majority of that (not the cat or the depression, those require other alternatives) is to drink two (Gatorade-sized) bottles of water a day. That’s it, that simple… and yet I don’t do it….

  396. says

    @birger:

    That’s just depressing, but remarkably believable. If they can’t win in a fair vote, just change the rules so they can win. If it disenfranchises the common voter, so what, who cares? “N*****s ain’t shit” seems to be the general stance of the white Republican congressman. They gotta keep shoring up their poor, rich white CEOs.

    (I’m recalling a Mitchell and Webb skit that’s like a parody of those pitiful “poor children in Africa” commercials, but damned if I’m gonna look for it…)

  397. janine says

    Alethea H. Claw, I read that also, really fucking terrible. But not at all surprising. We already know that groups like Storm Front are denying that the Holocaust happened and when they are not, they celebrate the gruesome details. Also, it is not like the person who wrote that insult makes use of critical thought, Mikey Weinstein is both an atheist an a Jewish supremest.

    Just be grateful that at this time and at this place, that waste of meat has no power. We already know what is possible if they do have power.

  398. janine says

    For many months, The Rachel Maddow Show has devoted a number of segments to the issue of disenfranchising eligible voters. Call this a real stripping of rights.

  399. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    janine: Imma just send you my iPod. You go ahead and put anything you want on it.

  400. says

    @ Katherine

    I always have trouble drinking enough water too. What I’ve found works the best for me is to find a nice water bottle that I really like and just keep it with me and full at all times. Keeping something you really like to drink in the house also helps (for me, that’s sweet tea).

  401. birgerjohansson says

    (OT) Just in: Another case of senseless hatred.

    During the recent coup d état in the Maldives, a crowd of islamists broke into the National Museum and destroyed buddhist statues from the islands’ pre-islamic era.

    Reminds me of the buddha statues in Afghanistan. Idiots who do this to statues are ready to murder people, too.
    — — — — — —
    Considering hatred of Jews, didn’t the religious authority in Saudi Arabia deliberately demolish archaeological remains of Roman-era Jewish synagogues in the northern part of the country some years ago?
    — — — — — —
    Storm Front and the Klan are for the stupid fucks who are rejected even by “mainstream” hate groups. Most racists are not dumb enough to wear sheets or tattoo swastikas in the face.

  403. says

    @birger:

    That depresses me as both a person fighting for religious freedom as well as a person who absolutely loves history and archeology (one of my professors in college got me totally hooked on archeology and I wish she was still alive so I could tell her about it.) To destroy something with historical value is the worst thing one can do. I don’t care if it’s offensive to your tastes or your religion, it’s destroying something which can’t come back! What would have happened if the Conquistadors wiped out all traces of the ancient Mexican civilizations? We’d never have known about the amazing and interesting cultures that thrived in that land for years before Europeans found them. It’s the same sort of thing. It’s brutal, it’s cultural genocide.

  404. janine says

    What would have happened if the Conquistadors wiped out all traces of the ancient Mexican civilizations?

    It was not from lack of trying.

  405. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ All

    Has anyone heard of “Friends of Science”? It is a website that goes out of its way to deny all the claims of global warming being made by science.

    I have been sent a list of 10 “myths” of global warming and would like to respond. Does anyone have info or linkies to a takedown of this? Any comments welcome.

    The link in question is here: COMMON MISCONCEPTIONS ABOUT GLOBAL WARMING (I find the full caps of the title a little offputting to begin with.)

    The “myths” include:

    MYTH 1: Global temperatures are rising at a rapid, unprecedented rate.
    MYTH 2: The “hockey stick” graph proves that the earth has experienced a steady, very gradual temperature decrease for 1000 years, then recently began a sudden increase.
    MYTH 3: Human produced carbon dioxide has increased over the last 100 years, adding to the Greenhouse effect, thus warming the earth.
    …
    … etc

  406. says

    Katherine
    Hmm, if you’re at home putting water where you see it might help.
    My grandpa always used to put three bottles of mineral water on the kitchen counter each day for them to drink, so they’d have a constant reminder.
    Carrying a water-bottle helps, too.
    If you just dislike plain water, tea might help (I often drink cold Roiboos), or adding a bit of lime juice or ginger.

    ++++++

    Penn Jillette really has such charming female friends. If Mallorie hadn’t managed to convince us already, Emily would have sealed the deal.

  407. McCthulhu's new upbeat 2012 nym. says

    Apologies for the crankiness, but I just came in from another bullshitstorm, care of the religulous –

    In case it hasn’t been mentioned or noticed, Lawrence Krauss argues for the religious to give a bit more respect to science. The usual hilarity ensues (I think Larry tries too hard at being diplomatic):

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/blog/2012/feb/07/faithful-learn-respect-question-beliefs

    I’m still waiting for someone to use the examples of late 1800s snake-oil salesmen and voodoo practitioners, that putting faith into ANYTHING without asking a whole lot of questions is just stupid, but that’s exactly what religion wants you to do. Science is the opposite, you get to ask a whole lot of questions and you don’t end up under dirt because you were blindly credulous and got poisoned by piss in a dirty old bottle or some venomous reptile meant to chase away ‘evil spirits’.

    If people were genuinely interested in truth, religions would be inundated with questions, and have to revise accordingly (or more likely poof out of existence). How convenient for all of them that they all demand no questioning upon penalty of no afterlife, or a worse afterlife. That it doesn’t dawn on the credulous that this trick was probably worked out in the first 15 minutes of priestdom n-tens-of-thousands of years ago to save their own lying arses just makes the unquestioning believers of 2012 sound even MORE stupid.

    Apologies again…please go back to enjoying recipe exchange and fun anecdotes and all the other good TeT stuff.

  408. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Kitty

    Are you also eating enough? Food is an important source of water.

    If drinking water is a drag then perhaps consider (teas have already been mentioned) soups, fruit juices, low fat milk. You will perhaps have to build up the habit of drinking regularly.

    @ Giliell

    Roiboos Rooibos (“red bush”). Also look out for Heuningbos (“honey bush”… it is naturally sweet and honey flavoured) another popular South African tea.

  409. says

    theophontes

    Rooibos (“red bush”). Also look out for Heuningbos (“honey bush”… it is naturally sweet and honey flavoured) another popular South African tea.

    Well, I got the number of Os right, I’ll work on the distribution now ;)
    Hmmm, I always thought that Rooibos and Honeybush were the same…
    Alt wie ne Kuh und lernst immer noch dazu (old as a cow but still learning)
    I’m not much of a tea drinker, but I came to Rooibos because of the kids: No theanine, no acidity (like most “fruit-teas”), no fennel or carraway.
    My favourite version has added coacoa-beans and vanilla

  411. carlie says

    Katherine – as mentioned already, it doesn’t have to be straight water, as long as it doesn’t have a diuretic component that will just wash out (heh) the benefits (like a lot of caffeine). Decaf or green or white tea, flavored water, decaf coffee, lemonade, etc. As for the remembering being the problem, a cute drinking container that you can keep out on your desk is probably the best bet. I have a friend who uses a hiking water bottle that has ounces marked on it so she knows exactly how much she’s had to drink during the day, but I find those to be a little too large and cumbersome.

    (Also, I’m pretty sure I remember reading that the whole “drink a gallon of water a day” thing is crap, because it doesn’t take into account the water from food.)

  412. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Giliell

    My three favourite South African teas Boegoe, Heuningbos and Rooibos. Though you might really like this idea:redespresso (I have been meaning to try this for a while. Luckily you reminded me. I’ll just bung some loose leaves in my espresso machine.)

  413. says

    Katherine, would it help at all to schedule time to drink water? Instead of just saying “I have to drink two large glasses of water every day,” you could say, “”I’ll have one small glass of water at 8 am, one at noon, and one at 4pm” (or whatever times work for you, obviously). You could even set a reminder on your phone or calendar. For me, making it more specific like that would help.

  415. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Kitty

    See the issue is that when I eat I feel worse than when I don’t eat, but when I don’t eat I feel terrible at the same time.

    Perhaps the dehydration is making it harder to eat? Anything at all you like drinking would be good. Just prevent dehydration as it can be very dangerous. I don’t wish to alarm you, but I do think it is imperative to find a solution.

    Though I have some (rather unfortunate) experience with cases of dehydration, I think I could best advise you to seek medical attention rather than just leave things as they are.

    Please keep Oral Rehydration Salts to hand (they are very cheap and effective and can be bought at pretty much any pharmacist. While there, talk to the pharmacist. They have pretty advanced training in such matters and may give you very effective advice with none of the costs of going to a regular doctor. (If cost is stalling you from seeking attention. I understand that this can be very difficult in the US.)

  416. Pteryxx says

    @Katherine, if eating *and* not eating both suck… perhaps an undetected food allergy is at fault? Or small-frequent nibbling might work better than actual meals. (Food prep can be really stressful for me sometimes… yay for instant oatmeal and water.)

  417. A. R says

    theophontes: I quite like Rooibos (tried it after it was suggested here I think), but I don’t have the same taste for other South African teas. Odd,I know.

  418. says

    @pteryxx:

    It’s more like when I’m hungry I have the usual hunger pangs – alongside a kind of general ill feeling (actually feeling that right now so I should get some lunch when I’m done this.) When I eat, I’m full, but since there are no more hunger pangs, the ill feeling comes across as worse than before since it’s all I notice.

  419. A. R says

    Kathrine: Firstly, I should ask if the ill feelings would be best described a nausea or pain. Also, oral rehydration therapy can also be accomplished with the following:

    30 ml (6 level tsp) of sugar
    2.5 ml (1/2 level tsp) of salt, dissolved into
    1 litre (4.25 Cups) of clean water mixed with
    500 ml (about 2 cups) Orange juice

    Some expedient recipes omit the orange juice, but since the juice provides potassium, they are by no means complete, or suitable for long term use.

  420. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Hi-ho, hi-ho, off to help transfer the Redhead to extended care Rehab.

  421. says

    Thanks for good wishes all. And to show the dangers of hubris, just returned home from the hospital. Emergency appendectomy yesterday afternoon. I really should get frequent flyer miles via the hospital. Won’t be back to check comments for a day or two. Hugs and thanks again.

  423. ChasCPeterson says

    The point being that Testudines are as charming as they are intelligent.

    no argument from me.

    Relatively famous turtle biologist Whit Gibbons once told me about a box turtle one of his friends kept in grad school that would literally sit up and ‘beg’–he swears it would tilt back and balance on its hind legs and shell–for ice cream!

  424. says

    The LDS Church has issued an official response to the ruling that Prop 8 is unconstitutional. Mormon leaders are, as usual, demonstrating that their brains are dense with The Stupid:

    On Tuesday, the church issued a statement saying it “regrets” the 9th Circuit decision and urging “mutual respect and civility” in the ongoing public debate.

    “California voters have twice determined in a general election that marriage should be recognized as only between a man and a woman. We have always had that view,” the LDS Church said. “Courts should not alter that definition, especially when the people of California have spoken so clearly on the subject.”

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/53464369-78/marriage-court-california-gay.html.csp

    Regretting that they spent so much time and money on not just a lost cause, but an ethically wrong cause?

  425. says

    Mormon politician, Orrin Hatch, commented about Prop 8:

    “Today, two federal judges substituted their own values for those of the 7 million Californians who enacted Proposition 8. This is judicial activism at its worst,” said a statement from Hatch, a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee. “This decision was not about the law, but about judges taking power away from the people.”

  426. says

    @Lynna:

    And I’m sure if a voter proposition were to be passed stating that the Mormon church needs to do something or other, they would claim it’s an injustice, that rights shouldn’t come down to a vote. It’s disgusting. I hate this ridiculous idea that the majority rules. If the majority ruled 50 years ago, black people would never be able to vote. If the majority ruled 100 years ago, women would not be able to vote.

    Rights should never come down to a popular vote.

  427. says

    Sample comments from mormons posting about the ruling that Prop 8 was unconstitutional:

    Fighting against decisions like this is not hate. It is supporting a loving God who wants all his children to live wholesome lives.

    Love the sinner, hate the sins. God created murderers, bank robbers, child molesters, shoplifters, those who create pornography, and every other person on earth. He gives them freedom to choose how to live their lives while on earth. It does not mean he is happy with the decisions all of us make. We all have our weaknesses. God sent us to earth to prove we can overcome those weaknesses. For some, the weakness is same sex attraction.

    Taking “religiousity” out of the equation. “The parts don’t fit”. There is no purpose for homosexuality. I love many women and many men, but I have not perverted those relationships.

    Let’s rebuild Sodom. Just why is man having sexual intercourse with another man something to cheer about?

  428. theophontes, Hexanitroisowurtzitanverwendendes_Bärtierchen says

    @ Lynna

    “mutual respect and civility”

    This from a troll who would deny a person the right to marry the love of their life.

    when the people of California have spoken so clearly on the subject.

    LDS have become democratic all of a sudden? *snorfle*

  429. says

    How weird is it that I’ve spent a good portion of the day realizing the patterns in math? Adding up each of the numbers does really neat things:

    Addition of 1 naturally goes 1,2,3,4 etc. up until 10, which you add together to become 1, and 11 becomes 2, and 12 becomes 3, and then 19 becomes 10 becomes 1.
    Similarly addition of 2 goes 2,4,6,8,1,3,5,7,9. 3 goes 3,6,9 repeating. 4 goes 4,8,3,7,2,6,1,5,9. 5 is 5,1,6,2,7,3,8,4,9. 6 is 6,3,9 repeating. 7 is 7,5,3,1,8,6,4,2,9. 8 is 8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1,9. 9 is 9 repeating.

    It’s cool…

    I’m crazy.

  430. says

    And I’m sure if a voter proposition were to be passed stating that the Mormon church needs to do something or other, they would claim it’s an injustice, that rights shouldn’t come down to a vote.

    Good point. Perhaps we could drum up a popular vote banning mormons from marrying.

    We could prove the case that mormons should not marry, nor procreate, nor adopt children because, overall, their religion has been shown to be deleterious.

  431. chigau (違う) says

    Kitty
    When I have insomnia I try to find the prime factors of the time, in my head, in less than one minute.
    (treating, for example, 2:07AM as 207. 3x3x23)

  432. says

    @Lynna:

    I agree!

    Oh wait, I’m not that malicious and I believe one should be allowed to have rights regardless of political slant / religious beliefs / sexual orientation / race / gender / gender identity / ability / age – and as long as those rights do not impact anyone else’s rights… dang! Stupid morals, I thought I wasn’t supposed to have any when I became an *wiggles fingers maliciously* atheist *lightning strikes!*

  433. says

    @chigau:

    Yay, math nerds! *high-fives!*

    Sucks though cause I’ve got discalculia and I can’t do math in my head without visually interpreting the numbers. You won’t guess how many times it took me to write out most of those patterns because I kept mixing up numbers.

  434. carlie says

    Katherine – maybe soup? A clear one like chicken noodle but hold the noodles? Packaged ones have a lot of salt and other electrolytes, and some calories put in for the energy, and you can drink it warm and it might help with feeling better overall.

    JeffreyD – That’s it, mister, you have to go sit in the corner for awhile and think about, um, not having scary things happen to you!
    But seriously, shaky hugs because that scares me even thinking about it. I’m glad you’re ok.

  435. opposablethumbs, que le pouce enragé mette les pouces says

    Hope the Redhead’s transfer goes smoothly, Nerd!
    .

    And Jeffrey, aaargh re the frequent flyer miles. Hopefully they’ve cut enough bits off/out of you now and will allow you to cease and desist from darkening their doors for a good long stretch.
    .
    Kitty, I drink litres and litres of maté “tea” every day while I’m working – hopefully if you can pick something you like drinking enough, you’ll just do it without having to worry about reminding yourself? (getting up to make the next cup is my mini-get-away-from-the-keyboard-and-move-your-hands-to-stave-off-RSI break).

  436. A. R says

    Kathrine, you may want to ask for an Antinuclear antibody (ANA) test and Complete Blood Count (CBC) with leukocyte. differentiation. If you are in the US of course, cost could be a problem. Hope you can resolve your health issue.

  437. Richard Austin says

    Katherine:

    1^2 = 1
    2^2 = 4 (1+3) (2 odds)
    3^2 = 9 (1+3+5) (3 odds)
    4^2 = 16 (1+3+5+7) (4 odds)
    5^2 = 25 (1+3+5+7+9) (5 odds)
    …
    10^2 = 100 (1+3+5+7+9+11+13+15+17+19) (10 odds)

    (I figured that out in second grade. It still makes me giggle.)

  438. Sili says

    AAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!

    I’ve just started listening the Price’s Bible Geek Podcast, which I find amusing, but the fucktard is just now spending 15 odd minutes reading without any doubt whatsoever from the AGW denialist letters. Absolutely no critical thinking while rattling off denialist talking points.

    This from a guy who denies arguments from authority on the matter of Biblical authorship and exegesis.

    Gahhh!

  439. cicely (Vitamin Fortified!) says

    Josh, thanks much! I shall message D-i-L forthwith; the reassurance that chemical assistance is within their budget limits should greatly diminish her anxiety pool. *manymanymany hugs and smoochies*
    –

    How is (are) everyone?

    In danger of falling asleep. The caffeine, it does nothing.

    I blame the weather.
    –

    Let’s see you light one.

    What if I assplode? :’(

    “I don’t know what happened in that bathroom, but I am not cleaning it up!”
    –

    I don’t care if it’s offensive to your tastes or your religion, it’s destroying something which can’t come back!

    Which would be (part of) the point. Then they can pretend it never happened.

    What would have happened if the Conquistadors wiped out all traces of the ancient Mexican civilizations?

    They did their level best to destroy their literature; and unsurprisingly, with a religious rationalisation. The more things change….

    We’d never have known about the amazing and interesting cultures that thrived in that land for years before Europeans found them.

    Again, then they could pretend it never happened.
    –
    Jeffrey, *hugs* and commiserations on your Surprise Appendectomy.

    Son had one of those a couple of years back. At first he thought it was psychosomatic, since one of his co-workers had just finished giving play-by-play on her appendicitis attack, and he called to ask me if I knew what appendicitis felt like, so he could cross-check his symptoms. I couldn’t help him out, there (that’s one piece of Factory Equipment that, AFAIK, is functioning properly!), but within 20 minutes he was no longer in doubt.
    –

  440. says

    Jeffrey, there are better ways to get frequent flyer miles. May you soon employ them. Seriously, quick recovery wishes coming your way.

    Change of subject: more on the LDS Church response to the ruling that Prop 8 was unconstitutional – in a mormon-owned news outlet the point was made that the dissenting judge is a true believing mormon.

    What fewer people seemed to mention was that a member of the LDS church sat on the panel, and was the only dissenting vote. Judge Randy Smith, who was appointed to the court by George W. Bush, was born in Logan, Utah and attended Brigham Young University and J. Reuben Clarke law school in the 1970s. He taught at various institutions in Idaho and currently resides in Pocatello.

    Smith’s dissenting opinion claimed that Proposition 8 did not simply treat gays and lesbians as second-class citizens.

    The Sutherland Institute [also a bunch of rabid mormons], a conservative think tank based in Utah, came out against the ruling as well, specifically saying that the decision incorrectly put the judges in the driver’s seat, constitutionally speaking.

    “The basic point to make about this decision is that it very effectively accomplishes one thing: It elevates the idea of judicial supremacy as the primary constitutional value,” said William C. Duncan. “It is more important, the court is saying, to preserve the conceit that the courts can read into state and national constitutions rights that no one knew or would have believed were there than to allow voters to come to a different conclusion about the basic laws by which they will be governed.” Duncan is the director of the Sutherland Institute’s Center for Family and Society.

    And, lo, there is a poll on the same page.
    Do you think Proposition 8 is constitutional?
    1. Yes, the law is constitutional.
    2. No, the law is unconstitutional.

    The poll replies are currently running over 70% for #1, “Yes, the law is constitutional.”

    Mormon communities are so dense with willful ignorance, with glorying in ignorance, that I’m surprised they are not all sucked into the Kolobian black hole.

  441. drbunsen le savant fou says

    You’re a New Age slurry

    NB: one of the meanings of “slurry” is pretty misogynistic.
    .

    Part-Time Insomniac:

    Maybe I’m just paranoid, but better safe than sorry.

    

Entirely understood.
    .

    The Rachel Maddow Show has de-voted a number of segments to the issue of disenfranchising eligible voters.

    :D

  442. Richard Austin says

    Another aspect of #437 (which I’ve used when doing napkin math):

    40^2 = 40 x 40 = 1600
    40 x 41 = (40^2) + 40 = 1640
    41 x 41 = (40^2) + 40 + 41= 1681
    41^2 = 1681

    Basically, n^2 = (n-1)^2+2n-1, which again comes in handy for napkin math: since “_0” squares are usually easier, you can start from there and work up (or down).

  443. Esteleth, Ph.D. of Mischief, Mayhem and Hilarity says

    Blearg. Totally thread bankrupt, haven’t even looked at the thread in 2 days.

    On Prop 8 overturning: hooray!

    I am a bit concerned about the narrowness of the ruling. Of course, it is going to be appealed. The way I see it, there are 4 possibilities:

    1) The SC denies cert, the lower court’s ruling stands. Same-sex marriage is legalized in CA, but it is not national. DOMA is unaffected.

    2) The SC hears the case, rules very narrowly to overturn Prop 8, but not apply it nationally. Same-sex marriage is legalized in CA, not everywhere else, DOMA is unaffected.

    3) The SC hears the case, upholds Prop 8 (worst possible outcome), on a 5-4 vote.

    4) The SC hears the case, overturns Prop 8 (most likely also 5-4), upholds Walker’s findings of fact. Same-sex marriage is legalized nationwide, DOMA ruled unconstitutional (best possible outcome).

    Now. The SC has a long-standing policy of not chasing “political” cases, which might lead them to deny cert. Of course, they’ve been ignoring this recently and might do so again. The Court also knows that, if they hear the case, the ruling WILL be 5-4 (I think that’s a given). They dislike issuing 5-4 rulings, because it looks political (duh, it IS). There’s probably also a lot of hesitance amongst the diehards (Scalia, et al) that the ruling could go against them, which might lead them to vote to deny cert (granting of cert requires 4 justices in favor). Of course, there are now contradictory rulings, which is the sort of situation the SC was created to deal with.

  444. Richard Austin says

    Esteleth:

    This specific ruling, even if taken up by the SC, isn’t going to be very wide. The major points hinge on the fact that California has everything-but-marriage civil unions, so at best it could only be applicable to states where that is also the case.

    For that reason alone, I think the SC isn’t likely to take it up: there’s really no major national issue at question. Plus the conservative elements of the court have to know that the Prop8 defense team did a horrible job; they probably don’t want the facts of this case being the basis for defense of “traditional marriage” on a national level, simply because the facts (from their perspective) suck.

  445. walton says

    The decision can be appealed directly to the full 9th district or, theoretically, directly to the Supreme Court.

    This is a very narrow ruling: a major point hinges on the fact that, in California, civil unions are “everything but the name” of marriage; the majority of the arguments are that, in denying just the name and nothing else, there’s an unfair distinction being drawn. So, I doubt this would affect most other states./blockquote>

    Yep. Although they could have done, the Court explicitly did not decide whether there is a general constitutional right to same-sex marriage.

    Rather, the majority of the Court laid emphasis on the fact that Proposition 8 represented the selective deprivation of a pre-existing right, since same-sex couples had the right to marry in California before Proposition 8 was enacted. The Court applied the principle, laid down in Romer v. Evans, that the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment prevents minority groups from being targeted for the deprivation of a pre-existing right without a legitimate reason. (The decision in Romer concerned a state constitutional amendment in Colorado which specifically banned the state legislature or any political subdivision of the state from providing any legal protection against discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation. The Supreme Court found that amendment to be unconstitutional, on the basis that it “singled out a class of citizens for disfavored legal status” without any legitimate justification.) This doesn’t necessarily mean that there is a universal constitutional right to same-sex marriage; it simply means that the state can’t single out a particular class of people and arbitrarily deprive them of a right which everyone else enjoys, unless it has a legitimate reason for doing so. So the judgment has implications for states where same-sex couples previously enjoyed the right to marry but were deprived of that right, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that states in which same-sex marriage has never been legal are required to legalize it.

    On the facts of the case, the majority found that there was no legitimate reason for depriving gay and lesbian couples of this specific right. They particularly emphasized the fact that the only effect of Proposition 8 was to deny same-sex couples the right to use the term “marriage”; it didn’t prevent them from entering into registered domestic partnerships, adopting children, or exercising the other substantive legal rights of married couples. The fact that Proposition 8 didn’t make any difference to any substantive legal rights other than the right to use the term “marriage”, though, did not mean that its effects were trivial. The Court explicitly recognized the cultural importance of the term “marriage”, and found that marriage is “the principal manner in which the State attaches respect and dignity to the highest form of a committed relationship and to the individuals who have entered into it.” To take the label of “marriage” away from same-sex couples and to force them to use the term “registered domestic partnership” instead, therefore, deprived them of an important symbol of “state legitimization and societal recognition of their committed relationships”.

    As such, they rejected the arguments of the defendants and amici curiae that Proposition 8 served the purpose of “furthering California’s interest in childrearing and responsible procreation”, in “protecting religious liberty”, or in “preventing children being taught about same-sex marriage in schools”, since Proposition 8 didn’t actually do anything to advance any of those objectives; it had absolutely no effect on the laws governing parenting and adoption, religious freedom, or the school curriculum. All it did was to deny same-sex couples the right to use the term “marriage”. (This doesn’t imply that the Court would have considered those to be legitimate justifications for taking rights away from gay and lesbian people; rather, they simply held those justifications to be irrelevant on the facts of the case.) They found, instead, that the only reason for the enactment of Proposition 8 was “disapproval” of “gays and lesbians as a class”, and that the Equal Protection Clause does not allow a group to be singled out for deprivation of rights based purely on disapproval of that group, without any other reason. Thus, Proposition 8 infringed the Equal Protection Clause.

    1) The SC denies cert, the lower court’s ruling stands. Same-sex marriage is legalized in CA, but it is not national. DOMA is unaffected.

    2) The SC hears the case, rules very narrowly to overturn Prop 8, but not apply it nationally. Same-sex marriage is legalized in CA, not everywhere else, DOMA is unaffected.

    3) The SC hears the case, upholds Prop 8 (worst possible outcome), on a 5-4 vote.

    4) The SC hears the case, overturns Prop 8 (most likely also 5-4), upholds Walker’s findings of fact. Same-sex marriage is legalized nationwide, DOMA ruled unconstitutional (best possible outcome).

    Well, it’s worth noting that the reasoning of the majority in the Ninth Circuit relied explicitly on the Supreme Court decision in Romer, and that the two cases are very closely analogous. Kennedy, who is usually regarded as the swing vote, wrote the majority opinion of the Court in Romer, so I think he’s extremely unlikely to change his mind now if Perry reaches the Supreme Court.

    Scalia, of course, would dissent, as he did in Romer. (Indeed, I was just reading his dissenting opinion in Romer; it’s one of the most vitriolic rants I’ve ever read in a judicial opinion.) Thomas joined Scalia’s dissenting opinion in Romer, and would probably do so again. I can’t predict what Alito will do, since he wasn’t on the Court when Romer was decided; if I had the time I’d comb through his Third Circuit opinions looking for clues, but I don’t.

  446. walton says

    Apparently my geeky excitement about constitutional law impairs my ability to use blockquotes properly. Let’s try that again.

    The decision can be appealed directly to the full 9th district or, theoretically, directly to the Supreme Court.

    This is a very narrow ruling: a major point hinges on the fact that, in California, civil unions are “everything but the name” of marriage; the majority of the arguments are that, in denying just the name and nothing else, there’s an unfair distinction being drawn. So, I doubt this would affect most other states.

    Yep. Although they could have done, the Court explicitly did not decide whether there is a general constitutional right to same-sex marriage.

    Rather, the majority of the Court laid emphasis on the fact that Proposition 8 represented the selective deprivation of a pre-existing right, since same-sex couples had the right to marry in California before Proposition 8 was enacted. The Court applied the principle, laid down in Romer v. Evans, that the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment prevents minority groups from being targeted for the deprivation of a pre-existing right without a legitimate reason. (The decision in Romer concerned a state constitutional amendment in Colorado which specifically banned the state legislature or any political subdivision of the state from providing any legal protection against discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation. The Supreme Court found that amendment to be unconstitutional, on the basis that it “singled out a class of citizens for disfavored legal status” without any legitimate justification.) This doesn’t necessarily mean that there is a universal constitutional right to same-sex marriage; it simply means that the state can’t single out a particular class of people and arbitrarily deprive them of a right which everyone else enjoys, unless it has a legitimate reason for doing so. So the judgment has implications for states where same-sex couples previously enjoyed the right to marry but were deprived of that right, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that states in which same-sex marriage has never been legal are required to legalize it.

    On the facts of the case, the majority found that there was no legitimate reason for depriving gay and lesbian couples of this specific right. They particularly emphasized the fact that the only effect of Proposition 8 was to deny same-sex couples the right to use the term “marriage”; it didn’t prevent them from entering into registered domestic partnerships, adopting children, or exercising the other substantive legal rights of married couples. The fact that Proposition 8 didn’t make any difference to any substantive legal rights other than the right to use the term “marriage”, though, did not mean that its effects were trivial. The Court explicitly recognized the cultural importance of the term “marriage”, and found that marriage is “the principal manner in which the State attaches respect and dignity to the highest form of a committed relationship and to the individuals who have entered into it.” To take the label of “marriage” away from same-sex couples and to force them to use the term “registered domestic partnership” instead, therefore, deprived them of an important symbol of “state legitimization and societal recognition of their committed relationships”.

    As such, they rejected the arguments of the defendants and amici curiae that Proposition 8 served the purpose of “furthering California’s interest in childrearing and responsible procreation”, in “protecting religious liberty”, or in “preventing children being taught about same-sex marriage in schools”, since Proposition 8 didn’t actually do anything to advance any of those objectives; it had absolutely no effect on the laws governing parenting and adoption, religious freedom, or the school curriculum. All it did was to deny same-sex couples the right to use the term “marriage”. (This doesn’t imply that the Court would have considered those to be legitimate justifications for taking rights away from gay and lesbian people; rather, they simply held those justifications to be irrelevant on the facts of the case.) They found, instead, that the only reason for the enactment of Proposition 8 was “disapproval” of “gays and lesbians as a class”, and that the Equal Protection Clause does not allow a group to be singled out for deprivation of rights based purely on disapproval of that group, without any other reason. Thus, Proposition 8 infringed the Equal Protection Clause.

    1) The SC denies cert, the lower court’s ruling stands. Same-sex marriage is legalized in CA, but it is not national. DOMA is unaffected.

    2) The SC hears the case, rules very narrowly to overturn Prop 8, but not apply it nationally. Same-sex marriage is legalized in CA, not everywhere else, DOMA is unaffected.

    3) The SC hears the case, upholds Prop 8 (worst possible outcome), on a 5-4 vote.

    4) The SC hears the case, overturns Prop 8 (most likely also 5-4), upholds Walker’s findings of fact. Same-sex marriage is legalized nationwide, DOMA ruled unconstitutional (best possible outcome).

    Well, it’s worth noting that the reasoning of the majority in the Ninth Circuit relied explicitly on the Supreme Court decision in Romer, and that the two cases are very closely analogous. Kennedy, who is usually regarded as the swing vote, wrote the majority opinion of the Court in Romer, so I think he’s extremely unlikely to change his mind now if Perry reaches the Supreme Court.

    Scalia, of course, would dissent, as he did in Romer. (Indeed, I was just reading his dissenting opinion in Romer; it’s one of the most vitriolic rants I’ve ever read in a judicial opinion.) Thomas joined Scalia’s dissenting opinion in Romer, and would probably do so again. I can’t predict what Alito will do, since he wasn’t on the Court when Romer was decided; if I had the time I’d comb through his Third Circuit opinions looking for clues, but I don’t.

  447. A. R says

    Richard @444: Agreed. The court will not grant cert. Some other means is likely needed to bring marriage equality before the court.

  448. Esteleth, Ph.D. of Mischief, Mayhem and Hilarity says

    I agree, the SC is unlikely to grant cert. Eventually, they will have to rule on marriage equality (the multiple contradictory rulings will force their hand), but it is unlikely to be this case.
    It’ll get appealed to the 9th. I’m not sure how they’ll rule. If the appeal goes to the SC (okay, when), they’ll probably deny cert. And then, it’s onto the next case.

  449. says

    birgerjohannson:

    1. Carlos Miller has long run a blog entitled “Photography Is Not a Crime”, and has been arrested at least once before. This ain’t his first rodeo.

    2. I’d love to see (and hell, I may even create) an app that streams video wirelessly to all other devices running the same app in an area. This way, if one phone or video camera gets confiscated and wiped, there are other copies.

    Richard:

    (n+1)^2 = n^2 + 2n + 1

    All:

    I saw They Might Be Giants and JoCo last night.

    Awesomeness.

  450. says

    Walton @ 446

    Scalia, of course, would dissent, as he did in Romer. (Indeed, I was just reading his dissenting opinion in Romer; it’s one of the most vitriolic rants I’ve ever read in a judicial opinion.)

    Referring to the link Walton provided, I scrolled down (and down) to read Scalia’s dissent. Jesus Fucking Christ. This guy is a judge? Let alone Supreme Court Justice?

    No wonder Republican candidates like Romney have signed a pledge to nominate only conservative judges. They have to pledge to discriminate against intelligence and for stupidity.

    Below is just an excerpt from Scalia’s rant. Emphasis mine:

    JUSTICE SCALIA, with whom THE CHIEF JUSTICE and JUSTICE THOMAS join, dissenting.

    The Court has mistaken a Kulturkampf for a fit of spite. The constitutional amendment before us here is not the manifestation of a “`bare . . . desire to harm'” homosexuals, ante, at 13, but is rather a modest attempt by seemingly tolerant Coloradans to preserve traditional sexual mores against the efforts of a politically powerful minority to revise those mores through use of the laws. That objective, and the means chosen to achieve it, are not only unimpeachable under any constitutional doctrine hitherto pronounced (hence the opinion’s heavy reliance upon principles of righteousness rather than judicial holdings); they have been specifically approved by the Congress of the United States and by this Court.

    In holding that homosexuality cannot be singled out for disfavorable treatment, the Court contradicts a decision, unchallenged here, pronounced only 10 years ago, see Bowers v. Hardwick, 478 U.S. 186 (1986), and places the prestige of this institution behind the proposition that opposition to homosexuality is as reprehensible as racial or religious bias. Whether it is or not is precisely the cultural debate that gave rise to the Colorado constitutional amendment (and to the preferential laws against which the amendment was directed). Since the Constitution of the United States says nothing about [ ROMER v. EVANS, ___ U.S. ___ (1996) , 2] this subject, it is left to be resolved by normal democratic means, including the democratic adoption of provisions in state constitutions. This Court has no business imposing upon all Americans the resolution favored by the elite class from which the Members of this institution are selected, pronouncing that “animosity” toward homosexuality, ante, at 13, is evil. I vigorously dissent.

    So, to summarize, Justice Scalia is of the opinion that homosexuality can be singled out for disfavorable treatment.

  451. Esteleth, Ph.D. of Mischief, Mayhem and Hilarity says

    Antonin Scalia is an asshat. A creepy, dishonest, horrifying asshat.

    That’s really all I have to say on that subject.

  452. says

    I’m repeating the link to this poll so that it can be properly pharyngulated. The poll is on a mormon-owned website for KSL, and it is currently running at 71% for the constitutionality of Prop 8. All those mormons think Prop 8 is just fine, it being constitutionally correct and all. Sheesh.

    Scroll down to find the poll embedded in the article.

    Do you think Proposition 8 is constitutional?
    1. Yes, the law is constitutional.
    2. No, the law is unconstitutional.

    http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=19153139&title=lds-church-others-respond-to-prop-8-decision&s_cid=queue-11

  453. says

    Here’s Mitt Romney’s statement about the Prop 8 ruling:

    “Today, unelected judges cast aside the will of the people of California who voted to protect traditional marriage. This decision does not end this fight, and I expect it to go to the Supreme Court. That prospect underscores the vital importance of this election and the movement to preserve our values. I believe marriage is between a man and a woman and, as president, I will protect traditional marriage and appoint judges who interpret the Constitution as it is written and not according to their own politics and prejudices.”

    Romney may have graduated from Harvard but essential parts of his brain are not in working order.

  454. Predator Handshake says

    Benjamin @449: I’m jealous! I saw them a few years ago and realized that John Linell looked a lot like a younger version of one of my professors at the time. They turned out not to be the same person, though. Did they play Tubthumpin?

  455. Richard Austin says

    Benjamin:

    Yeah, I know the algebra on it, and I added the equation (reversed from yours) for fun, but it’s the simple logic behind it that seems to catch people by surprise. People who shriek at polynomials can grasp “add the number, then add the next number” easily.

  456. walton says

    No wonder Republican candidates like Romney have signed a pledge to nominate only conservative judges. They have to pledge to discriminate against intelligence and for stupidity.

    Well, Scalia is an ideologue; his general view is that the rights protected by the Constitution should be read very narrowly. His view is that it is for the democratic process, not unelected judges, to decide whether or not to recognize new rights. His argument would be that the Fourteenth Amendment was never understood by its framers to guarantee equal rights to gay and lesbian people, and that the courts have no institutional mandate to “update” the Constitution to reflect today’s values; he’d say that if you want equal rights for gay and lesbian people, you should go to the legislature, or to the people, and convince them to vote for equal rights. (Of course, the problem with this philosophy is that if it were applied consistently, one would have to get rid of pretty much all the progressive decisions of the twentieth century, including Brown v. Board of Education and Loving v. Virginia, and give the majority unfettered power to take away the rights of minorities it doesn’t like, without any judicial intervention. Scalia gets around this by periodically carving out arbitrary exceptions to his own view.)

    Occasionally, he pisses off conservatives as well as liberals with this attitude. For instance, his majority opinion concerning the Free Exercise Clause in Employment Division, Department of Human Resources of Oregon v. Smith really upset the religious right, to the point that Republicans in Congress sponsored the “Religious Freedom Restoration Act” in an attempt to undo the effect of the decision. (Not so much because of the actual facts of the case, but because of the sweeping reasoning he used, which really limited the effects of the Free Exercise Clause, and effectively reversed the earlier landmark decision Sherbert v. Verner.) The other conservatives on the Court – particularly Alito – don’t tend to take the same view as Scalia when it comes to religious liberties.

    In LGBT rights cases, though, Scalia tends to be particularly nasty in his language. He’s personally very homophobic; I remember that when I heard him speak at the Oxford Union, he kept referring to “homosexual sodomy” in his remarks, apparently seeing nothing wrong with this way of describing same-sex relations. And of course he dissented in Lawrence v. Texas, in which state laws criminalizing consensual homosexuality were struck down on constitutional grounds.

  457. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Fuck, I just pissed the ex off, again.

    Her sister has swallowed that ‘Eat right for your blood type’ crap. I didn’t even SAY anything about her sister, after all, when the fucking NHS is promoting this shit, you can’t blame the average canadian for buying it.

    She gets mad at me for getting mad about shit like that, because apparently I’m just supposed to ignore any bullshit or injustice that doesn’t personally affect me. Except when I do talk about the stuff that affects me, and then suddenly ‘There’s kids starving to death in Africa…’

    And then she tells me I should ‘live my life instead of sitting around all day getting pissed about this stuff…’ you know, because I never hang around with my friends, or go see her and The Kid, or go off in the woods, or do anything I enjoy, but just sit around and hate on things. I’m so fucking sick of this stereotype, it’s been stapled to my ass like Eeyore’s fucking tail all my life.

    I understand I get a bit passionate about things, but for fuck’s sake am I just supposed to ignore the fact that a respected national health service is lying to fucking Canada and calling it ‘a fun way to get people to donate’?

  458. walton says

    Romney may have graduated from Harvard but essential parts of his brain are not in working order.

    To be honest, I doubt Romney gives a flying fuck about traditional marriage or unelected judges. He believes, first and foremost, in getting elected. I doubt there’s any idea so stupid that he wouldn’t endorse it if he thought it would play well with the base. If polls showed that the majority of Republican voters supported the compulsory serving of asparagus for breakfast, Romney would be right there promoting the Asparagus For All Americans Act of 2012.

  459. Esteleth, Ph.D. of Mischief, Mayhem and Hilarity says

    My father once commented that he likes reading Scalia’s opinions because, even if he disagrees with them, they are rhetorically powerful, as Scalia is a skilled writer, and frequently hilarious.

    Out of curiosity, I sought out a few of his opinions. I think I found Lawrence v. Texas and Romer v. Evans.

    I concluded that (1) Scalia does, in fact, have a way with words, and (2) the only person who could find him funny or enjoyable reading material (even for the sake of snark) is someone who isn’t threatened by Scalia’s positions. Like, say, a cisgendered, heterosexual, middle-class mainstream-Christian white man.

  460. says

    Predator Handshake:

    Not that I could tell, and I’m pretty sure I could recognize Tubthumping.

    The Avatars of They performed Paranoid and a few other things.

    Istanbul during the second(!) encore. There’s something primal and powerful about group singing, and it’s even more powerful when combined with the sort of Tarzan-yell in the middle of that song.

    Kinda bummed they didn’t do Particle Man or Experimental Film, though. :-/

    I was right up against the stage for most of JoCo’s act, but I got tired of not actually being able to see him. All I could see was a partial silhouette, because he was standing directly between me and a fuckin’ huge light. So I went back a few rows (amazing how humans form into rows even when standing in a crowd) and went closer to the centerline.

    My feet still hurt, but at least I had an awesome night (and a signed JoCo CD… presigned; I didn’t get a chance to meet him).

  462. Just_A_Lurker says

    Yay, on Prop 8 overturned!

    Hope it goes well Nerd. Best wishes for you and the Redhead.

    Best wishes/Congrats/Commiserations where appropriate for everypony. Sorry I’m totally thread bankrupt on everything else.

    Fuck, I just pissed the ex off, again.

    Her sister has swallowed that ‘Eat right for your blood type’ crap. I didn’t even SAY anything about her sister, after all, when the fucking NHS is promoting this shit, you can’t blame the average canadian for buying it.

    Oh. Ugh. Hate that. Deal with similar issues with my ex when he comes to see the Little One. I unfortunately have no advice, I wish I knew how to deal with it. Good luck? =(

  463. Esteleth, Ph.D. of Mischief, Mayhem and Hilarity says

    ‘Eat right for your blood type’

    WTF is that?

  464. Predator Handshake says

    Benjamin Geiger: I was asking because I read that they had started playing the song live sometimes. You can find a video of them performing it at AVClub if you’re interested; they did it as a part of their “AV Undercover” series. I like it because they keep the song recognizable while still injecting plenty of Two John-ness into it.

  466. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Esteleth: Fucking stupid arbitrary lists of foods that are ‘Right’ for various blood types. Stuff like “Red peppers are bad for people with o positive” or “Blueberries are especially good for people with B negative”. Shit in that sort of vein.

    I learned what ‘Blood type’ meant in 8th grade science class. 8th fucking grade. I’m no immunologist, but I know what you eat has fuck all to do with your blood type. Unless by blood type you mean ‘Human.’

    My ex’s poor nephew has to suffer under this woo. You should see the garbage she sends with him and expects him to eat. I wouldn’t feed it to a seagull, Drano would be kinder.

  467. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Thanks, J.A.L.

    I think what bugs me is… usually I just piss her off by accident and feel stupid… this time, I’m just a tiny bit annoyed with her in return.

    I’m sick of people I know trying to cast me as this miserable hater. My 7th grade teacher told me to ‘Come to the light side, Cale!’ right in front of the entire class, and yes, it did sound every bit as smug, condescending, and insulting as you just read it, even to 12 year old me.

    It’s almost as if I only exist to spread hate and misery in their minds, you know, like a comic book supervillain who just wants to destroy the world because ‘Fuck you, that’s why.’

  468. says

    Walton, as far as I can tell, Romney fools himself. He does not realize that he doesn’t believe in anything but getting elected. He thinks he has firm beliefs, but is pleasantly fuzzy about what those are since an intellectual spotlight on said beliefs makes them run for cover like cockroaches.

    His actions demonstrate that he is an oily businessman of very little brain, and of even less empathy.

    But he is so lacking in self-awareness that he doesn’t seem himself that way. I think he has a special mormon mirror that reflects Good Mitt every time he pays his tithing.

  473. A. R says

    TLC: When I was a kid, my mother believed that load of santorum, along with a bunch of other nonsensical diets. The food was absolutely terrible, and I’m fairly sure it may have caused some minor nutritional deficiencies. I think the theory has something to do with RBC bound antigens interacting with food lectins, which somehow creates real, physiological effects. I actually traveled to Hartford CA to an appointment with the quack when I was 12. Fairly sure that experience was one of the reasons I started reading Carl Sagan.

  474. Ichthyic says

    You can open an Amazon account and read books on a PC … it seems a bit strange you can’t do the same on that device (cutting off one’s nose to spite one’s face…). Are they blocking the option? What format are you on?

    yes, self-spite indeed.

    Barnes and Noble does the exact same thing: no access to their online ebook bookstore or appstore from NZ.

    Yes, you CAN access these things with your PC or Mac instead, and then simply manually copy the books or apps over.

    but just as a stand-alone product? Nope, the readers will not access them from this area.

    Why they do this? I think it’s because they figure the only real difference between any of the readers is access to custom content, so they limit access to their own custom content base, thinking that this will get them more money.

    It’s fucking stupid, since really the first of them that offer just DISCOUNTS on their custom stock for users of their readers, instead of trying to FORCE them to only go there, will simply win this battle outright.

    That said, why do they not allow Kiwis access to their custom content at all?

    I can only guess the market here is deemed too small to make the effort to deal with even the tiny differences (if there even are any!) in licensing agreements etc.

    *shrug*

    did you know that NZ has one of the highest proportions of software piracy in the Western World?

    well, now you know why. I’ve meet hundreds of Kiwis who have flat out told me they simply cannot even get access to content THEY WOULD PAY FOR, so have no choice but to pirate it from other sources.

    IOW, these distributors, the same ones that support things like SOPA, have ENCOURAGED piracy through their own idiotic marketing and distribution policies.

    It’s been an eye opening experience, to be sure.

  475. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    To be fair to my ex, she also agrees that ‘Eat Right for your BLood Type’ is pure horseshit and would never impose it on The Kid.

    IOW, she’s unintentionally tone-trolling me? I dunno.

    I’m just fucking fed up with people who think I ‘shouldn’t be so negative’ and try to dismiss me as some pathetic hatemongering loser. It was fucked up when Teacher did it on purpose to shame me for the whole class in 7th grade, and it’s fucked when people do it now.

    It’s also absolutely fucked up whenever it happens to any of you, which I’m reasonably sure it does.

  476. Ichthyic says

    oh, btw, if you buy the reader in the US, you can use it to access Sony’s “bookstore” from Waterstones and WHSmiths online.

    of course, we Kiwis can’t EVEN DO THAT.

    no shit. It says that access to the store from our area won’t be available until next fall… sometime…

    LOL

    so, yeah, basically what I do is access whatever bookstore I want from my PC instead, dowload the books to my PC, convert them as necessary, and then copy them to the library on the Sony.

    It kinda defeats the whole purpose of having wireless access to be able to buy books wherever I am, instead of having to be near my computer, but I suppose it’s no great loss, just… irksome. Especially since we also have to pay full retail (and often more) for every gadget here.

    I paid NZD 230.00 for this reader, while you in the States can buy it for 99.00 USD (conversion rate is about .80, so you can see it’s still way overpriced in NZ).

    OK, enough rants.

    just fair warning to those who are thinking about spending time down here in the Forgotten World.

  477. jamesmichaels1 says

    So I have a friend who, like me, has recently abandoned her Christianity due to simple lack of evidence. I require some assistance, however, on one matter:

    The friend I have still has issues with evolution, an unfortunate hangover from having been a Christian. While I myself have recognised the scientific validity of evolution, I’m not too good at attempting to explain the science.

    One method I have tried using is explaining how multiple languages (French, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese) share a common ancestry with Latin, but can you guys think of any other good analogies and general explanations that would be useful in explaining evolution to her? Don’t worry, unlike Simon, she is more open to actual facts.

    Actually, I could probably do with something similar for explaining global warming as well. That’s another unfortunate disbelief she has. I’d be absolutely delighted with any help you can bring.

    Much thanks,

    James

  478. Rey Fox says

    Not that I could tell, and I’m pretty sure I could recognize Tubthumping.

    Follow-up question: Did they play “I Get Knocked Down, But I Get Up Again”?

  480. says

    Drbunsen, #441: Wow. I had never heard that before. Ugh….

    Benjamin, #449: FUCK Carlos Miller. He defended some asshole who went up to a 17-year-old girl who was doing ballet pliés on a sidewalk for a film crew and snapped a photo of her crotch.

    I ended a friendship with another asshole who blamed the girl for, essentially, being “stupid” enough to be out in public. This same asshole thinks it’s perfectly fine, just because it’s legal, to take photos of strange women in public for his private amusement.

    I am so, so, so sick of creepy men hiding behind “But, but, but it’s legal!!!” in order to do creepy shit.

  481. changeable moniker says

    Woe is me. The Place Of Work™ has classified FTB as “Alternative Spirituality/Belief;Political/Activist Groups” and access has been rescinded.

    Google Reader gets me posts, but not comments. So–eek!–no TET.

    I may never be caught up again. :-/

  482. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    JamesMichaels1: I’ve always been obsessed with ‘monsters’ and monstrous creatures. Once I exhausted most of the interesting mythological monsters, I started looking to the fossil record and finding some real nice ones. This was pretty much all the explanation I really needed for evolution, though. Imagine all these fucking creatures, existing on the same planet at the same time. Either we’d be talking population sizes of 10-50, or the world would have to be several times bigger for all of this life to coexist for even a short while.

    If you want something really compelling though, IMO you should look to the whales. Fascinating stuff has been happening lately in the study of whale evolution, and whales were always a favorite example for creationists to pull out of their asses.

    We have a pretty good idea now of how whale evolution went and more than enough fossil species to demonstrate this. True there’ll always be unanswered questions, but we have a pretty good idea of how a four legged land animal became a two-finned aquatic mammal.

    You could also point him to some of the wonderful feathered dinosaur fossils, though I think the whales might be more effective.

  483. janine says

    Here is one book, jamesmicheals1, that I would highly recommend: Your Inner Fish: A Journey into the 3.5-Billion-Year History of the Human Body by Neil Shubin. It is written for a general audience. Neil Shubin describes how a team of scientists from different fields were able to pool their knowledge in order to figure out the most likely spot to find a yet not found species that had to be part of the transition from sea to land living, a long process that ended with the discovery of Tiktaalik.

    This is intertwined with how the body that we have have features that goes back to out fish forerunner.

    Extremely readable and packed with all sorts of great tidbits.

    Also, just from my own experience from leaving behind a religion, it takes time for your thought process to adjust. A couple of years after I became an atheist, it was still difficult for me to get through The Selfish Gene in college because of the residual belief I had that life had to have an overriding purpose.

    Give her some time, she needs to work through everything. I am sure that you still find residue of your past belief informing what you do.

  484. A. R says

    janine: Agree completely. It took me years to realize that I was still thinking like an Anglican. I suppose my Monarchism is another remnant of that as well.

  485. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Janine: The overriding purpose of life is life. Life is a purpose in and of itself.

    I came to that conclusion so quickly and easily, even before dropping religion, even before growing my first armpit hair, that I don’t get why it’s even still a philosophical ‘Thing’.

    The purpose of Life under ‘God’ appears to be… we’re pets.

  486. janine says

    TLC, I added that only as an example, not that she will have the same thing happen. This left god belief came manifest in as many ways as how people realize that they are an atheist.

  487. changeable moniker says

    @Giliell: heh! My nose is an historical remnant of a light-sabre fight with my brother using rolls of wallpaper.

    Blood was collected in a jar, and clotting was observed. Geek. Even then. :)

  488. drbunsen le savant fou says

    Publication rights for books, and digital files Formerly Known As books, between England, the US and Australia/NZ are tied up in a byzantine roccoco of conflicting international and commercial agreements. It took some time before Amazon was able to negotiate that clusterfuck and offer an online bookshop to Australian Kindle users – even then, it’s not the same bookshop as US Amazon, and no, you can’t access the US store without pretending to be in the US by one means or another.

    Seeing as NZ is such a small market compared to even Australia, I’m willing to bet that Amazon/B&N etc looked at the situation and said “Ehh, fuck it.”

  489. alektorophile says

    @401

    re: destroying archaeological artifacts & sites, not just a muslim practice, but unfortunately one practiced pretty much everywhere at one time or another. A friend of mine once spent a summer working on an excavation in Israel, and was rather shocked by the way upper layers of Islamic-period occupation at the site where quickly bulldozed away to reach the more “interesting” (to the excavators) layers documenting occupation in biblical times. (I should say I have no way of confirming his claim -no experience of personally digging in the Middle East-, but from what I know I have no reason for disbelieving him either).

    The world is unfortunately full of similar cases, and historically religiously-significant artifacts and sites in particular are and were one of the first targets when there is a desire to establish claims over land and minds. Churches built over destroyed Prehispanic temples in the New World come to mind, as do more modern examples like the Ayodhya case in India.

    Although personally I would not mind seeing religious buildings turned into something more useful, as in Maastricht (http://flavorwire.com/254434/the-20-most-beautiful-bookstores-in-the-world). A library might have been better, but a bookstore is still pretty cool.

  490. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    I’m sorry Janine, I didn’t mean to make any grand sweeping arrogant statements about atheism or anything. Your experience just made me think of mine.

  491. says

    Good news from Nerd! (does a little happy dance), it’s a big step. (No, the pun was not intended.)
    ++++++++++++++++++
    Ichthyic, no danger of me immigrating, NZ wouldn’t let me in anyway. (Too old and not valuable enough. Why, yes, I did check, why do you ask?)
    ++++++++++++++++++
    Lynna, I take a certain satisfaction in knowing the LDS cult* is going to keep spending their protection money on winless causes.

    They have less to spend on all the other ways they oppress people.

    Since we can’t tax them, bleed them dry.

    * I feel all religions are cults, some are just more popular than others.

  492. alektorophile says

    And on an unrelated topic, I second Janine’s (483) suggestion, Shubin’s is an excellent book.

  493. says

    @dr bunsen, I rather doubt that there is a word in urban dictionary that does not have some misogynist and/or homophobic and/or other bigoted meaning. It seems to have been assembled by 14 year old boys daring each other to make up something nastier.

    And I, like Ichthyic & Dr B, and probably every other marginally technically literate Antipodean, have pirated things because I simply could not buy them legally.

    Today’s Amazing Atheist fun and games does nothing to improve on my wish for the entire fucking human race to just fucking wipe itself out already, and make room for some more rational and compassionate species to evolve.

  494. ibyea says

    @Alethea
    The bonobos would be a more compassionate substitute to the human race, if they evolved to be intelligent. :)

  495. says

    Ms. Daisy Cutter:

    1. The person he was “defending” (and he wasn’t defending him, as best I can tell) was shooting video, not photos, and the video is up on his website. (The photographer was who she was posing for.)

    2. It wasn’t “snapping a photo of her crotch”. I watched the video. It’s your average shitty camcorder video. He’s lucky she’s in the frame at all most of the time.

    3. The guy who was shooting the video? He’s gay.

    4. Carlos Miller isn’t a MRA. He’s a photographer and photography rights activist. “It’s legal” is all of what he’s about.

  498. says

    Benjamin: Fine, the dude was shooting video, her friends were taking photos. And he wasn’t taking a pic of her crotch but of her butt, which makes it so much better, right? From this post of Miller’s:

    So this hot chick is spreading her legs in a ballerina pose in the middle of busy Manhattan for some type of photo shoot when a random guy walks up and starts videotaping her ass.

    Yeah, that’s a really non-skeevy way to describe a girl doing ballet poses.

    This prompts some of her friends to berate the guy for being a pervert, even though they were essentially doing the same thing, except with still cameras.

    Um. They had her permission to record her. Just like she might have given them permission to touch her, because they’re her friends, but that doesn’t mean any guy on the street has the same permission.

    Oh, and gay men can certainly behave in a creepy fashion toward women.

    “It’s legal” is not what I’m all about, and I don’t have a problem criticizing activists who refuse to distinguish between “legal and okay,” “legal and not okay,” and “illegal.”

  499. says

    So the two main commercials I see on my sat tv are grinch pacs and ambulance chasers trying to line up aggrieved customers of damn near anything.
    ++++++++++++++
    Imagonna eat some of the groceries I bought last night. I could cook a meal … or I could just eat strawberries, avocados, cheese and some crackers.

  500. drbunsen le savant fou says

    Huh.

    The prospect of lakes hidden under Antarctic ice was first put forward by Russian scientist and anarchist revolutionary, Prince Pyotr Kropotkin, at the end of the 19th century.

    Wait, what?

    about 800 miles (1300 kilometres) southeast of the South Pole

    … does not compute o_O