The New Humanist Advent Podcasts continue, with entries from Marcus Brigstocke, Mark Steel, Ann Druyan, Josie Long, Tim Minchin, Philip Jeays, Dara O’Briain, and in a grand finale, Richard Dawkins. I know, it’s a little early — you purists can wait to open the last little door.
Pharyngula
Evolution, development, and random biological ejaculations from a godless liberal
Collect ’em all here:
http://blog.newhumanist.org.uk/search/label/Advent Podcasts
Bah.
URL FAIL.
Try this instead
Oh, now, this was just too rich not to share!
Happy Holidays, everyone.
************************************************************
Priest ‘ruins Christmas’ for kids
By David Willey
BBC News, Rome
Dozens of parents complained after the priest let out the Santa secret
A Catholic priest has been criticised by parents in a city in northern Italy for telling their children that Father Christmas does not really exist.
Father Dino Bottino, the parish priest of the Sacred Heart Catholic Church in Novara, let out the secret at a children’s mass earlier this month.
A local paper published complaints from dozens of parents. “You’ve ruined my children’s Christmas,” said one mother.
But an unrepentant Fr Bottino called it his duty to set the record straight.
“I told the children that Father Christmas was an invention that had nothing to do with the Christian Christmas story,” he said.
“And I would repeat it again, if I had the chance,” he added.
But Father Dino could not have imagined the scorn that would be heaped upon him after he told children at mass that neither Father Christmas – nor the kindly witch called the Befana who provides presents at New Year to Italian children – really exist.
< <<<>>>>
HAHAHAHAHA
“Recession boosting church attendance” story appears to be bogus.
Hey Pz
Remember me! Merry X-Mas
This is my gift fo you…
http://www.debatepolitics.com/conspiracy-theories/41530-bloody-end-american-capitalism.html#post1057858675
My new favorite quote:
And I would celebrate Charles Darwin for having the most revolutionary concept in human history, the one idea that could completely dethrone the patriarchal chains that kept us from seeing who we really are and for his undoing of what is I think the most nefarious lie and that is that we were created separately from the rest of nature.
— Ann Druyan
Heh, Tim Minchin’s going to be here (Adelaide) for the Fringe Festival next year – I’ve already got my ticket. It should be one of many great shows I’ll see – I’m a theatre critic; not only will I see lots of shows but I’ll see them for the small price of having to write about whether I liked them or not.
It’s one of those occasions where if I was unfortunate (or foolish) enough to believe in a god I’d probably be thanking it. Luckily I’m neither…
Thanks and Happy Monkey. I have nothing to give in return except my visit which your sponsors appreciate! :-)
Happy Kwaanzchrismanukkahnalivustice-ul-Adha, Monkey, and Secular Gift-Giving Day everyone.
yes, it’s a bit clunky, but I had to pull out Ramadan, which forced a move for Saturnalia, worked in Eid-ul-Adha, had no idea where to put the Monkey … suddenly I understand what they’re going through in Olympia.
Hmmm… these things keep crashing my browser. Anyone else have this problem?
Hey PZ,
i just had an idea,how nice would it be if the commenters here could decloak somewhere,and talk to each other without nyms….
Facebook might be one option,IRC another,you reckon thats worth pursuing?
I was looking at your FB friends and thought,bummer,I probably spent considerable time with the people behind those names,and I wouldnt have a clue….
Anyway,just a thought….
Perhaps the chief service provided by Pharyngula is that it demonstrates beyond dispute that Darwinism (i.e., the modern theory of evolution) is the indispensable creation myth of materialism (and of its kin: atheism). Only the defense of an essential element of a philosophical worldview could inspire the kind of teeth-clenched, foaming-at-the-mouth, fevered-brow, wild-eyed, supercilious, vulgar rhetoric that is so typical of the Darwinian faithful who post to this blog. The hysteria of Darwinism’s defenders is inexplicable if the only thing at risk is a mere scientific theory.
@ #12
Yay for trolls. They’re so cute, with their little brains and half-coherent thoughts they struggle to put together.
To Dr. Meyers,
I respectfully ask that you cease publishing your offensive blog on this, the most sacred of holidays for Christians. I do not expect you to comply. You have shown nothing but abject hatred for all things holy in the past. However, I thought I would give you one more chance and appeal to your sense of humanity. I am asking you to do the right thing. Please do not publish your offensive blog during the Christmas Holiday.
In Christ I pray for you.
Fly, who the fuck are you even to think about making such an asinine request? You are the one who should censor yourself for your stupidly, irrationality, and godbotting. You need to apologize to the whole blog for your action, and then go away never to post here again.
Fixed it for you again. When will you learn?
Fly, you are warned:
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/12/warning_proselytization_is_not.php
Fly;
I’m sure PZ would agree to refrain from adding to his blog for a day in deference to the obvious offense you take at his existence if you agree to reciprocate for the other 364 days of the year.
As soon as the god-bothering sheeple realise that we would shut up of our own volition the second they stopped bleating then we can all get along with our lives. Until then I’ll keep making any and every damn noise I think will achieve the same objective.
To Fly in the Ointment,
I respectfully ask that you cease publishing your inane comments on this, a holiday which you seem to think should trump freedom of speech.
I hope that one day you will see reason, but I doubt it.
Fly, you did not answer my simple little question about who your lord is. To be fair, my question was not in good faith.
But I do have an other question, what gives you the right to tell an other people that they should close up their site? By what authority?
Funny thing, when I hit your link, I got this pop up:
If you so need a place to correspond, just set up your own site. Trust me, I will not feel the need to go there and tell you to shut it down.
One last note, you would make yourself seem less unintelligent if you could spell PZ’s name right.
On second thought, Fly is a good name for you, it implies that at one point, you were an maggot wriggling around in dead flesh.
“Fly, you are warned:”
Queue the ominous music.
Ban me. You will only prove me right.
In Christ
Fixed it for you again. Jebus, you are a slow learner.
Jackass, that will prove nothing. It does not prove that Christmas is a holy holiday. It does not prove the existence of your god. The only thing it proves is that you are an annoy git with a persecution complex. Such high ambitions for one who used to roll about in dead flesh.
Just testing to see if HTML can be used in the username section.
Happy Newton day in advance everyone – I’m afk for the next few days. Don’t drink and blog, and don’t smoke too many monkeys.
Fly, you need to show physical evidence for you imaginary god, and the imaginary christ. There is no evidence to show that either exist. That makes you delusional. So, here’s a chance to prove yourself right. Show us the physical evidence for both, which does not include anything from the bible. The inaccuracy of that book is–wait for it– legendary.
My O’ my. A big heaping pile of Troll today. must get pop corn made from “christ chex” waffers and enjoy the show.
Yes Fly, I’m sure you’d love to be banned and made a martyr of the internets. All your friends are bound to see your sacrifice as example of how dedicated you are to your faith, and will no doubt heap praises on you.
Re messages 13, 15, 17, 18, 19, 22 (and others of the same kind that are doubtless soon to come): I rest my case (presented in message 12).
The presumption of inerrancy on the part of the Darwinian faithful (represented here by PZ Myers’ amen chorus) is as predictable as it is off-putting to those who are out of the fold. Which raises a question: Why do people who want to be persuasive write in a way that ensures they’ll be ignored by those they want to persuade? Is this blog intended to be nothing more than an intellectual circle jerk? If so, it appears to be quite successful in that regard.
Ah – apparently it can’t. I wanted to show my name as “El
wood Herring” (strike through the woo!)I’d like to sum up this thread with the following.
BLARGH.
Try some humour and beer for the holiday.
But Christmas isn’t the most sacred of holidays for Christians.
I’m an atheist, and I know that.
What the hell are you not to know that?
Flyshit in the Ointment, just out of curiosity, how will PZ banning you for persistently breaking one of this blog’s few rules prove you right?
ho·ly
adj. ho·li·er, ho·li·est
1. Belonging to, derived from, or associated with a divine power; sacred.
2. Regarded with or worthy of worship or veneration; revered: a holy book.
3. Living according to a strict or highly moral religious or spiritual system; saintly: a holy person.
4. Specified or set apart for a religious purpose: a holy place.
5. Solemnly undertaken; sacrosanct: a holy pledge.
6. Regarded as deserving special respect or reverence: The pursuit of peace is our holiest quest.
7. Informal Used as an intensive: raised holy hell over the mischief their children did.
Ah yes, Christmas, the magical “holy” day which was assimilated from older non-christian cultures. BTW, most Jews, Hindus and Muslims repudiate that December 25 is “special” too since the Solstice, which is what the Pagans were actually celebrating, occurs 3 days earlier. It always took the Pagans a few days to determine that the Sun was past its southern most point in the sky before they put on a big fete. The puritans banned the celebration of Christmas. The Victorians brought it into favor again making it a sentimentalized gift bonanza, though I doubt they could have foreseen the utterly grotesque commercialized monstrosity it is today. I do agree with the sentiment “peace on Earth, good will toward men”, although you test my sense of good will.
As for the validity of the word holy, you have to buy into all that divine power shit. Thanks but no thanks, I realized that was a fairy tale long ago. (See: The Emperor’s New Clothes) You go celebrate Midnight Mass or whatever you do and don’t worry your empty little head about us heathens and we won’t worry about you.
Peace.
Jackie, we are mocking idiocy of the godbots who post here. We aren’t trying to change their minds, because driving god out of somebody usually requires a trauma–like actually reading the bible cover to cover. You will find that trauma at the start of many conversions to atheism.
Keep in mind they, like you, are posting at a known atheist blog. They will not receive kind treatment if they try to godbot us. Having faith does not mean one can’t post here or be acknowledged if they write well. But the godbotting must be kept to minimum. A couple of the Molly winners are theists. Fly does nothing but godbot, and doesn’t answer questions. So total scorn is heaped upon him.
Oops – heathen
sJackie, you have proved nothing. You are typical of the person who tries to jam a rational viewpoint in religious terms. You leave behind gobbledygook.
Heeee,heee,heeeee. *Jackie/circle jerk* heeeheeeheheheheheeh.
Is there anything at all that an atheist could write about atheism that would persuade you?
And of course, you really need to ask the same question of yourself. You are precisely writing in a way that ensures that you will be ignored. Do you actually want to persuade, or do you just want to be self-righteous in our general direction?
Jackie, wrong again, we are not trying to persuade, at least not you anyway. For we know that with a certain type of mind, i.e. usually the kind most creotards have, it is simply not possible. Us evilutionists on the other hand, no problem changing ours, all you need is evidence. Please feel free to supply any you may have complete with peer reviewed references.
Jackie the Godbot:
You assume we want to persuade you, and you assume wrong. On the contrary, since you are by no means the first (or even in the first 1,000) xtian to parrot those comments, we are fully aware that persuading you to see reason is a horizon that can never be reached, because – by way of your irrational belief in 2000 year old superstition and mythology – your mind is not open to such discourse.
“Peace on Earth and goodwill to all men”, yeah right. Presumably that would include trolls and godbots (but apparently not women. No peace or goodwill for you ladies I’m afraid!)
Happy Consumerfest everyone.
El
woodLMAO…Monty Python creo-trolls:
“I flaunt my righteousness in your general direction…”
“Fly does nothing but godbot, and doesn’t answer questions. So total scorn is heaped upon him.”
Anyone who reads the messages posted to Pharyngula by the Darwinian faithful soon learns that scorn will be heaped upon anyone who says “No, thanks” to the Darwinian Kool-Aid, no matter how well-reasoned his reasons for refusing to imbibe might be. Nothing more clearly demonstrates the panic that has gripped the Church of Darwin than blogs like Pharyngula.
brokensoldier, OM, a pleasure to see you posting a bit more regularly again. I hope things are well with you, or at least better. Happy monkey.
Wowbagger -you’re a theater critic? I can’t decide if my esteem for you just went way up… or vanished entirely. : P
Okay Kids! How many logical fallacies can you spot?
Hmm..Lets see, church of Darwin.
Darwin considered a god. Nope, a fallible human being. Fail 1.
Holy book. None, Darwin’s Origin of the Species has been superceded by 150 years of science. Fail 2.
Church. No place to go on holy days, which also don’t exist. Fail 3.
Tithes. We pay no tithes. Fail 4
So Jackie, the “Church of Darwin” is a baldfaced lie. Why must godbots like you always lie?
So you don’t want to persuade, and do want to just be idiotically self-righteous at us.
In that case, please take your holier-than-thou attitude, and shove it up your rectum. This will no doubt push the stick that is already there into your spleen, but since you’re already venting that, no great harm.
Jackie, again, fuck the reasonableness of your argument, give us the evidence, real peer reviewed evidence, and we will then listen. Until then, fuck off and godbot somewhere else.
Oh, and happy monkey.
Jackie, you do yourself no favors by equating this to a religion. In fact, in show a mental defect on your part.
Oh well. I prefer my Jackie dressed in cobras anyways.
Since the observation I made in message #12 has been abundantly corroborated by subsequent messages, I bid you a grateful farewell. Have a Happy Winter Solstice (or whatever godless people – oops, godless meat robots – celebrate at this time of the year).
Posted by: John Phillips, FCD | December 24, 2008 11:07 AM
Thanks, and Happy Monkey to you too! Things have gotten a bit better, due in no small part to the help I got from you guys on here. I’m truly grateful to all of you.
Jackie: “I won’t never ever join YOUR club ‘cuz you’re a bunch of MEANIES!!!”
Pharyngula:’Uh, we never asked you to join because we’re not a club.”
Jackie:”Are too!!! Cuz we have churches to tell us whut to ‘blieve, so YOU have to be a church cuz of whut YOU ‘blieve, which makes you a CLUB!!!”
Pharyngula:”Wow, just… Wow.” “Okay… moving right along…”
Do religious people not study spelling? For your stupid-ass god’s sake, the name is at the top of every page! If you can’t even notice that, how are we to trust that you notice the truth of god?
Idiots
We celebrate our version of “There but for the grace of God” when dealing with people like you.
And Jackie: At least we aren’t meatpuppets.
Jackie, I do hope that you are an honest religious type and are true to your promise. I also hope you can learn how not to force a secular point of view in religious drag.
And a very Happy Monkey to you, Broken Soldier!
brokensoldier, OM, we are just glad to have you back, you were missed.
Rather aptly ‘Shine On You Crazy Diamond’ just started playing :)
Happy monkey.
http://www.thestate.com/breaking/story/629997.html
You ask for incontrovertible evidence, I give you angels. 75% of Americans believe in angels, and now one has been photographed. What more evidence could you possibly need.
No, I expect none will ever suffice, but I will make the attempt to play your game.
In Christ.
Shorter Jackie, you won’t accept our witness to god without asking for evidence or mocking. Waaahhhh. Mommmmmmyyyyyyy.
Merry pre Squidmas day to all.
E.V. I happen to love some prime Meat Puppets.
Fixed it for your again. Absolutely no physical evidences shown. Are you even literate? Or just stupid?
panic, church, faithful, kool-aid…that shit’s just stoopid.
I’m more interested in these “well-reasoned reasons” for refusing to accept the fact of biological evolution. Because I’ve never even once seen one offered. It’s always just ignorance, often willful.
Fly is asked for proof. Fly points at reflected light. I wish Fly would meet Brundlefly or Superfly. Either of those would be more intellectually fulfilling.
Flyshit in the Ointment, you are so easily satisfied. Then again, if you persist in believing in a 2000 year old myth without evidence, why should I be surprised that you would accept a photographic aberration as evidence of angels. Your desperation gets sadder with each post.
Happy monkey.
Could I get more nog? I’m still hungry, someone pass the trolls please.
Well, Fly, 100% of atheists believe there is no God. So by your standards of proof, our 100% beats your 75% every time.
Clearly no one here will accept the evidence before them. You are frauds–all of you. You have no morality, no ethics, and persist in your abusive posts. I fear for all of you.
In Christ I shall pray for all of you. Meanwhile, learn something about the nature of your God before you pay the ultimate price. http://blogs.sparenot.com/index.php/workmen/
Don’t worry, I won’t bring the truth back here again. You people barely deserve the message of his eternal love.
No.
That’s a photograph of a TV screen showing a reflection. I know that “reflection” is a big, hard word, but we know lots of big, hard words, like “pareidolia”, “confirmation bias”, and “delusion”.
Fly:
I sincerely hope you keep your promise. And if you do not, may your God punish you accordingly for bearing false witness.
Flyshit in the Ointment, is that a promise. Oh please say it is, it would so make my squidmas. A happy monkey indeed.
Fly, what makes you think we would except the word of somebody who has been shown repeatedly, like yourself, to be a liar and bullshitter. You never had anything to offer, and there is nothing to think about since your god doesn’t exist except between your ears, and jebus is just a myth. When will you finally look at the real evidence. Oh, thats right, you prefer shit to real facts.
You know NOTHING of ethics or morality, you vile little twerp. You actually think your misguided belief in a non-existant deity makes you moral? Fuck you! You don’t have the slightest comprehension of altruism, ethical behavior or morality. You deserve all the heaping blogfulls of scorn thrown at you, you sanctimonious pious ass.
-Merry Fucking Christmas.
Maggot, what we do not deserve is simple minded whiners like you. I do hope you hold up to your promise to not post here again. It would be refreshing to have a honest god botherer.
Just so you know, I will not check out you last link. I do not have a god, therefore, I do not need to learn “the true nature” of something I do not venerate.
You haven’t presented any evidence for us to accept.
Actually, you’re a fraud. A pious fraud.
Again you describe yourself: you are immoral, unethical, and abusive.
Since your “truth” is a lie, I put no faith in what you say.
Spare us this message, then.
…and that’s why we’ll burn in eternal agony!
*burp*
Fly in the Ointment,
Really? Did you honestly think a reflection would convince anyone here? Really?
Stop embarrassing yourself and just go.
so, about that “angel of light”:
The sun came out exactly when the angel of light appeared on the monitor! Now that’s “ironic”!
You people barely deserve the message of his eternal love.
Wait a second. Accord to christian dogma, no one deserves this message of love.
I like this Message Of Love better anyways.
It’s interesting that creationists insult science by calling it a religion.
Essentially they’re admitting that religion, including theirs, is not something that relates to reality, because reality is not something you can choose. But you can choose religions, because they are immaterial, they are nothing but delusion.
They call it a religion to lower it to an equal level with their own beliefs – to lower it from a truth to a delusion… and then they criticize the particulars of it NOT to point out flaws in the theory, but rather to say its not NICE in some way.
They aren’t claiming it’s not a reflection of reality – they’re criticizing what they see as our choice of fantasy world.
Their
fantasy world is oh so much nicer than ours, and we’re losers for having chosen badly.
It’s a FASHION criticism.
Janine is doing a great job of VJing today, just through word association. Keep it up, you’re doing fine so far.
Just substitute “God” or “Jesus” for “Santa” and you have the gist of every Godbot’s laughable argument. This hoary old chestnut is saccharine twaddle. Bleeeech
I get it. The angel put the fluid in the baby’s brain. What a sweet, loving god.
Then I looked at the photo. I didn’t see an angel. I saw an ordinary sunbeam.
What, Fly, do you do with your eyes all day, that these beautiful, but entirely commonplace, interactions between light, windows, and air not entirely familiar to you?
It’s baffling to me that someone could require an extra-ordinary explanation for something so ordinary.
They call evolutionary biology a religion because it conflicts with their belief in a fairy who magically created people and other creatures out of nothing.
They also call atheism a religion. In other words, non-religious people are religious.
They’re just too stupid to understand simple concepts like the definitions of words.
They’re also too stupid to understand the Bill of Rights, especially the Establishment Clause.
Grinch (E.V.), I was hoping to find a copy of Mojo Nixon covering Mr Grinch. It is off a Christmas album that he made back in the early ninties titled Horny Holiday. His rendition of “Twas The Night Before Christmas” is made enjoyable by the adding of the chorus, “Fucking is better than killing”. But I have just crashed off the track now.
Here is Mojo doing Chistmas, Christmas.
Here is Aimee Mann doing You’re A Mean One.
‘heart’
@ Fly in the Ointment
If you don’t like the material on Pharyngula, you’re not obligated to stick around. What’s stopping you?
http://www.thestate.com/breaking/story/629997.html
At one point of the elections, 43% of Americans also believed that Obama was a Muslim. Shall this mean that it is indeed true? What people believe is to be true and what is fact are often very, VERY different animals.
Happy Holidays to you too. In these parts, we prefer “Happy Monkey.” Now, don’t you have a family to celebrate with?
Most interesting – the URL links to a Westboro Baptist Church blog. I’m beginning to think Fly is a Poe.
Yes, we heap scorn on those who choose to ignore the heaps of evidence that they are wrong, when they offer no valid evidence to back their claims up.
Sounds good to me.
Fly, Don’t waste your fear on me. However, if you are indeed in charge of hell fire, do send it my way. It’s 59 degrees in this room, I could use the heat.
Janine, have you heard Leon Redbone’s Christmas Island? Not your usual fair, I’m sure *grin*, but I really like it.
Patricia, I wanna be seduced as much as the next person… sigh…
Well, I could not find that on YouTube. But I found this, Leon Redbone and Dr John. Enjoy.
craig @ 81,
I like the way you think.
Janine, you found my favorite xmas duet. (Rickie Lee Jones’ and Dr. John’s duet album is the awesome too)
Janine, That’s it!
#11 Posted by clinteas on December 24, 2008 at 5:13 AM
Personally, I don’t have a problem with that. But then you might have guessed that already…
John B. Sandlin
#14 Posted by Fly in the Ointment on December 24, 2008 at 9:56 AM
Merry Christmas to you too.
Er, I hope you aren’t offended that a non-Christian wishes you to have a happy secular holiday at Christmas-time.
What? You don’t think Christmas is secular? By Federal Law it is. Once it was made a Federal Holiday it was fully secular. By Law. You can’t change that. So, for the last hundred and twenty years or so, wishing someone a Merry Christmas, or a Happy Holiday, or a Joyous Noel, or any number of other greetings, has been a completely secular act (at least in the United States).
So, Happy Holidays.
Oh, and I will be posting tomorrow, Christmas Day, on my own blog. If you don’t like that, you don’t have to read it.
John B. Sandlin
I was under the impression that Easter was the most sacred of holidays for Christians. That whole resurrection/redemption of sins thing was supposed to be the raison d’être for Christers. Thanks for setting me straight, FITO.
#12 Posted by Jackie on December 24, 2008 at 9:25 AM
Actually, having our children forced to believe certain fairy tales are true and finding that at every turn the make believe story told in Genesis is being presented to our children as scientific truth (or at least someone is trying to do so) is what causes non-Christians to be so up-in-arms. How dare you claim otherwise!
We don’t *need* our scientific theories to be true. When evidence comes along disproving them, we gladly scrap the wrong ideas and accept the new. Each new discovery has only confirmed the fact of evolution. A tale told at camp fires in nomadic shepherd camps for centuries (and likely evolving, changing over that time) is not science, is not fact, and isn’t worth believing, then or now. In a court of law it would be booted out as hearsay. The story in Genesis is myth, legend, entertainment, morality tale, and above all, fiction. It just didn’t happen that way.
There is no original sin. There is no need for Jesus to be crucified on the cross for our redemption because of Genesis (I allow there could be other reasons, just not the apple in the garden). Merry Secular Holiday In December (and if you have a religious one at this time, enjoy that too).
John B. Sandlin
#28 Posted by Jackie on December 24, 2008 at 10:45 AM
Quite the sample size you have there. I’m sure, in your mind, these posts represent ALL Atheists. But what if there are other examples. I haven’t gone back to 13, 15, 17, 18, 19, or 22 yet, so I’m not sure what they are guilty of, in your mind, but I can assure you, Darwinism, or whatever you want to call it, isn’t a central tenet of Atheist Faith. There. Is. No. Atheist. Faith.
It isn’t an assumption of inerrancy. It is an understanding of just how well tested and well supported it is. The world is round is a well supported theory – it is also a fact. The earth orbits the center of mass for our solar system is a well supported theory – it is also a fact. The living things, plants, animal, and otherwise, of this planet evolve is a well supported theory – it is also a fact. The story told in Genesis is not well supported – it is not a fact, it is a fairy tale.
I kindly ask that you not shove your religion, no matter how popular in this nation, down my throat or the throats of my children. Don’t attempt to pass laws that say my children must be taught fairy tales are true in public schools. Don’t attempt to pass laws that say I have to be nice and respectful to a book full of fairy tales. Don’t attempt to pass laws that say I have to believe what you believe.
You don’t have the evidence to support your position. You don’t have the evidence to claim atheists are wrong. You don’t have the evidence for much of anything. But you do have cojones, coming in here shouting us down as intolerant assholes. Just don’t expect us to respond to that nicely.
John B. Sandlin
#43 Posted by: Jackie on December 24, 2008 at 11:05 AM
We are not Darwinian faithful – for that implies belief without evidence. We have the evidence. You, however, do not.
Evidence is the basis for understanding and knowledge. But you Godbots don’t like knowledge – that is a forbidden fruit and not to be had by humans. You’ve been trying to disavow knowledge for centuries and are very well practiced at it. So well, in fact, you probably don’t even know you’re doing it.
Blogs like Pharyngula have become havens for atheists because we find others here that also understand the world around us. In the rest of our lives (unless we are a scientist, perhaps) we are surrounded by charlatans preaching feel good gospels and hokem remedies. We gather at this particular water cooler because the owner, one PZ Myers, thinks and speaks the same language we do.
The rules of the game here are simple: present your evidence, make your case, or move on. So far, most of the religiots have a hard time following those rules. Those that don’t follow these simple rules are ridiculed. If you find yourself being ridiculed, perhaps you should examine how well you’re following the rules.
It’s simple, if you think you have a case, present the evidence why we’re wrong and you’re right. If all you have is opinion, you’re free to state it, but don’t expect automatic reverence. In fact, don’t expect any reverence, ever.
Have you not noticed that even between people who agree there is a large current of attack and parry? For an analogy, this is a place for fencing, sword play, and battle. We sharpen our wits, clear out our cobwebs, and generally argue our cases here. Often the exchanges become heated and the language reflects that.
It isn’t that we single out Christians for disrespect. Everyone here has exactly the same amount of respect coming in – none. If you want respect, earn it, play by the rules: present your evidence, make your case, or move on. Godbotting is guaranteed to prevent you earning any respect. Godbotting is parroting the words of Answers-In-Genesis without understanding them, repeating what your preacher told you without understanding it, quoting scripture from a fairy tale without understanding that it is, in fact, just a fairy tale.
It isn’t a panic you detect, but a feeding frenzy. Beware, it isn’t children we eat, but trolls.
Now, one last thought – fairy tales, told well, are not without merit.
John B. Sandlin (I’m going to have to add an abbreviation behind my name soon – something like HOTLW – He Of The Long Wind – even my abbreviation is too long).
#51 Posted by: Jackie on December 24, 2008 at 11:17 AM
Godless people celebrate their families, their human ties, things that are real, observable, and enjoyable. WTF is a GodBot doing here on a Christian Holiday Eve anyway? Shouldn’t you be at Mass somewhere consuming Jesus flesh in the form of a tasteless cracker and drinking some of Jesus blood in the form of really bad wine?
Happy Monkey to you, too.
And yes, shown by many recent neurological studies, we are godless meat robots. You are too, by the way.
JBS
#59 Posted by Fly in the Ointment on December 24, 2008 at 11:28 AM
One) no one at the time saw the Angels other than the mother when looking at that monitor; they were only seen via a camera. Two) the image is overexposed direct sunlight shining against the wall.
When we say evidence, we mean actual evidence. How is it you see that and think angel? I see that and recognize instantly what I’ve seen dozens of times before: an overloaded CCD image.
.
JBS
#68 Posted by Fly in the Ointment on December 24, 2008 at 11:43 AM
Clearly you have no clue what evidence is and whether it is before anyone. How dare you, of all people, call us frauds? How dare you ever insinuate we have no morality, you of all people? How dare you imply we have no ethics, you of all people? Abusive posts? You haven’t seen abusive. These are mildly put compared to what you deserve. Don’t bother fearing for me. I have examined that evidence you’ve only heard about – your bible is lacking and does not deserve the unrequited faith you put into it.
How nice – telling me you’re going to ask for my forgiveness while also telling me I’m condemned to pay the ultimate price. And what, exactly, do you know about the nature of your god? I have studied your god, carefully.
Let me ask this: How do you know you have faith in the right god? Perhaps Odin is the one true God, or Zeus, or Mithras, or … Allah.
Perhaps you are the one condemned to pay the ultimate price.
… Your link is broke. You wouldn’t happen to have a spare, would you?
You haven’t yet brought us any truth, so you are quite likely not going to ever bring us any. How dare you presume to judge us? Do you really think you have an inside line? Do you actually and honestly believe it? Or is this trip of yours into our break area something you consider penance for not believing well enough?
Ah, that is likely it, you think you ought to believe but can’t quite make it stick and so you’re here puffing out your chest attempting to bluff your way into heaven — it won’t work. (Aside from being a fairy tale) Your god should see right through to your evil soul.
Why is it the religiots that think they can get away with so much evil, anyway?
JBS
The problem is you’re starting with a false assumption, that theists are knowledgeable about their own religion. I’ve seen, as somewhat of an expert on religion in the U.S., very little to show that to be true and overwhelming evidence to the contrary.