I got a letter from the producers of this new evolution series to be shown on 17 June on The History Channel. It allays many of the concerns we had from the original press release.
I want to thank you for your post “The History Channel might do something right” (May 6) about the channel’s upcoming series on evolution. Unfortunately the synopsis that was posted was actually a draft of an intended press release (written by a PR copywriter as one of your readers correctly suggested) which was sent out in error before it had been vetted for accuracy.
As one of the producers working on evolve, I just wanted to allay the fears of some commenters on your site who understandably interpreted the synopsis’s inaccuracies as cause for concern about the factuality of the series. A corrected version of this release is being issued by History Channel and procedures have been put in place to prevent this type of mistake in the future.
Please be assured that the producers have taken extraordinary pains to ensure the integrity of the series. We are working with the top accredited evolutionary biologists in their field, too numerous to name here. And all of our scripts are being vetted by Carl Zimmer, a science journalist whose books and articles on evolution you likely know.
We know your readers likely know a lot more about this topic than a general TV audience. But we’re doing our very best to keep both the laypeople who don’t have that knowledge and the ardent devotees tuning in week after week. Regardless, I think we can all agree that the series represents a terrific opportunity to educate the mass public on matters of evolution.
I’m willing to give it a chance. Let’s tune in and see if they thrill us!
Yeah but it’s the History Channel. They’ll sandwich it in the schedule between programs about Noah’s ark and the shroud of Turin.
Nice letter. Though I do take a bit of issue over the phrase “ardent devotees” — as though evolutionary biology were some kind of religion. Ah well.
Awesome! I love the History Channel, they have a good track record for producing documentaries like this.
Pablo, the History Channel is just as likely to sandwich the show between “Noah’s Ark Revealed” and “An Introduction to the Big Gang”.
Sounds awesome. Hopefully I won’t forget and end up missing it! I just love the History Channel’s exploration of religious and scientific topics! It always makes me all tingly inside to see how hollow myths truly are, and how petty criticism of science actually is. And all while being accessible to simpletons like myself with an air of entertainment about it all. Can’t wait!
@#1 pablo —
[Kenny] Yeah, I hate when they put mythological nonsense like evolutionism in between real historical, scientific stuff…I love science, but… [/Kenny]
Wow. Writing to you was an unbelievably nice thing for them to do. It’s not like they owed you –or anyone for that matter– any explanations.
I’m impressed, and I’m looking forward to this series a little more now.
Good work, History Channel.
That was really kind of them. And I guess it just goes to show the rising star of the great PZed.
I don’t mind the ‘devotee’ dessignations. It’s dissociated from religion in my idiom – I actually had to think for a bit to see the objection. It’s no different from saying that people are devoted to gardening, stamps, the ballet, good beer, &c &c.
Sending you that letter was a good PR move! I liked the first season of the History Channel’s “The Universe” (I bought the DVDs) even if it did get a bit redundant and misleadingly melodramatic at times. I am excited about this new series! Let’s hope it lives up to the promise.
Oh, and PZ, I just got the new SEED in the mail today, and am currently guzzling your fugu genome article like an icy-cold Belgian wheat beer.
You know, what impresses me more than that they read and bothered responding to PZ’s post is that they read and responded to reader comments.
I don’t have cable, so I don’t really have an opinion on the History Channel, but the guys working on this project have my tentative thumbs up.
What are the chances a corrected version of the release would be sent out if this site hadn’t brought attention to the original? Generosity and kindness or damage control?
I’ll believe it when I see it. With these tripe shows like “Monster Hunters” and “UFO Hunters” that use the word “science” a lot but are really just fanboy conspiracy shows, and the afore-mentioned “Shroud of Turin” bullshit, their track record is hideous. Last I heard, assuming the premise was not legitimate scientific inquiry.
I’ll believe it when I see it. With these tripe shows like “Monster Hunters” and “UFO Hunters”
don’t forget those fantastically intellectual shows:
Ice Road Truckers
and
Axemen
*sigh*
@Sili,
I am not devoted in any way to gardening or stamps.
Does this mean that I am devoted to non-gardedning and a lack of stamps?
Damn, I’m a devoted abotanist and anti-whateverthehelltheycallstampcollecting.
I love the History Channel, and I can’t wait to see this. It should be really interesting and informative. :D
Sounds like they could do worlds of good. I might have to get over to my parents’ house and DVR them.
Yeah, I agree.
Props to the HC for reading even the comments, but come on. The perceived integrity of a “documentary” cable channel called “History Channel” is not based solely on one series. This could be great, and it’s good that they’re listening, but really most of the distrust I’m willing to guess is not about them messing up any other particular series before, but the great majority of other series about superstition they peddle in the same breath.
Just doing one series right won’t gain you guys any trust as a media outlet unless you get rid of the other many shows that are, well, crap.
That would be an anti-philatelist, or an aphilatelist. Those devoted to aphilatelism just want to see stamps removed from the public square!
Also, I think I hate myself a little for knowing that word.
Before anyone calls me out, I probably shouldn’t have said “great majority” in my previous post. I don’t know enough the HC to make that assertion. I probably should have said “too many”, which I feel comfortable with.
I haven’t got cable at my new place yet ( we only moved here in January- I take a while to get motivated sometimes) and am thinking of leaving it off totally. I’m saving $80 a month and I was really finding I was down to watching maybe two or three core programmes a month. Commercial TV in Australia sucks so the side benefit is I’ve noticed that Mr Shrek & I are getting a lot more quality study time in, better time playing with the kids, actually eating dinner together more often and actually getting a few minutes to read something other than textbooks occasionally ( or in my case briefs of evidence).
So I will have to prevail upon you good people to post a synposis of the show to see if its worth getting. The irony behind all this is that cable is so far behind here in Australia I’ll be able to purchase it on DVD before it comes to air anyway- if the Pharyngulite consensus suggests its worth it.
Autumn #13 and SteveyD #17:
They are aphilatelists because “Philately will get you nowhere”.
>[Kenny] Yeah, I hate when they put mythological nonsense
>like evolutionism in between real historical, scientific
>stuff…I love science, but… [/Kenny]
I love the History channel. I will watch the series on Evolution. I don’t mind. I also watch about Noah’s ark and the Shroud of Turin.
The history channel is the only channel I watch other than the Sci-fi channel and The Learning Channel.
I told you, I love learning new things. We should always try to learn new things and to expand our minds.
Remember, I love science. I just don’t think all science is equal and I also believe that atheism is holding science back from really progressing in some areas such as NDE (there are studies being done on this but dawkins acts like they don’t exist because he has an agenda).
NDE is a huge thing to study, but you won’t find dawkins near it because it goes against his own belief system.
Go away kenny. Go away before the mean people arrive. Or go away before you turn me into one of them.
Remember, I love science. I just don’t think all science is equal
ROFLMAO
you really don’t understand what science is if you can say that with a straight face.
no, wait, you say it without even considering it, like everything you spout.
It’s beyond ignorance, and on into knee-jerk intuition.
Is there even a name for that level of gut-thought?
Here’s one for you to ponder, Kenny:
why don’t you think lightning bolts come from Zuess?
Go away kenny. Go away before the mean people arrive. Or go away before you turn me into one of them.
oh, it’s got nothing to do with being “mean”, we’re just all intolerant, right Kenny?
Thou tongueless ill-nurtured ratsbane!
Is this the sister channel of the History Channel in the UK? If so I’d worry about them putting Hitler in it. Those guys are crazy about Hitler.
I watched a couple seconds of history channel today. It was talking about the massacre of the innocents in the first part of Matthew and how some people gathered up some kids bones and put them in this old place to represent said massacre. Even though there’s no evidence that any of the events of Matthew actually took place, they didn’t take the bones from anywhere special and they were careful to use the word “represent” and talk about how the bones were small and thus kids, even though most of them looked to be well into their teens and were again just picked up from grave sites.
I was rolling the entire time knowing it was complete crap… but that’s from a couple random seconds of that channel. I completely can’t stomach it after it called an emperor believing in a mystery savior cult “superstitious”. I couldn’t stop yelling for a few minutes and I typically never yell.
History channel is such a lost cause. I remember when they were 24/7 WWII and that was actually pretty cool.
Oh, ye of little faith! The History Channel will get this one right. I can guarantee it.
Why?
Because they know we’re watching them. And they know we’ll be all over an inaccuracy like sharks on chum. ;-)
ATTENTION: MARK MATHIS
This is how you do it. I don’t know whether I’ll like the History Channel’s documentary, but I do know that I’m deeply impressed by their public relations people.
Of course, in fairness to Mathis, dealing forthrightly with potential critics is easier when you haven’t lured them into an interview under false pretenses.
This letter has guaranteed that I will be watching this series. :)
Very good PR
If this channel is anything like the UK History channel, then by the time this show goes to air it will have been renamed Alien Pyramid Sharks of the Third Reich.
Kenny:
You need to give up on the NDE thing. It is a phenomenon. It is not at all religious. I tried to say this the other day but I think it was either overlooked or rejected. I’ll just say that NDEs are not proof of God and you aren’t going to win anyone here over by insisting vehemently that they are.
That… that actually sounds sort of fascinating, in a disturbing way. Or it might be the plot of a Hellboy comic.
Interesting. I may have to dust off my TV to watch it.
Eons ago I lost respect for the History Channel when a show on Ben Franklin turned out to be an crappy infomercial for the movie National Archives.
Interesting. I may have to dust off my TV to watch it.
Eons ago I lost respect for the History Channel when a show on Ben Franklin turned out to be an crappy infomercial for the movie National Archives.
No such movie, I’m afraid. Could it have been the film National Treasure?
If so, then that would tick me off as well.
Oh Fuck
I’m itching for a fight with Kenny boy and I’ve been waiting for him at the Duggar/Big Vagina thread. Now I find he’s here. Kenny, I’m not repeating it all just because you leave threads when you’re outgunned, but basically it’s on lad. I’m on the piss, I’ve got the time tonight, I’m feeling all anti-creobot and I’ve got the bitchy gene working.
I refer to your previous post in the Big Vag thread that said you didn’t mind personal insults. Ok then, you’re a small dicked, atrophied brained Godbot sheeple with fuck all to espouse rather than what you’ve been told to by you pastor.
If that doesn’t flush you out nothing will. You big fat lying knob.
Hmm,
I know there are a few readers of Pharyngula in the entertainment business, so they would undoubtably be better informed than I would. But it was my understanding that the producers, i.e. the ones that wrote the letter and are working with the PR people, are not necessarily directly associated with the History Channel.
Thus it is really a mistake to judge the content of the series evolve by the rest of the content on the History Channel.
Certainly it is possible that the History Channel may have been heavily involved. Yet, it may also be that one reason that the History Channel does show infomercials for National Treasure and all day all night WWII coverage, as well as the garbage like uncritical shows about the shroud of Turin is because these shows are available to them, probably at a discount rate. After all, in order to attract advertisers, the channel has to find shows which are watched.
So unless further information is available, let’s not just assume that because the History Channel shows a lot of non-scientific crap that his show is necessarily garbage.
It sounds like the producers are trying to treat the subject properly, are aware of the community of rationalists who are devoted to good science, and are still trying to attract viewers who are less familiar with evolutionary theory than we are.
Kudos to the producers!
(And, if it’s crap, we’ll rip it to shreds here.)
P.S. if it does attract viewers, maybe the History Channel could be persuaded to show shows with better science content. Even classics which are mainly relegated to PBS like Civilization, Cosmos or Connections.
Marketing-wise, this is a good move. Think about PZ’s traffic for a second. Sure, not all those folks are of his mindset, and only a fraction read the comments, but, essentially, you have an immensely popular blog whose readership has some serious overlap with your intended audience, and it’s already being critical of the show.
If you can allay some of those fears with a letter, maybe drop some names (Zimmer!), and let it be known that the peanut gallery was right on a few points (PR flack, draft copy released by mistake, etc.), you’ve just scored big points with about five minutes work. They made a point of noticing us. Now, if the show is actually any good, don’t you think we’ll talk about it again and maybe spread the word?
> That would be an anti-philatelist, or an aphilatelist. Those devoted > to aphilatelism just want to see stamps removed from the public square!
>
> Also, I think I hate myself a little for knowing that word.
> Posted by: SteveyD | May 13, 2008 2:04 AM
Actually the word should be : Philotely not philAtely…
and it means philos + telos = friend + tax (so the actual meaning is the guy that likes taxes (as stamps were a kind of tax to move letters around))
PS: I am not crazy – just greek
There was a flier in my AAAS tote bag announcing that the Science Channel would be broadcasting “Cosmos” this spring. Unfortunately, I don’t get that channel. I believe it’s over now, but they’re still selling the DVD:
http://science.discovery.com/convergence/cosmos/cosmos.html
If there’s anyone from THC reading this, here’s my advice: I won’t bother suggesting more of a history-from-below approach, since I recognize your need to placate your corporate overlords. But I think it was you who, 8 or 9 years ago, aired “War and Remebrance,” and after each episode featured of panel of leading historians who provided context and discussed historical inaccuracies? Do more of that. There’s a wealth of movies to choose from. Show “Reds.” Show “Land and Freedom.” Show “The Lives of Others.” Show any of thousands of historical films. Bring on the historians and let them do their thing.
Thank you for listening.
hahah
I want to thank you for your post “The History Channel might do something right”
=
“Thank you for a backhanded compliment”
I wrote the History Channel during the 600 years of degenerate, godless, inhuman behavior advertisements for The Dark Ages, letting them know I would not watch them until they pulled the ad and apologized. They did neither and I have not watched the channel since. Nor will I now.
Looks like theyre taking this seriously.(Can someone tell me if I spelled “there” wrong?)
NDE is a huge thing to study, but you won’t find dawkins near it because it goes against his own belief system.
Or because he’s … like … an evolutionary biologist. That could be the reason too. It’s a tough call.
I couldn’t help but think of the credits from Monty Python and the Holy Grail, “The writers of the previous credits have been sacked”
—
Cosmos is still on the Science Channel on Tuesdays either 8 or 9 pm ET. (and again 3 hours later) check your local listings.
—
Kenny, maybe Dawkins doesn’t go near NDE’s because he is not a neurologist and it is outside his field of expertise, not because “it doesn’t fit his worldview”.
But they didn’t invite PZ!
I totally agree with Kenny. I’ve had several Near Death Experiences(tm).
People, do not underestimate the power of Salvia divinorum.
Um, I mean Jeebus.
Zimmer’s very good; his involvement is a good sign (if they listen to him).
Kenny, have some cake and STFU about NDEs,kthx.
Sven, I must respectfully disagree. The NDE (Nebraska Department of Education) is a completely legitimate topic for discussion in this forum.
Flex, thanks for an excellent point. And for those critics of the History Channel, please let me point out that my beloved Discovery Channel had a pretty dark period a few years ago when they introduced American Chopper, which was and is a blight on the satellite waves. Every channel has its better and worse moments. And if you REALLY want good science programming, that’s what science-specific channels are all about (and programs like NOVA).
Has the History channel and Discovery channel really plummeted that badly that nobody trusts them to make one decent show? Wow, I remember when TLC went downhill, that was such a sad time for me. Although in regards to the UFO and ghost crap they’d throw on every once in a while, I viewed that as intentions to show people not to believe everything they see. They’d have shows where you see both sides to a story, one sounded intelligent the other sounded like dung being pulled out of ones ass and it made it’s case, then they’d randomly throw in a program of nothing but dung. I suppose that would require one to watch the shows or documentaries long enough to realize there was a difference.
Meh *shrugs*
@33 Nullifidian
My mistake. Yes, it was the movie National Treasure. The movie was set around the National Archives.
I lost all respect for the channel and I never watched another HC show. Then again, I watch like 3 hrs a month with a commercial skipping DVR, so no big loss on their part.
HC: We’re working with the top biologists in the field.
US: Who?
HC: (chewing on pipe) Top. Biologists.
I too am sickened by the decline of TLC, DC and HC. Now Science is beginning to go the same way. Further, one of my grandsons got the impression somehow from me that everything on TLC, DC and Science was the absolute truth. Now he is a devotee of UFO Files. Fortunately, he is only ten years old and there is time to save him.
Even so, these channels are businesses whose main objective in life is to make a profit and stay alive. From that point of view, you 10% elitists don’t influence them as much as the 70% general audience that likes such things as The Shroud of Turin, BS tho it may be.
Considering that perhaps a majority of their potential audience has no faith in evolution, and given the release of Ben Stein’s piece of crap, I think they are pretty courageous in showing anything actually accurate about evolution at all. They are taking a chance that a significant portion of their potential audience will not watch the show because it offends their religious beliefs. That’s pretty brave for a commercial enterprise.
IF this show pans out as a good representation of evolution, give them credit where credit is due and be happy that all those Shroud of Turin viewers “paid” for it.
The History Channel recently had “Clash of the Cavemen” which was about two different human species encountering each other in Europe 30,000 years ago. I thought it was very good, but I’m not a scientist.
For those afraid they’ll miss the programs or don’t have cable. you DO realize that the Internet is your personal Digital Video Recorder, right?
Google “BitTorrent” and “NZB”.
Also, THIS ARTICLE might be of some interest as well, RE: the Internet as personal DVR.
This is a little off topic but it’s the most relevant post I could use today for creationism.
You may laugh and/or ridicule and I won’t blame you but I have to go on record (just in case) for a vision I had falling asleep last night.
Ready?
Ben Stein is sacrificing his career to distroy Intelligent Design. He is the ultimate counter ID plant.
Yes, I have allready made an appointment with the doc.
peter g
hooray for THC!
When I read about all the crap on THC I just remind myself that there’s a lot of crap on PBS, too, especially during pledge drives, but they have also produced awesome stuff like “Judgment Day: Intelligent Design.” And at the bookstore I go to, Seed Magazine is right next to Fortean Times. I don’t trust networks or bookstores or anyone else to make sure none of the good stuff bumps elbows with the rubbish. I figure I can use my brain to work that out for myself. Still, I do see the point–things that get shelved together might get lumped together intellectually, as though astrology and astronomy are competing disciplines. Our hope must always be, I suppose, that people will be stimulated to dig deeper and trust that some will have the critical thinking skills to slouch toward enlightenment.
Well, since it was brought up… I liked Ice Road Truckers but am irritated by the prevalence of stupid ersatz-religious garbage like UFOs and ghosts/spirits on cable stations including the History channel and the SciFi channel.
By the way, my imaginary kitten-in-the-sky can kick the ass of your imaginary angry-daddy-in-the-sky with the use of her special magic kitty powers!
Still, I do see the point–things that get shelved together might get lumped together intellectually, as though astrology and astronomy are competing disciplines.
This is what – among other things – turned me away from CourtTV. They would have a couple of episodes of “Forensic Files” (like a real-life “CSI”), followed immediately by “Psychic Detectives.” DNA evidence not available? Try ESP! Just complementary crime-solving methodologies, after all.
#20
They are aphilatelists because “Philately will get you nowhere”.
Hey, thanks to philately I learned a whole lot about geography when I was a kid. Cool stuff….
Wildly inappropriate:
Would somebody who collects new stamps as they are released be a pedophilatelist?
That sure would be awkward to explain at parties…
Yes, but what have stamps done for me philately?
back on topic, I think that its refreshing that HC (or their reps) are at least listening, and responding to the science community.
As if we needed more evidence of the existence of flaws in a free-market capitalist system that can have significant negative effects on the culture within which the system operates.
I could go for a little philatio right now.
I got pissed off at the History Channel when they were showing the Drive thru History series. DTH was a half-hour long sunday school lesson. It belongs on one of the xian mythology cable/satellite networks where it appears regularly, not on a channel that purports to show real history. I watched THC when it was a 24/7 Hitler channnel because I am into WWII history, but now it’s all Ice Truckers with Axes or Modern Marvels which documents the history of things like staplers or Things that are not in the Bible but people think they are.
Maybe I’ll watch Evolve but I’ll have to TIVO it so I don’t get any of the vampire/mummy/jeebus/ax-murderer/bible shit.
noodlesoup
as in “Noodlesoup Productions”?
@#23 Ichthyic —
Truthiness?
Truthiness?
*bing*
figures Colbert would have coined the term.
>Or because he’s … like … an evolutionary biologist.
>That could be the reason too. It’s a tough call.
Well, he acts like he is the final authority on every subject known to man. So, I thought why not.
Morning Kenney, as a public service to you, since you move around so much in the blogs and have stated you do not always go back to previous posts, there are several posts directly related to you, actually directed to you, near the end of the Duggar Family article. If you like, would be glad to give you the numbers so you do not have to search. Let me know.
Ciao, Jeffrey
That’s great!! obviously it’s EXACTLY the same channel we get in the US. I refer to it as ‘The Hitler Channel’ myself.
I completely lost faith in THC a while ago, but I will definitely watch this evolution series.
Has anyone seen the show on THC about Hitler believing the world was hollow? and having a “military expedition” turn their telescopes skyward to “find” the US??
It’s a shame that a channel with so much potential and so much to draw from selects two subjects to cover: World War II and the paranormal. With the occasional other “popular american war” like the civil war or rev war etc. thrown in. Maybe it should be “The Popular American War Channel. Now with ghosts!”
But I am excited for this show, so hopefully I won’t be let down!