Another screenshot. Must stop with all these screenshots. But…
This is from the comments on the Ex-Muslims of North America Facebook page’s posting of the New York Times article. It explains things so neatly…
Zubair Changaiz
shoot them all who leave islam
no concept of Ex Muslim or parallism, those people who leave islam there is no place in islam just shoot them
Hos Loftus Thanks for shooting down the “Islam is the religion of peace” and “there is no compulsion in Islam” crap!
Sam Al-Nahi Yeah, this must be that Muslim peace and serenity I keep hearing about.
Zubair Changaiz yup i know islam is the religion of peace and we muslim love humanity but those people who left islam are called “murtad” and there is clear cut order “shoot them”
Ok
It’s Peace But. It’s Love Humanity But. It’s Those Who Leave My Religion Are Not Human And.
Only thing I would ask — I think that analytical rigor is crucial — is how do we know that the speakers are Muslim?
They probably are but how do we KNOW?
Oh well…I just checked on Facebook and there does appear to be a man (Zubair Changaiz) of that identity.
Religion is the human practice of holding the moral high ground while being despicably immoral int he process.
The post is public, as I think all (or most of) their posts are, and the name is linkable there. I removed the links here just to be polite (it seems a little intrusive to post links to strangers on FB from a blog).
But, yes. So here it is: religion is wonderful and beautiful and really very nice to everybody, and because of this we have to be very nasty indeed to people who don’t agree with us. Sorry, but it’s true: religion is always right, and if you don’t agree you must be wrong in every conceivable way, and because we religious people are truly nice we have to punish the others, because those — those people are just so terribly terribly bad. It’s because we’re nice, you see. So we have to kill people, because they’re horrible and we want everyone to be nice, just like us. It’s obvious, really, and why can’t everyone understand this? We WANT PEACE, for God’s sake, so we have to shut you up. Obviously.
Obviously Islam uses the definition of “peace” that was adopted by the late Soviet Union: “The state of the world after we have exterminated, or at least subjugated, all opposition.” There will have to be a great scism in Islam, with one branch learning to coexist with the non-Islamic world and the other being sent to join Thugee.
…Martians, yes, of course; how can we possibly know that a person who talks like a Martian on behalf of all intelligent life-forms everywhere who subscribe or claim to subscribe to Martianism is, in fact, and most trulily truly an actually really and genuinely honest-to-godly palpable Martian? Look them up on Facebook, of course. Then we’ll know. I suppose the Pope is on Facebook. If I had an account with Facebook I could undoubtedly confirm that the Pope is veritably and in every conceivable way a Roman Catholic. But I am content to ignore Facebook and to assume that the Pope is probably a Roman Catholic, and if he isn’t, well, he wears swirly clothes and a special sort of hat, so I might as well suppose that he is, and some millions of self-proclaimed Roman Catholics say that they believe that he is, though I’m not going to look them up on Facebook either.
Gordon Willis.
I am confused; what are you talking about?
Your comment used many words but not in an order which makes sense.
Gordon was pretty obviously addressing the oddity of your comment, David. It was already pretty clear that Zubair Changaiz is on Facebook, since I posted a screenshot of the exchange. I could have faked it, I suppose, with some effort, but whatever for? Anyway what would his presence on FB have to do with confirming that he’s a Muslim? In any case I never said he was a Muslim; I quoted what he and others said, and commented on that. Perhaps he’s an impostor, but there’s no particular reason to think so – the ex-Muslims do get a lot of pressure and abusive comments, because they are ex-Muslims; it’s unlikely that all of that comes from impostors.
Fuck that. “Oddity of my question.”
Sheesh
Excuse me?
Gordon @#4:
“….So here it is: religion is wonderful and beautiful and really very nice to everybody, and because of this we have to be very nasty indeed to people who don’t agree with us. Sorry, but it’s true: religion is always right, and if you don’t agree you must be wrong in every conceivable way, and because we religious people are truly nice we have to punish the others, because those — those people are just so terribly terribly bad. It’s because we’re nice, you see. So we have to kill people…..”
This may be true of some followers of some religions. And as far as I can gather, Islam and its adherents have the worst track record in the modern world. But it is a bit of a stretch (sweep?) to generalise this way.And I am sure you will agree.
@ #7 Sorry, David. Here it is in few words: if it growls like a wolf, you don’t need to assume that it’s possibly a duck just pretending. Facebook will know, of course…
@Omar #11
By all means, stretch or sweep, either will do, I think. But I was addressing the topic. I’m not sure what you think I am generalising about. I suppose it’s my extrapolation from “yup i know islam is the religion of peace and we muslim love humanity but those people who left islam are called ‘murtad’ and there is clear cut order ‘shoot them'” with arrows, I suppose, and only if you wear absurdly short long trousers. He said it, not me, and it’s an attitude adopted by quite a lot of people, whether they are typical or not.
Actually, this reminds me of a common expression in use when I was a child back in the 50’s: “X should be shot”. You know, union members and other riff-raff. I had forgotten this till just now. So maybe David is right and we are really just dealing with a duck in wolf’s kameez. Makes no practical difference, though.
I really appreciated your observation, Gordon Willis (4). Perhaps dry wit flies too far over ducks’ heads.
I am flattered by your comment, Blanche. Thank you very much.
I think that Zubair Changaiz is being completely honest and upfront we he says muslim love humanity closely followed by there is clear cut order “shoot them”.
It’s is the business of religion to be as sectarian as possible and to clearly identify who your (as a member of a particular religion) ingroup is and who the outgroup is.
Those who leave Islam are, in Zubair Changaiz’s ideology, simply not human beings.
And although he does not say this explicitly, I suspect that is exactly how he feels about those who have never belonged to Islam as well.
steve oberski @17
There is a school of thought in Islam that everyone is a Muslim, it’s just that some people haven’t realized it yet.
I wonder if the police have been notified and whether such use of the internet to make actual death threats against ex-Muslims is considered at all legal?
Seems to me Zubair Changaiz is at the very least guilty of inciting hatred and deserves to face legal sanctions for that.
As for the use of facebook or anything else online being used for epistemological verification – thing is on the internet nobody knows your’e a dog!
Occams Razor applies though as always. Unless there’s an extraordinary evidence or reason to believe this exchange isn’t what it appears to be then its reasonable and logical to assume that it is what it appears to be
Al Dente, #18: what like all atheists are really christians and/or satanists who hate god? More proof that all religions are incestuous I guess.