The freethought community is grieving at the loss of Helen Kagin, and Ken Ham, petty whiner that he is, has decided to complain about her obituary.
We found it unfortunate that someone took this sad time as an opportunity to take a shot at the Creation Museum in an obituary. And sad, too, that some of the information was not correct. There were not hundreds at the protest rally outside the gates of the Creation Museum when it opened–we counted perhaps 70 people. Also it was not so “peaceful,” considering that the protestors brought in a loud rock band to disrupt our opening day, and also rented a plane to circle and buzz the museum for a few hours, dragging a banner stating: “Thou shalt not lie.”
She was one of Ken Ham’s many enemies, so I could understand a little fist-shaking…but this is so piously hypocritical. He finds it unfortunate that someone would snipe at the idiocy of his “museum” in an obituary, but doesn’t seem to find it at all unfortunate that he has chosen to snipe at the deceased.
And that’s without even the standard Christian snideness of opening up his complaint by pointing out how sad it is when someone dies…but at least Christians get to live forever in the “arms of the Lord and Savior”! I’ve run into more than a few Christians like that, who find their joy in the misfortune of others amplifed by the fact that not only are they dead, but they’re burning in hell, unlike his or her prospects.
Although I do find some personal satisfaction that Ken Ham is seething in this life over the contempt the Kagins have frequently expressed for Ham’s follies.
Kagins, no apostrophe, PZ :)
Ken Ham? What’s that? Some type of mental foolery for pigs?
That’s actually more reasons for people not to join their flock. Why would you want to spend an eternity with vain idiots and their vain diety?
That’d be ‘grieving’, not ‘greaving’.
You expected better from the chief piglet rapist?
Dunno, MadScientist, #4: Are you sure they’re not putting on stockings, or some sort of shin armor?
To steal a thought from Roger Ebert’s story from yesterday, I guess this means that some small part of Helen Kagin is alive and living rent free in the attic of Ken Ham’s mind. I guess we can expect her to torment him for years to come.
yeesh. typos. Still, not bad for someone typing with a head full of phlegm instead of brains.
Are Ham’s accusations about Kagin’s protest even accurate? I’m curious.
And I’m sorry to hear, PZ, that your head is filled with saponified goodness from you contact with the quacks.
It is an example of having the last word taken to a ridiculous degree. Ken Ham obviously dropping to new lows.
To be fair, a man who has spent millions on telling lies won’t be happy to hear condemnations of his prevarications.
Whining won’t change how disgusting you are, Ken.
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p
“Also it was not so “peaceful,” considering that the protestors brought in a loud rock band…”
If you use the word “peaceful” when speaking about a protest, what you mean is “non-violent”, not “quiet”. Everybody knows that.
To not get that point you’d have to be some sort of illiterate, semi-retarded… oh wait, it’s Ken Ham.
Never mind.
Ann Coulter is even Hammier than Ham: in her book Godless, she mentions all the Christians (presumably including herself) who laugh at the thought of Richard Dawkins burning in hell.
Having a plane with a banner fly over head= peaceful
Having a plane smash into a building = violent
Come on Ken Ham, I am learning disabled yet smart enough to figure that one out.
Don’t you all notice?
What Ham really complains about is
There were not hundreds at the protest rally outside the gates of the Creation Museum when it opened–we counted perhaps 70 people. – PZ quoting Ken “piglet rapist” Ham
Well, considering Ham estimates the age of the Earth at 6,000 years, and the true figure is about 4,500,000,000, we can take it that there were actually about 53,000,000 people at the protest!
No, Ham, this
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20100301/alterman
is a problematic obituary.
That is outrageous.
SC OM @ 18
Whoa! Indeed.
Just when I thought he couldn’t get more despicable. Ken Ham, a creature who can always find a new low!
Typical creationist vulture, Ken Ham (Aussie translation, Fucking Pig) staying true to form.
Ken Ham needs to consider “thou shall not lie”. He and his ilk must know that there is no way the crap they foist on their followers is true, given the evidence.
At best, if he really, really believes it, he is not rational or sane. At worst, he knows the deal and is pulling a PT Barnum. If it is a tax free PT Barnum, he has one upped the master.
Money makes people do whacky things.
The frustrating thing about the smugness of the Hams of this world that are so confident about their place in the happy afterlife with the loving sociopath of the Bible, is that they will never get to find out how wrong they are. Once the brain stops functioning, the illusion of the mind just turns off. Thus Ham will never get to realize that there really is no hell for us heathens to burn in. At least we know and can live in the real world and be decent to one another because it is the right thing thing to do.
So much for “God is love”
Kagin’s obituary mentions something she did when she was alive. Ham thinks this mention is “unfortunate.” What Ham’s really complaining about is Kagin’s opposition to the lies Ham is spewing. Hence the mention of the plane’s banner.
Hmm, odious scumbag acts like odious scumbag – at least he’s consistent!
http://prayeurope.com/
Please, PZ. Mention this.
They have a prayer click counter!
I personally think we should all up the prayer count of poor LIECHTENSTEIN. Tiny country that only has 127 prayers!
http://www.prayeurope.com/countries.php?id=LI
ps: I never gave this to you.
Why, what did poor Lichtenstein ever do to us?
Lichtenstein gave us all those damn stamps that kept my album overflowing when I was a kid.
Was the misspelling of “protester” Ham’s or another typo?
Lichtenstein braucht kein Gebet.
Ken is upset that someone rented a plane to spread a message from his own holy book above his facility. Ken ostensibly believes this book was delivered to man from an all knowing God, and that this message is one of his most fundamental ethical laws. Why would he complain about that?
Unless he has a guilty conscience. Could it be that maybe, just maybe, deep down Ken knows he’s a liar?
By all means, Ham, keep spending this life shouting and stamping your feet at us nasty godless folk! You’ll just love what you’ll have to show for it when it’s all over!
Wow, that PrayEurope site is bizarre and offensive.
a Ham’s Folly sounds like a delicious new breakfast platter, perhaps containing two eggs, two slices of ham, 1 belgian waffle and a shot of tequila
Tequila? Eww. Make it a mimosa, though, and you got a deal. :)
let’s meet halfway and serve up a tequila sunrise
@35 Well, leave off the eggs and pig meat (all cholesterol-laden) and the snooze-inducing alcohol, and I’ll see you at breakfast.
Oh, and Ken is SUCH a total peckerwood.
Damn kids and their loud rock music.
“…Unless he has a guilty conscience.”
More likely he knows how to milk the emotional moneyed cow & won’t let go of the teat.
True ChristianTM. Indeed.
News flash! Kenny doesn’t like the ten commandments!
Maybe we can enlist his help for next church state violation legal case.
If you’re really bored. I mean REALLY bored, go to Ken Hamm’s web site & punch “truth” into his search engine. If you’re not under treatment for hypertension before you start, you may well be after a short perusal of the bibble-babble he puts up.
“…doesn’t like the ten commandments…”
Which of the two contradictory “lists of ten” doesn’t he like?
@ #8:
Make sure you infect all the Creotards you can, PZ. A head full of phlegm might improve their thought processes.
God Bless You!
@Knockgoats
“Well, considering Ham estimates the age of the Earth at 6,000 years, and the true figure is about 4,500,000,000, we can take it that there were actually about 53,000,000 people at the protest!”
I calculated that at 52.5 million, but I suppose you rounded it up.
Ham wouldn’t know classy if it bit him on the ass.
I reckon that the PrayEurope thing is kinda funny. You can even pray for the Vatican (Pop:821, 100% Roman Catholic). I wouldn’t have thought they’d need to import prayer, would you?
PZ @ 8: Still, not bad for someone typing with a head full of phlegm instead of brains.
Indeed. Most of us use our fingers.
Ron Sullivan
http://toad.faultline.org
PrayEurope claims that Denmark is 95% Evangelical Lutheran (and no nonreligious), and the Netherlands 41 ‘None’. Fail.
Ken Ham A to Z
Ken Ham is an Asshole
Ken Ham is a Bozo
Ken Ham is a Creep
Ken Ham is a Dolt
Ken Ham is an Egotist
Ken Ham is a Fool
Ken Ham is a Goof
Ken Ham is a Harebrain
Ken Ham is an Ignoramus
Ken Ham is a Jerk
Ken Ham is a Kook
Ken Ham is a Loser
Ken Ham is a Moron
Ken Ham is a Nutcase
Ken Ham is an Ogre
Ken Ham is a Prevaricator
Ken Ham is a Quack
Ken Ham is a Reactionary
Ken Ham is a Sleazebag
Ken Ham is a Twit
Ken Ham is an Underachiever
Ken Ham is a Vulture
Ken Ham is a Whiner
Ken Ham is an Xhuman
Ken Ham is a Yokel
Ken Ham is a Zit
I welcome any improvements on this list (especially for the letter x)
Militant Agnostic @#51
I dunno…anybody here know of Ham’s attitude toward other countries? Perhaps he’s “x”enophobic?
PrayEurope asks for those concerned with the UK to:
Un-parody-able.
PrayEurope’s geography of the UK:
“Located in Western Europe; it’s islands include one-sixth of the Ireland. Northwest of France.”
Well, only two grammatical errors in two sentences – not bad. But “Northwest of France”??? That’s just an insult: it’s France that is southeast of the UK!
Why, what did poor Lichtenstein ever do to us?
Did they ever win the Eurovision song contest by any chance ?
Still, you can take comfort PZ in the fact that Ham detests Christians who, horror of horrors, accept “millions of years” and biological evolution, even more than Atheists. You see he reckons there’s hope for Atheists. TEs are lost I’m afraid:
http://blogs.answersingenesis.org/blogs/ken-ham/2010/02/19/nazarene-professor-responds-woefully/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+KenHam+%28Around+the+World+with+Ken+Ham%29
The president and vice-president of the BioLogos Foundation (founded by Dr. Francis Collins of human genome fame) are two Nazarene college Professors—Darrel Falk and Karl Giberson. You can read their bios on the BioLogos website.
Darrell Falk is a biology professor at Point Loma Nazarene Nazarene University in San Diego. Because I mentioned these two (along with a number of others) in my “State of the Nation” address on Tuesday, Darrell Falk decided to respond on the BioLogos website. First of all, read through his response—then I will make some comments
which are pretty nasty.
Still, how come former Atheists sometimes end up as the worst kind of YEC:
http://www.biblicalfoundations.org.uk/
Monty was brought up by his parents to be an atheist. However, he became Christian in 1964 when he was an undergraduate student at the University of Wales, Aberystwyth. While reading for an honours degree in Chemistry, he also studied Geology which led to his believing in theistic evolution – that evolution had occurred, but God had controlled the processes. This was the way he thought he could reconcile evolutionary teaching with Scripture. In 1969 he undertook a study of the Scriptures and also the scientific “evidence” which is proffered as proof of evolution. After two years he was convinced that “in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them.” His first book, What About Origins? was written as a result of this study.
Monty White is the former CEO of AiG (UK)
Why, what did poor Lichtenstein ever do to us?
Did they ever win the Eurovision song contest by any chance ?
Still, you can take comfort PZ in the fact that Ham detests Christians who, horror of horrors, accept “millions of years” and biological evolution, even more than Atheists. You see he reckons there’s hope for Atheists. TEs are lost I’m afraid:
http://blogs.answersingenesis.org/blogs/ken-ham/2010/02/19/nazarene-professor-responds-woefully/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+KenHam+%28Around+the+World+with+Ken+Ham%29
The president and vice-president of the BioLogos Foundation (founded by Dr. Francis Collins of human genome fame) are two Nazarene college Professors—Darrel Falk and Karl Giberson. You can read their bios on the BioLogos website.
Darrell Falk is a biology professor at Point Loma Nazarene Nazarene University in San Diego. Because I mentioned these two (along with a number of others) in my “State of the Nation” address on Tuesday, Darrell Falk decided to respond on the BioLogos website. First of all, read through his response—then I will make some comments
which are pretty nasty.
How come former Atheists sometimes end up as the worst kind of YEC:
http://www.biblicalfoundations.org.uk/
Monty was brought up by his parents to be an atheist. However, he became Christian in 1964 when he was an undergraduate student at the University of Wales, Aberystwyth. While reading for an honours degree in Chemistry, he also studied Geology which led to his believing in theistic evolution – that evolution had occurred, but God had controlled the processes. This was the way he thought he could reconcile evolutionary teaching with Scripture. In 1969 he undertook a study of the Scriptures and also the scientific “evidence” which is proffered as proof of evolution. After two years he was convinced that “in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them.” His first book, What About Origins? was written as a result of this study.
Monty White is the former CEO of AiG (UK)
About PrayEurope:
This is what the site says of Sweden.
“The 20th Century brought rapid secularization, and Sweden is one of the most permissive societies in Europe. Many forms of liberal theology are vigorously promoted, and over half the population appears to have no real knowledge of the Christian faith.”
Sounds rather reassuring actually. Although it isn’t correct to say we have no knowledge of the Christian faith, we’re secular because we know a bit too much.
87 % Lutheran? My ass. Still, we do beat the “exemplary” Norway in terms of secularism :D
To be fair, a man who has spent millions on telling lies won’t be happy to hear condemnations of his prevarications.
Ken Ham has made millions telling lies. I also see that he is afraid of comments. Poor boy. He is a fraud, a liar, a professional confidence man. It is very sad that there are so many Christians around who are willing to give this fraud money.
Ken Ham is no Christian. He knows it. He also knows where the money is.
The Ken Ham A–Z @51 says the piglet rapist is an Asshole, Bozo, Creep, Dolt, Egotist, Fool, Goof, Harebrain, Ignoramus, Jerk, Kook, Loser, Moron, Nutcase, Ogre, Prevaricator, Quack, Reactionary, Sleazebag, Twit, Underachiever, Vulture, Whiner, Xhuman, Yokel, and Zit. This is a grave insult to all Assholes, Bozos, Creeps, Dolts, Egotists, Fools, Goofs, Harebrains, Ignoramuses, Jerks, Kooks, Losers, Morons, Nutcases, Ogres, Prevaricators, Quacks, Reactionaries, Sleazebags, Twits, Underachievers, Vultures, Whiners, Xhumans, Yokels, and Zits. It’s the sort of insult that causes people to return to orbit and nuke the entire planet. And then blow up the entire stellar system just to make sure the point is understood.
Ken Ham is a(n) “Xian”.
I work in a restaurant and there’s a regular customer who comes in, who is also a very vocal creationist. Needless to say, he constantly tries to convert me. I’m at a huge disadvantage here because if I say anything back that could be construed as rude or offensive, I could get fired. So I kind of just stand there and respond “Well, if that’s true you could probably become the most famous scientist in the world if you got that published” or “Funny how the entire medical community seems to thrive utilizing evolutionary theory instead of anything else.” On my more strident nights, I’ve said things like “I actually have a college education and you don’t, so forgive me if I take the word of two dozen college professors with doctorates over you.”
Anyway, last night he came in after having not been in for a long while. It kind of jarred me because he came in sort of like Kramer from Seinfeld, when normally he’s a very slow, calm, and monotonous person. I was kneeling over picking up some garbage at the time, and all he did was come up to me and say that one day I was going to have to bow on my knees to Jesus and then left. I was at the end of a 10 hour shift on a very busy night and it was nearly 1am, so I just shouted back as he was leaving that seems a bit hypocritical since the Bible says its an abomination for a man to get on his knees for another man.
Only tangentially related to PZ’s post (creationists seem to think any and every opportunity to spread their bullshit is fine and that any target is acceptable) but just something funny I wanted to share.
Peter Henderson at #56:
I have a suspicion that when an Xian says “raised atheist” they don’t mean “raised as a rationalist who has considered religion and found it delusional,” they mean “raised without a strong religious upbringing and never went to church or cared about god as a kid.” The “former atheists” who get taken in by religious BS had probably never thought about any of it before and thus didn’t see through it. You can be an atheist without being rational, (living proof: Bill Maher) but that leaves you ready to fall for any crap that comes at you.
In my dreams that band would have been Slayer.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the 95% for Denmark is correct. Few of us bother to leave the church, and we do use it to mark ‘big events’ in our lives.
I like the idea of praying for Lichtenstein. Nicely random. And it can’t hurt, since the grand duke is throwing lossa tantrums about not being allowed to do as he pleases.
If it’s not tequila, it can’t be Folly.
Liechtenstein does not have a Grand Duke. It has a Prince. You’re confusing it with Luxembourg, which is indeed a sovereign grand duchy (the last one in the world), whereas Liechtenstein is a principality.
And the current Prince is (perhaps apocryphally) said to have threatened to leave the country, and sell the palace to Bill Gates, unless the people of Liechtenstein approved a 2003 constitutional amendment giving him more power. The amendment was, indeed, approved in a referendum, and the Prince is now one of the more powerful monarchs in Europe.
@61
If he’s a typical christian, he was probably juiced up on speed after having fucked half a dozen whores that he paid for with money stolen from his local church group.
Let’s face it, this:
if I say anything back that could be construed as rude or offensive, I could get fired
is the main reason why he’s preaching to you. They love it when they don’t get any real resistance.
Someone said: “Are Ham’s accusations about Kagin’s protest even accurate? I’m curious.” I worked the Rally4Reason that was staged there on opening day to show that not all people living in KY believe in that nonsense (we had non literalist theists there as well, but it was mostly science-based folks). We did have a rock band but no armed guards, guard dogs, or guns, unlike them. One of the organizations that joined in did in fact rent a plane to remind Ken et al of the commandment they seem to have overlooked. And I suppose, if you wanted to interpret his words words regarding attendance *just right* there were around 70 people there in the morning at opening-time… But I personally counted the crowd at over 250 individuals during the day and we had people coming and going constantly (We ran a van-pool to a separate parking/staging area). We were complimented by the police for our excellent behavior and we were later told, upon thanking the police for their valiant and fair efforts, that we were the only party from the event to bother thanking them. Additionally at one point a woman from the “museum” (not on their payroll, a visitor) came over to pick a few fights, eventually attempting to accuse one of our side of assaulting her. Unfortunately for the big fat liar (it’s an accurate description, after all) the commanding officer of the police was there, in plains-clothes, and had witnessed both her yelling-match and the total lack of assault. She was then ordered to leave by the police. The irony of a man who hides behind a big metal fence and armed guards with guns and attack dogs calling our peaceful gathering “not so ‘peaceful'” is just one more helping of the inanity regularly displayed by Ken Ham. He is unquestionably a liar.
Hey guys, Im a long time lurker but something in this article moved me to post :)
I saw that that Monty fella has a degree from UWA but they dont offer a chemistry degree… :S im confused! I studied for my degree there and took Genetics BECAUSE they didnt do Chem…
Haha, Lichtenstein is now up to 193 Prayers. Pharyngula has so much power.
Militant Agnostic – Your X should have been
Ken Ham is Xcrement.