Trump has run out of things to say. Two people fainted in his rally in Pennsylvania (this is probably an ongoing problem, when most of your fans are old people), and he used that as an excuse to stop answering questions…but he couldn’t let them leave. Instead, he told the organizers to play music from his playlist while he stood on the podium, swaying and making those hand gestures that he calls “dancing.” For almost 40 minutes. Jeez, let us escape!
Who needs policy when you’ve got a hodge-podge of random songs to play instead?
It was time to listen to Andrea Bocelli’s “Time to Say Goodbye.” After listening to James Brown, Trump began to speak again, as if remembering that he was still at an event that was billed as a town hall.
“This is the most important election in the history of our country,” Trump said, once again accusing Democrats of weaponizing elections. But then he went back to his music.
“Those two people that went down are patriots, and we love them, and because of them we ended up with some good music, right?” he asked. “So play ‘YMCA!’ Go ahead. Let’s go nice and loud!”
“Here we go, everybody,” Noem interjected.
The crowd cheered and danced to the Village People song from the 1970s, which celebrates gay cruising culture. Noem put her hands up in the shape of a “Y.” As the song was ending, Trump mouthed the words, “Nobody’s leaving.”
“Nobody’s leaving. What’s going on? There’s nobody leaving. Keep going,” he said, as Rufus Wainwright’s version of “Hallelujah” played next. “All right, turn that music up! Turn that up. Great song!”
Then it was “Nothing Compares 2 U” by Sinéad O’Connor. “An American Trilogy” by Elvis Presley. “Rich Men North of Richmond” by Oliver Anthony. Trump stood and swayed.
As “November Rain” by Guns N’ Roses played, he walked off the stage. He spoke to attendees on his way out, as “Memory” from the musical “Cats” played in the background.
Hmmm. Imagine I walk into class to give a lecture, and instead whip out my iPhone and start playing random tunes from my playlist, while wobbling and grinning up there behind the lectern, and I do that for the whole hour. My students would be baffled, would complain, and my division chair would have words with me afterwards, and everyone would wonder if I was losing my mind and maybe ought to be shuffled off into retirement early. This performance by Trump is clear evidence that he ought to be wheeled off the stage and sent off to cheat at golf for the remainder of his life. He definitely shouldn’t be president.
The guy is such an alpha {swoons}
Trump : “Who the hell wants to hear questions?”
Erm, me for one and even ore so I’d like to hear some answers. preferably coherent reasonable ones.
Music has its place but NOT drowining oyut actual policies and Q& A’s.
Playing It’s a Man’s World’ was apt but I can think of quite a few others I’d personally add toTrump’s playlist starting with Denis Leary – Asshole (Official Uncensored Version) then maybe Midnight Oil – Short Memory (1983) w images of Jan 6th & Covid mass graves playing in background esp here!) in addition to Song For Donald – Parody of Song of Roland | Don Caron which was conveniently even written specifically for him! (So many good parody songs there too – highly recommend that prarody Project channel.
MAGA is a cult. There is no other explanation.
This is also the main reason why I don’t trust the polls and I am skeptical of the common argument that says “Trump will lose because Republicans have been under performing the polls since 2016 and the election is swayed more towards Democrats than what the polls show”. Trump is the cult leader and the herd only comes out to vote for him and not other random minions they don’t care for. I don’t think the polls can measure that. I think Trump will likely overperform the polls.
@lotharloo,
Huh. Those are the exact same reasons I believe Trump will underperform the polls. I may be overestimating the intelligence of the American people again. I know sonofrojblake would say that I am.
I’ve already voted, and we’ll see what happens in a few weeks.
It really feels like the kind of behaviour that ends with everybody sharing a big bowl of kool-aid…
“I’m a private dancer, a dancer for money…”
“It’s all so easy when you’re evil”
“I’m a liar!”
“They’re coming to take me away, haha”
StevoR @ 2
A Denis Leary classic from 1993. The unofficial national anthem?
Rollins Band – Liar (official video with lyrics)
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=npn0yz7Mpok
From 1994. Jeez, time flies. Back then, we thought Reagan and Thatcher were the worst the reactionary scum could throw at the world.
Ian King @ 5
Yes, but that behavior is self-limiting. The Trump mutation has spread to Argentine and Austria. I wish the infected would go for kool-aid instead of spreading the bug all over the world.
@ ^ flex : Twenty days 31 minutes precisely, well, precisely ~ish given minutes pass quick and typing takes time..
https://www.270towin.com/2024-countdown-clock/
Yes I’m counting down the days & not gunna pretend I’m not.
United States of America, choose wisely please. Literally begging here. Consequences shaping our planet and my country and so many others.Deciding the Climate among so much more. How the fuck can it be so close still right now?
Trump belongs in jail not the White House. Stopping him and his agenda and all it implies for so very many real human individuals needs to be priority 1. Please.
Voltaire – When You’re Evil (Lyrics)
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=QxJrjV4PNXA
Goddammit, this will be my manifesto from now on.
(Trying to bring up the class of this Trump thread a notch… so this is MTV Celebrity Deathmatch!
Mariah Carey vs. Jim Carrey. Much more dignified than a goddamn MAGA event)
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ne2YuMZ2ZlA
@StevoR, 10,
Unfortunately, the only way it’s over by Friday the 8th, is if it is a landslide for Harris. Even then there will be challenges and legal filings and legal battles. The closer the election is, the more motivated the Trump team and MAGAts will be to challenge the results.
This election is likely to drag on until the inauguration, and even then there will be a large segment of the population who will always believe it was stolen.
That’s the best case scenario; the result where Harris wins.
That was my thought as well.
They would be lucky if they only fainted rather than something more serious like a heart attack.
This just points out what I’ve said before.
It doesn’t matter what Trump says or doesn’t say.
His mind is going and far along that path.
If he wins, they will just prop him up in a chair with a TV, unlimited diet cokes, and a cell phone to text to the X website.
The real rulers will be his staff, Project 2025, the ultra rich oligarchies including Elon Musk, and the christofascists. And JD Vance might be the actual acting president.
So, he might as well play songs at his rallies and pretend to dance. No one who is there cares. They’ve already made their minds up.
How about “Don’t Know Much About History,” followed by “If I Only Had a Brain” from the Wizard of Oz. And closing with “Stormy Weather.”
Latest poll here.
Trump who was down a few percentage points from VP Harris is now gaining to be even.
I’m going to have to state the obvious.
It looks like Trump has at least a 50% chance of winning the election.
In a rational world, he would be polling in the low 30s %.
This is case Nightmare Green territory.
If it happens, we won’t be living in the USA any more. We will be surviving (hopefully), in the USA.
@ ^ raven : In a rational world Tump would be polling 0% – indeed Trump wouldn’t be a thing. Nor would his hateful cult be.
Of course, part of the reason that Trump is still polling well is because the media continues to sanewash his behavior instead of pointing out how absolutely incoherent any of his ideas are or how much of a disaster his policy ideas would be if actually implemented.
“Pablo Picasso” by the Modern Lovers
line from song:
“Pablo Picasso never got called an asshole
Not like you”
https://youtu.be/Kc2iLAubras
No, they wouldn’t “wonder”. They would be confident you’ve lost your mind, much as we’re confident the T-man has lost his. Some university profs might get away with dancing in class…like the 70+ year old English drama professor…but I’m afraid dancing for most is deemed a bad sign.
If age related mental decline runs in the family, then there’s this: Wikipedia says of daddy Fred…
Fred was 86 at the time he was diagnosed. He died about 8 years later.
Trump Freaks Out After Harris Releases Her Medical Records
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=sf69gj0wSCQ
BTW I am somewhat less concerned with the claims Trump is catching up. The polls have been quite stable the last weeks. Trump is campaigning mostly in states he already is confident he will win, which is a faulty strategy. There is a lot of unfavorable coverage (finally) coming out in the media.
The claims of a sudden Trump surge therefore may be some kind of media manipulation.
birgerjohansson @ 21 — “The claims of a sudden Trump surge therefore may be some kind of media manipulation.” Perhaps the news media just wants the drama of a “close” race to stir up the public emotionally. That way, they capture more eye balls.
Robro @ 22
I found something that may explain the anomaly.
“Should Democrats Be Panicking Right Now? NO! Here’s Why Things Are Stuck”
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=1GAWdUoC0YE
He’d never answer truthfully, and the whole thing is just a song and dance routine anyway. Might as well make it literal.
opinion polls don’t (always) predict election outcomes- a trend in change among polling data might give some useful information, but history has shown that opinion polls (at any particular point in time) are not good predictor (with the exception of exit polling) and here’s why:
voter turnout overwhelms the opinion differences, and the samples of folks who choose to participate in polls do not (currently) reflect the same population of folks who actually vote
history HAS shown that the greater voter turnout = the greater likelihood of a progressive candidate winning.
where is the polling data :”are you planning to vote?”, “did you vote in 2020″, ” did you vote in 2016″, “are you voting for the first time” —-that data would be predictive
also (and in addition) Trump is a fascist and likely demented. and those attending those rallies are attending a cult meeting- so why not just watch him ‘dance’ – nothing he says is any more relevant to the audience
As raven mentioned @14, there a good chance that if Trump is elected you’ll have JD Vance as president. I actually think that this would happen in a year or 2 after inauguration (either through health issues or a 25th amendment “coup”) and you’ll have a christian taliban government with a tech bro coalition getting to implement their own agenda.
This should get more air time because you’ll get a few years of Trump chaos, retribution, repression and grift followed by a different type of chaos, repression and grift.
There’s your escape plan, PZ.
The whirring sound you hear is Sinead O’Connor spinning in her grave. Trump is anathema to everything she stood for.
I hope Simon Rosenberg is correct about the reasons why the polls continue to be unreliable. The main two are the biased right-wing pollsters being averaged in with the independent polling organizations, and the inherent bias of their methodology in general. This is why the last election was forecasting a red wave that didn’t materialize. They keep failing to poll women under 30, which happens to be the key demographic that is registering to vote in huge numbers, and sending in their early voting ballots as Democratic Party members. It’s pretty safe to assume those ballots are votes for Kamala Harris.
As to the OP, if Biden did anything remotely this unhinged for even one moment, the media would be broadcasting non-stop criticism of his mental acuity.
Trump literally dances and DJ’s ….crickets.
It’s obvious that the music and big-name Artists who were involved with the Democratic National Convention and Harris-Walz lovefest is living in his head rent free.
Nobody popular likes him, and his fragile ego is definitely bothered by the fact that none of his events have that adoring, enthusiastic, crowd of supporters. In contrast, his events have drawn three different trump-voting men with guns, trying to assassinate him.
It’s gotta burn, especially when your entire persona is transactional and shallow.
The media also isn’t reporting on the fiasco of Trumps campaign event in Coachella, where the vast majority of the attendees were left stranded for hours waiting for the buses to shuttle them back to the parking areas which were 5 miles away. Many walked, but a large number are too elderly for nighttime hikes in the desert.
Video and more available at the link.
https://newrepublic.com/post/187126/donald-trump-fans-coachella-rally-stranded
@Raven, # 16: It was probably a Republican commissioned poll. They’re overloading the media with skewed polls that favor Trump.
This is WWTF 690 AM and you’re listening to the Fuckface von Clownstick show! /”YMCA” begins
“Mayday” by coldrain is still my go-to song when I think of the mango Mussolini. It wasn’t written about him, but every word fits him like a slime dip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2pWoTtLug4 (if the screamo is too much for you, mute and just read.)
Just got back from seeing The Apprentice. A well made but brutal film. Stan’s Trump starts as a greedy clod, hoping to impress daddy, and ends as the monster threatening civilization that we know now. Strong’s reptilian performance as Cohen is equally spot on. Highly recommended.
The footage is both horrifying for all the reasons while tragic on a personal, organic level. Tr*mp is dying before our eyes and yet no one in his entourage cared enough, let along was smart enough, to gently intervene and walk the doddering old man off stage. He is profoundly alone
robro at 20:
Mental decline is really common in people who live to be that old, meaning they aren’t killed by something else first. Like the sort of unhealthy life habits that also increase the risk for dementia.
I suspect what really runs in this family is the genes for superior cardiovascular health.
Going off on a tangent.
Early voting in Pennsylvania: Democrats so far 285,072
Republicans so far 95,066
Early votes; Dems outvoting GOP by 300%.
In 2029 it was just 273%.
My conclusion is, unless early voting patterns have changed there are more Democratic voters in this crucial swing state.
Erratum: should be 2020, not 2029. My chubby fingers keep hitting the wrong keys.
This should explain the polling oddities.
.
“THIS IS A PROBLEM: The 2024 Election Map Based On The NEWEST Poll From All 50 States
.https://youtube.com/watch?v=xyqfxDSILcg
In the last weeks there have been as many Republican-aligned polls as there are unaligned polls.
This tilts the total results towards an apparent picture that favors Republicans.
@39, birgerjohansson,
I see one major issue with the video shared in your #39 comment. If Harris wins, the polls will re-enforce the idea that the election was stolen and the Democratic party cheated. The polls showing a toss-up election today will be used as evidence in court cases, in fights over electors, and to raise money from the MAGAts when Harris wins. Regardless of whether Harris wins narrowly or in a landslide.
In California, the down-ballot races will determine the outcome of the congressional elections. His voters are of the opinion that everybody can and should be abused, just not them so much.
So him coming to Coachella (and possibly other blue states, but definitely here) is a two-fer. He is demonstrating that he can and should abuse them, and he is supporting the congresscritters who are in our rural red and purpledy congressional districts.
@37.birgerjohansson : Wait what? They’re already counting votes in this year’s election? I didn’t realise they were allowed to do that! Thought they had to wait until after the voting ha dofficially closed first.
@StevoR #42:
The electoral norms that we’re used to in Oz and the UK are seen more as a political football in the US, something left to the judgement of individual states, to the machinations of state politicians and the makeup of their courts. To you and me it might seem obvious that publishing early counts of any kind could influence other voters whose main concern is being on the winning side or fitting in with their neighbours rather than anything as outdated as making an informed assessment of opposing policy declarations, but then again to an American it seems bizarre that we’re still putting up with the imposition of a hereditary head of state.
@ ^ Rich Woods : Ah. Okay. That sounds so bizarrre and strange to me.- and yes, when our comes to our archaic foreign figurehead, it seems strange and wrong to me too. Both countries (USA & Oz) seem to have some very glaring flaws in the system that need fixing ASAP. Of course getting referenda throgh her e unless bipartisan has a very sad and problematic history as the Indigneous Voice one destroyed by Dutton’s racism and lies last year has proved. Sigh. Plus the Republic referendum of 1999 too.
See : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_Australian_republic_referendum Dibvide and conquer used there as well – the split between those wanting the parliamentary model vs direct election model. Of course, we ended up with neither and having a fully Aussie govt all the way to the symbolic top looks further away than ever. Personally I’d like us to have a First Elder chosen by our Indigenous People but.. see start of this bit.
@40.flex :
Yeah, that’s scarily plausible and sounds about right. An undemocratic and hateful strategy to try and steal the election and build up their own sides morale as well. Hmm.. so much projection on the Repugs part as typical.
There’s always team clogged artery to root for.
@35 yes absolutely
He is incapable of caring for anyone but himself, surrounds himself with yes-men, parasites, sycophants and criminals. cheats everyone! It does look like he is headed for oblivion . I hope his fall does not have any negative effect on the election results and just leaves the current cult to disintegrate and the ones behind it scrambling to find some other figurehead to replace him all too late to help them this time.
as an aside his patron in Russia seems to be having problems as well so it might not be a safe harbor for the Dumpster to flee to either.
@birgerjohansson:
Both Trump and Harris will outperform the polls, that’s absolutely normal: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polling_for_United_States_presidential_elections#:~:text=Gallup%20polling%20has%20often%20been,likely%2Dvoter%20numbers%20in%202012.
Last two elections, Trump has out performed the polls by 4 and then 2.8 points. Hillary outperformed by roughly 2 points and Biden by 0.3.
This is what I meant by my comment up there. Expect Trump to outperform polls more than Harris, meaning, I am personally predicting a Trump victory. It’s still pretty close and maybe Harris will also excite a silent percentage of people who can hopefully push her over the edge but I am in a very doomer mode right now ☹️
Op-erratic
Stephen Colbert comments on the event:
“Trump’s Bananapants Boo-Boo-Bonkers Town Hall | VP Harris Heads To Fox News’
Damn! Sorry. My bad.
@#23, birgerjohansson:
The explanation is that Harris is following the Hillary Clinton playbook. You know, the one which already lost to Trump? I dunno about you, but it doesn’t inspire me with any confidence when the Harris campaign pivots from “Republicans are a bunch of stupid weirdos and freaks” to “Republicans are my friends and good people and I’m going to implement their policies but do better at it than they do themselves and I’m going to hire a bunch of them”, which is of course the latest messaging. Nor do her dismissal of minorities — again, just like Hillary! — or her commitments to increases in military spending and domestic spying make me any more forgiving, although I was already going to vote third party because of her support for the Israeli genocide anyway, so maybe those things appeal to Democrats. Very clearly the current ideal Democratic President is George W. Bush, and Harris is doing her best to satisfy her audience, who are every bit as stupid and lacking in self-awareness as Trump supporters. (Then again, it seems like there’s a good chance Biden will blindly follow Israel into triggering World War 3 before the election, in which case all of this will be totally moot. Every mushroom cloud has a silver lining.)
Comrade Vicarionivich joins in to sagely explain to us why he needs those 100k Russian Judascoins every week.
Not that long ago: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/commentisfree/article/2024/sep/04/kamala-harris-hillary-clinton-feminist-messaging-democratic-donald-trump
From Sept 16: National Dance Day
.https://www.facebook.com/share/v/3wn42J8EHHJvcNzX/
This colorful character is much better than Trump.
@50. The Vicar (via Freethoughtblogs)
HRC won the popular vote. She wa srobbed by the Electoral Collge byut she did actually win ona 1 person 1 vote basis. Always remember that.
No it isn’t. What basis do you have for that extraordinary claim and what extraordinary evidence have you got to back that up a la Sagan’s rule?.
Which “minorities” has Kamala Harris dismissed? Other than the Trump deplorables, which ones did HRC dismiss precisely?
So in effect, in practice, in reality you are enabling and helping Trump. And Putin if those can be separated here. How about the genocide Putin wants to committ in Ukraine and which Trump will allow along with probly many more genocides as Putin tries to rebuild the old Tsarist Russian empire? You would enable many mor egenocides and see far more people die than otherwise and you cannot save the gazans by doing so indeed having Trump in power only guaranbtees their genocide gets completed. Trump is NOT good for the Palestinians.
Continued @ 50 Vicar :
Nice that you finally admit you do NOT know what appeals to Democrats. You obvs aren’t one Trumpian Tankie. Maybe you should actually look at the Democratic party platform. Think I linked it for you before but, well here it is :
https://democrats.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/2024_Democratic_Party_Platform_8a2cf8.pdf
For your perusal again and, again, reminder the alternative is Trump’s fascist dictatorship and Project 2025’s Christianist Theocracy.
Simply absurdly false yet again, I suspect your likely Kremlin handlers won’t be very happy with what they are getting for their rubles here. .
Biden is already diverging from Israeli policy and setting conditions on further American support. You haven’t heard? .:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-10-16/us-warning-to-israel-over-gaza-aid/104452678
Also I don’t think WW3 will occur although a regional catastropic war with Iran is plausible. It would be horrific and kill millions of people but I don’t think it would end up as WW III. Hopefully though war can and will be avoided. Ultimately, that is up to the leaders in Israel and Iran respectively – the USA can (& I think should) do some things to exert pressure and restrain Israel but I don’t think its as easy for the USA to control Israel as you seem to think. For instance, the USA is NOT the only supplier of arms to Israel other nations such as Germany also supply Israel too & it has its own arms industry as well.. ( Eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_Weapon_Industries )
@SteveR, #42,
No. They are conducting exit polls and/or looking at the rolls for names of people who have voted and are cross-checking them against lists compiled by the parties which may include, among other things, whether they declared themselves as democrats or republicans in the primaries. The media is making an assumption that someone who voted republican in the primary would vote for Trump in the general. These reports are indicators only, they do not reflect actual vote numbers. Further, this type of cross-reference is only possible in states which have closed primaries where the voter has to declare the party they are voting in before they get a ballot. I could go on about how primaries are really only for the benefit of the parties and were not always state-run but were moved to state-run as a way to reduce graft and corruption in them, but I’ll avoid that in this post.
What is happening now is people are filling out ballots, usually paper ballots. I’m not certain if these are then scanned by the voter during early voting or just stored to be scanned by election workers later. For absentee ballots, sent in by mail, these ballots are held in sealed envelopes until voting day.
The actual vote counting will occur on election day. That’s when the early voting and absentee voting numbers will be counted. Generally these counts are done after the polls close because they require the paper ballots to be run through the scanning machines. The election workers don’t want to interrupt in-person voting by running batches of hundreds of ballots through the scanners and most municipalities do not have spare scanners. This is why there is a bump late in the evening, or even the next morning, in vote counts and there can be a dramatic shift in results when these vote counts are added to the totals. Some states even prohibit counting the absentee ballots until after the polls close on election day.
The voting system in the US isn’t great, but it isn’t as bad as implied. As for using this less than accurate information to change people’s minds about voting, sure, that happens.
Comrade Vicarionovich, why this dishonest attempt to claim that you ever considered voting for anyone but Trump…oh sorry, “third party”? Everyone knows you never really considered doing anything else and those 100k Russian judascoins every week made the decision easy enough. If Kamala announced the stop of all aid for Israel tomorrow, you’d find some other reason to vote for Trump…”third party”. That happens when people so obviously argue in bad faith with a predetermined outcome.
Also, always funny when people clutch their pearls tightly over Israel but cheer for Russia doing the same in Ukraine. Would you change your tune if the Mossad offered you 150k judascoins every week?
[yup]
cf. https://breakingdefense.com/2023/03/inside-israels-directorate-of-defense-research-development/
@18 microraptor
As was recently commented on by “online” Youtube news (ironically some of the only people honestly reporting any of it), all 10 major news networks are owned by billionaires, and 9 of those donate to the Trump campaign. Its interesting when you look at the way they act then, in this context, because Trump HATES most of them for having, sometimes, if rarely, saying not so nice things about him. The one that is almost always on his side has started to, more and more often, openly point out the flaws in his arguments, his lies, his unstable nature, etc., but only about 10% of the time, the rest of their pundits are all 100% in favor of him still, and spreading his lies. But, the mere fact that they are even doing it 10% of the time suggests them trying to give themselves an out, in case, say.. someone else wins, and those people decide, like Trump keeps threatening, to hold them accountable for literally helping a madman (and who knows, some of them, or their boss, may even be listed and coconspirators in some of the stuff he pulled). The rest… they are playing the opposite game – “How can we pretend to report on both candidates, while giving ourselves plausible deniability, and being able to tell Trump, if he wins, ‘But, but… there are all these things we could have said and didn’t!'” Their game is to walk a narrow line between doing what the boss wants – i.e., supporting Trumps, while still “pretending” to also hold him vaguely accountable, so that neither side can accuse them of openly supporting him.
None of them are honestly reporting any more, but one is playing the game of, “Oh heck, he might lose! We need to hedge our bets!”, while the rest are all playing the game of, “He kind of hates us, and this is a problem, besides, our boss/owner supports him, so how to we walk a knifes edge between actually reporting anything at all, but not turn into Fox while doing it?” The nuts who are in the Trump cult are, ironically, in this case, almost right, but for utterly backwards, and unhinged reasons – the news media is screwed up, but not because they are telling lies about the right. No, the real problem is they are not telling the truth about either side, but are instead, in most cases, playing a freaking game of, “We need to pander to both sides, just in case.”, and thus are utterly failing to do actual f-ing news reporting at all.
To continue, now that I’ve made it to my place of employment (what, me work?).
From #37, birgerjohansson’s post.
How this should be interpreted is that in Pennsylvania 285,072 people who are registered as Democrats have submitted their ballot in early voting. 95,066 people who are registered as Republicans have submitted their ballot in early voting. There are undoubtedly some of the 95,066 people who are registered as Republicans who have cast their vote for Harris, and some of the 285,072 people who are registered as Democrats who have cast their vote for Trump. There are also people who have already voted who are not registered for either party. The media has little information about how the independents voted, so they are often ignored. At least at this point in the election.
Do not be surprised if in a week some clever reporter slices the data to find that 40% of the early voters are less than 40 years old, or some such statistic, and makes a claim that Harris is doing well because of that. Or that 80% of people over the age of 60 have already cast their ballot, and this means Trump has an edge. It’s all hype and speculation at this point. The only count that matters is the one on election day.
One thing to keep in mind about early voting and absentee voting is that the Republican Party made a great to-do about how early voting and absentee voting made it easy for corrupt election workers to alter their vote. The message was largely abandoned after the 2022 mid-terms, but it still gets played occasionally. We should first expect that Democrats will vote in much higher levels during early and absentee voting. Second, the bump in results due to the early-voting numbers and absentee ballots after the polls close will be used by MAGAts as evidence that the election was rigged. That story played well to the MAGA base last time, and the bump is inevitable as it is built into the system.
In many ways, the problem with voting in the USA isn’t the voting or vote count itself (although there are some things which could be made much better cough electoral college cough), it’s that a poor understanding of the process make it easy for fanatics and fascists to claim shenanigans occurred. So far, in this single thread, we have talked about how polls (which we know can be unreliable and biased) and the absentee/early voting bump (often mandated by State Voting Boards to occur at a specific time) will be used as evidence that the election was fraudulent and stolen.
These things are known to happen in every election, but low-knowledge voters can be convinced that these are unique events and can be taught to distrust elections by the fascists. The media is certainly complicit in this because they could remind voters the limitations of polls and clarify some of the details of how votes are counted every time this subject arises. While I do not trust FoxNews to report on anything which might reduce partisanship, other news outlets could. But that doesn’t get the clicks.
In the classic MTV cartoon Aeon Flux the dictator Trevor Goodchild on one occasion goes on stage and performs as a musician. But I think Trevor was more agile than Trump.
StevoR
That would be ideal. In a less ideal world but one that is still more preferable than reality, Trump would have no chance of winning but would act as a spoiler to a more traditional Republican.
Uh, the presidents at Disney World move better.
The Vicar #50
You do know she’s being endorsed by the Cheneys and has the support of other prominent Republicans and has leaned into these endorsements, right? That, alone, should’ve been a strong clue that she’s open to working with Republicans.
According to Heather Cox Richardson, the T-man had a very bad time with John Micklethwait of Blumberg News and the Economic Club of Chicago. Sounds like he’s seriously loosing it.
Seems like the “October Surprise” is Trump going bonkers.
Which brings Richardson to Vance because if Humpty Dumpty does win, then JD is likely the next president. And that brings her to Peter Thiel and Elon. It’s surprising that two “technology wizards” hold such outlandish and outmoded ideas.
I am under the impression that one of the reasons for the Jewish state of Israel besides god at least this iteration of it was that the Jewish people did not want to be dependent on any nation for their survival nor to be controlled by any one. The argument that the U.S. should just tell them to stop doing what they are doing is ridiculous and just a little condescending and insulting. The whole response to everyone is to assert independence and self determination. BeBe sees this war as something that gets him out of trouble as well. No one is going to exert control over Israel or the Jewish people again certainly not the U.S. president
Maybe not. What the US can do is stop funding their genocidal actions and stop sending them weapons. That way they’d be completely independent from the US.
@Vicar — If you look at the consequences of getting one or the other elected, Harris is a few small steps in the right direction, largely due to Walz, and Donald Trump is a full-tilt sprint in the wrong direction. And even if he causes the collapse of what currently exists, there’s no guarantee that we will be the ones to pick up the pieces and rebuild. The fascists will be trying to do the same thing, so we want them as weak as possible beforehand, should it ever reach that point. I won’t tell you that you have to vote for Harris — especially if you live in a solid red or solid blue state, but even if not, I know that sort of condescension isn’t useful. I will, however, say that you should consider which option is less destructive to our allies’ ability to organize, and which option will keep the cops off our backs for longer while we build social networks capable of replacing chunks of capitalist infrastructure with our own two hands.
Neither choice will build socialism for us, and refusing to choose will not help us build socialism either. We’re going to have to do the work ourselves, and voting is merely a means to mitigate the harm of capitalism in the mean time. By mitigating the harm, we can make things easier on ourselves, too, and draw in allies, so I’d consider it generally a good idea.
Jemolk, Vicar (singular) is on record as hoping that Trump would win. Not even slightly a leftist.
John @69: I disagree. The Vicar is what he perceives as the purest form of leftist; his goal can only be achieved by the destruction of the status quo*, which a Trump victory would (in his mind) speed along. Of course, that requires the suffering of countless people, but you can’t make an omelette, etc. Now, how he thinks utopia would actually come about after the conflagration is a mystery which he has never addressed.
In short, he’s not really a fascist. Just a tiresome, rather dim, strawmanning ideologue, aka a troll. I wish people would stop responding to his nonsense. The phrases “falling on deaf ears” and “pissing in the wind” come to mind. He never responds to valid criticism, so stop already.
*i.e. purification by fire.
Well, Rob, I reckon you’ve been sucked-in by a persona.
Still. I am an old-school Pharynguloid.
(Before your time, Rob, but trolls were never ever ignored)
[BTW, the term is ‘accelerationist’]
[Nostalgia]
https://proxy.freethought.online/pharyngula/2013/07/31/the-great-troll-war-of-2013/
@56 & 60. flex : Thanks. Good explanations there. Appreciated.
@Vicar : Your lack of response has again been noted. You didn’t use to just be a drive by troll here once.
John: Yes, I’m aware of Pharyngula’s, um. colourful history, which for no reason I can fathom, you seem to be nostalgic about. And I’m perfectly aware of accelerationism. As odious as it is, it is not actually fascism. It’s just fucking stupid.
“… which for no reason I can fathom, you seem to be nostalgic about”
:)
Very mysterious, that. Basically, the Wild West incarnation of this blog.
The kilocomments, the Pharyngulations, the hurly-burly.
The attitude towards civility as proper engagement instead of superficial politeness.
The attitude towards appeals to tone; the preferencing of factuality over mere opinion.
Who could ever be nostalgic for that?
(I kinda miss being dogpiled by like a dozen people, all vehemently trying to dispute me or diss me; not to everyone’s taste, but it was good exercise for me to engage with them)
@ 66. unclefrogy :
Yes – that’s my understanding as well. During the Shoah (Nazi Holocaust), the genocide of Jewish people occurrred and they were helpless to prevent it as the world looked on and did.. very little at all to stop it. Having a country of their own where they ruled and were able to survibe as masters of their own destiny rather than relying on bigger national powers to protect them from genocide which with anti-Semitism had already proven unreliable. Of cours ethere’s now a tragic irony inwhat is arguably happeneing with israel now committing a ICC-plausible genocide itself on the Gazans or even Palestinians as a whole as the
world again looks on and fails to act to stop it.
is it “ïnsulting” (etc..) to have to tell them not to committ what very closely ressembles a genocide? Maybe. Does that mean we shouldn’t try to do that? I mean kinda fair point but..
No one? Maybe many? if enough people try to put enough prssure on together? I dunno. Israel is destroying its international repuation and making itself extremely hated and with some justice. Netanyahu can’t last forever but the path he – & Ben Gvir & Smotrich are taking Isreal down is a really dark and nasty one right now. I don’t think anyone is winning here and an awful lot is being lost – literally as well as metaphorically. Not least in terms of human life.
StevoR @17,
“In a rational world Tump would be polling 0% – indeed Trump wouldn’t be a thing.”
Bloody oath.