You know what to do. Get out there and vote.
I’m going to be squeezing in a long day working as an election judge at my local polling place (and I’m hoping that I will be very, very busy with a large turnout), in addition to taking care of teaching. If it’s a little quiet around here, don’t worry — it’s just that today is the culmination of a lot of anxious agonizing.
At the very least, I’ll be back online after the polls close. Until then, tell us about your voting experiences — may they all be routine and boring.
Done and done. The process took 1.5 hours, and my back is killing me. Hardest work I’ve done in a while!
1 Obama vote in Ohio. On my way to work, I saw a high school student holding a McCain sign. I stopped and asked him if he’s rich; he could only laugh.
I voted early. I wish I hadn’t. I feel left out today! Seriously!
The lines weren’t too bad. Longer than I recall them the other time I voted (I voted in Texas in the last election. Kansas today). The line was a few dozen people when my husband and I arrived. When we left the polling place (again a church, ugh), the line was gone.
The weather was chilly here. I had on my jacket.
The wait was not long at all. The longest was the short line for the voting machines.
On a side note paper ballots were offered at the polling place today for those who wanted them. I opted for an electronic machine after a short discussion with my husband. A receipt appeared, behind glass, to confirm who I voted for. I still feel uneasy, but it’s better than nothing.
Everyone in my family has voted by now. My mother and step-father, in California, voted early (she called to let me know she voted no on prop 8), my father and step-mother as well. My father called me while I was in line to let me know that my siblings (the four who are voting age) have done so.
That’s my short, unmemorable experience.
Now, I’m going to sit back, get something to eat, pour a glass of my favorite soda and watch the coverage on MSNBC. There me be breaks in there for some Wii playing if I feel like it.
Voted this morning. The whole process, including walking to the High School polling place and back, took half an hour. Long line when I got there (It was just opening), and roughly the same line when I left.
I got to the polling place ten minutes early and there was already a line out the door and down the driveway of the electric department.
We had paper ballots. The lines went pretty quickly and I will be sporting my “I Voted” sticker all day.
Now it’s just a waiting game, and I’m sure it will be a long night.
One vote for Obama in Vermont. Though he’ll win here anyway.
I got to the polls at 0700 and had to wait for about an hour and a half. It was fun though. I have never had to wait so long to vote. This is going to be an exciting election!!
Texas voter here. I voted early. The guy next to me was having a conversation on his cell while making his picks and someone had to tell him to hang up. This is the same guy that you have all experienced at the opera, in recitals, attending funerals, who can’t seem to hang up.
I early voted. Walking back from the gym this morning, I’m glad I did. Lines are around the block at the three polling places that I passed.
Can’t vote. I’m Swedish. Sun Devil alumni. Met Barry Goldwater a few years before he died. My room-mate dated his step-dautghter. Very impressed. More with Barry than the step-daughter.
Vote! Just vote, even if the system is flawed.
Personal note. Hope you vote for the thoughtfull guy who listens to experience, science, and the power of knowledge.
I should’ve put “wisdom” in there somehow, but wisdom seems rare. I’ll take the three previously mentioned.
I can’t vote, as I’m Canadian, but I’m reading updates continually. We have nearly as much interest in your election as you do, especially as our politics often reflect yours. I’m convinced that the recent election in Canada was deliberately called in a hurry so that our Conservatives could get in before a potential democratic sweep in the USA started to affect Canadian perceptions, reducing their probability of retaining power.
I’m really hoping that the under-polling of cellphones and young voters, along with the upswing in early voting and increased voter registration counters any possible Bradley effect(even if there isn’t a good reason for one, I still fear it), and the tendency for he undecided white voters to break for McCain.
Please elect Obama, for everyone’s sake! Vote! I would if I could!
go! now! vote robot obama! http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/2319/robamabl1.gif
Early voting in NC was fine in the triangle area as far as i know. I waited maybe 5 minutes last Tuesday. Had a little snaffu with my registration so I am glad I early voted because they took care of it immediately (I mailed in to change our address within the same county, and for some reason my husband’s got processed while mine still showed our old address). We will be going over with other obama volunteers to the polling places with the longest lines bringing camp chairs, umbrellas if it keeps raining, and some refreshment to encourage people to stay in line. Here’s hoping!
Did the early voting thing in Kansas. Took about an hour, I was part of the after-work crowd. I thought the poll workers did a good job… they kept the line moving and were pleasant and upbeat. Everyone in line seemed more impressed by the size of the line rather than annoyed by it, but that could just be my pollyanna view of things.
Random observation: We had a choice between paper ballots and touch screens. It looked to me like younger voters favored the touch screens where older voters preferred the paper ballot.
Finished just about a 1/2 hour ago. The lines at my polling place were not nearly as bad as I expected them to be. When my partner and I got there, the line was out the door and around the block, but from the time the polls actually opened to the time he finished marking his ballot and got outside was only 45 minutes. I got done faster because my check-in line was shorter.
While we were waiting outside for the polls to open, three or four school buses drove by. The kids all waved at us and shouted out the window. I hope they keep up that excitement for the next 10-12 years until they’re old enough to vote themselves.
My wife and I waited in line for about 15 minutes. Her registration was messed up somehow (it was happening to a bunch of people, we’re in Cambridge, MA) but the poll workers were very on top of it. She got to vote with a real ballot, only missing the city/state rep votes (all of which were unopposed in our district as it turns out). So far it looked like a well oiled machine in there. Awesome to see a lot of people out there early even in super-blue MA.
Took care of that nearly two weeks ago, and quite glad I did.
For the first time in my life, I wish I were American today.
I voted this morning. The polling place was a little confusing at first, with three precincts being served. It took me a minute or two to figure out which line to stand in. Once I got in the correct line, everything was smooth, and I was out of there in 15 minutes or so.
Voted this morning in Austin, Texas. Arrived at the polls 15 minutes prior to opening to find a line of about 60 people. When the polls opened up the line moved fairly quickly.
The polling place was a Methodist church (yay, separation of church and state! Also, whenever I hear Methodist I inevitably think of Harvey Korman in Blazing Saddles: “aaaaaand METHODISTS!”) in my neighborhood, and it was nice to see numerous Obama signs scattered about the area, but I didn’t notice a single McCain sign. It’s possible there was one; I wasn’t canvassing for signs, but I didn’t see any.
The poll judges were polite, efficient, and Texas friendly, and line progressed pretty smoothly. I imagine many in my neighborhood voted early, so I’m not sure the turnout in physical numbers will ramp up.
Voting in Austin (I don’t know if it is statewide this way) is electronic. Oh, joy. The system was easy to use, but the tinfoil hat part of me worries about it from the standpoint of electronic manipulation. The advantage of the electronic screen ballot, though, is nice, large type clearly printed and highlighted which makes finding and identifying candidates, propositions, and districts easy. I’ve elected not to spend my day in tinfoil-hat mode. It’s exhausting. If I need to pick that fight up tomorrow, there’ll be plenty of outraged energy.
One vote for Obama in Texas, though in Texas, that may not mean as much.
I remain guardedly hopeful.
No kings,
Robert
I’ve been voting in the same place since I was first eligible 37 years ago and had the longest line ever. The polls opened at 6 am and when my husband and I arrived at 5:50, there were a couple of hundred people ahead of us. But the poll workers were friendly and efficient. Two men walked along the line outside with handheld computers to check names for people who weren’t certain they were registered properly.
It only took about 1 hour and 15 minutes while we drank coffee and read newspapers. Despite the long line, people were in a festive mood. We live in a blue city in Virginia, that hasn’t elected a democrat for president in more than 40 years.
I love to vote! This is a great country. The system may be a bit creaky but it mostly gets the job done and we have a peaceful transfer of power.
I got in line at 6:25, and was the third one there. By the time the place opened at 7, there were a hundred people in line. It was sweet.
Who I’m voting for.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/timtimes/3000019255/
Enjoy.
was told lines were long at my polling area in Manchester, CT, but was able to find parking and get right in @ 8:10 am
The polls in NYC opened at 6:00, and my husband and I headed out at 5:50. Got to the end of the line at 5:50, and I was amazed how long the line was already! It took us about an hour to get through the line. My husband’s name wasn’t in the list of registered voters (even though the internet clearly showed that he was registered), so he cast his affidavit ballot, and I went into the booth to do my thang. ‘Twas fun and liberating! But I’m still pretty hella tired right now.
A long line here in Iowa, longest I’ve ever been in, waited 30 minutes.
And thank you for the non-partisan message to get out and vote.
There’s no check-box for None Of The Above, so I’ll do like Obama – go outside and yell “present!” – then get back to my coffee.
At my polling place there were separate lines for those whose surnames begin with A-L and those beginning with M-Z. The line for A-L was out the door and down the sidewalk. There was no waiting for M-Z.
I’m not sure what to make of that: are the W’s, X’s, Y’s, and Z’s so used to standing at the back of the line that they just instinctively vote later in the day?
I voted early this morning in suburban Boston. Massachusetts is very blue. There was not a huge line. I was in and out pretty quickly.
Before I left to vote we got a call from our daughter in Philadelphia. Pennsylvania is a big battleground state, and she was very excited. She went to the polling place a half hour before it opened so she could be one of the first to vote. She felt like her vote really could make a difference this time, and she was voting for a candidate (Obama!) who she was really excited to be voting for. I told her about my first presidential election when I voted for Jimmy Carter. This was after eight years of Nixon and Ford.
I am looking forward to getting to bed early this time around. If the polls are right Obama should win big, and it will be evident fairly soon. We have a bottle of champagne ready.
Voted – it took 15 minutes, and there were 98 people who voted before me according to the ballot machine. Only hitch was a woman in front of me who did not have proper ID, which threw the septa and octa-genarians volunteers into chaos and the process to a grinding halt. Evidently, it was necessary for all the volunteers to abandon their assigned tasks and address the needs of one person vs. the needs of the many. Five minutes later everything was back to normal and running smoothly if not particularly briskly.
Choices.
I have never voted a straight ticket because… well, because there are doofuses and not-so-doofuses no matter what the party affiliation. This time I marked that single dot for the Dems in protest against the redness of this redneck state. I’m hoping for more of an overall purple-ish result when the polls close here.
Voted 2 weeks ago in Colorado and then got to wait in line for 6 hours with 50,000 people in Fort Collins (pop. 125,000) to see Obama speak. I’ve had goosebumps for a month.
To be fair. McCain brought in 3,500 in Denver…
I hate that my polling place is in an Assemblies of God church. I feel like all the fundies are just waiting for me to drive up with the liberal, tree-hugging, rainbow stickers on my car so they can waylay me and keep me from voting. It’s probably not a worry based in reality, but I can’t help it.
So I voted early at the library on Halloween. Yay early voting! I got there around four and only waited in line forty minutes or so. It wasn’t bad at all, considering the line had doubled in length by the time I left, thanks to folks getting off work and dropping by.
Joseph Heller never voted. What an idiot.
Erica Heller:
“The fact is, my father never voted for anyone. Ever. In any election. He never had and never would, and he had no problem telling this to anyone, relishing the inevitable shock and dismay, the irritation and rage he would foment. It was a childish and infuriating fact about him and one never, ever open for discussion. The truth was, he was proud of it…”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erica-heller/so-who-would-joseph-helle_b_139272.html
Is there any poll that you lot won’t try to crash? :)
Was there at 6:15, took me about 20 minutes to go through the line. It was pretty impressive.
Voted about two weeks ago. Oregon does all-mail balloting, so we got our voter pamphlet (more like a friggin’ book!), and then a week later (same day our mailbox got broken into, funny enough), we got our ballots. Fortunately, we got our ballots before the mailbox break-in.
We let them sit for a few days, and then one Saturday afternoon, I said, “I’m ready to vote.” So, my husband and I sat on the couch, and filled in our bubbles.
He put them in the mail the next Monday, and we celebrated at the performing of our civic duty.
Received my absentee ballot couple weeks ago. Filled it out, had my roo mate sign that he witnessed me fill it out, and then I mailed it back. No lines, didn’t have to leave my dorm. Absentee ballots are nice.
1 vote for Obama in western MI. Showed up 6:45 to the fire station; stood in a line that stretched through the parking lot almost up the street. Got through everything and back out at 7:45.
Good stuff Americans !
*sniffs away a tear*
Hoe exciting this is !
I have perhaps the easiest, most convenient voting experience in America. I live in Culver City, in West Los Angeles. Across the street from my home is a Pontiac dealership, and its in the showroom floor of this building that they set up a few voting stations. Today and for the past ten years, I walk across the street, give them my name, walk up to a station, vote, get my button and go home. It take three minutes. There is never, ever a line. It kind of frustrates me that so many people have to miss work and stand in line when I have to barely devote three minutes of my day.
Good luck, everyone, do the right thing and keep doing it for the next eight years… and I may even let my daughter become American : )
My experience in metro Boston was completely vanilla, except for the fact that I was uncharacteristically excited (despite some misgivings about Obama). I left the polling place with everything crossable crossed, thinking as I trudged to the bus stop about how 20 of the past 28 years of my life had been spent walking bowed, cranked and stomach-achey under the disgusting, anti-intellectual, anti-democratic, anti-rational shit-storm of Reagan, Bush I and Bush II.
Whatever misgivings I may have about Obama, it was refreshing to be able to cast my vote for someone who can at least speak the English language well, someone who doesn’t make me feel like I was accidentally born on the wrong freaking planet.
LETS WRECK THIS POLL!
Good luck, from Portugal
Majority of Europeans are looking at you, hoping the next day will be a new day for all of the world.
The world deserves a better USA. Americans deserve a better America.
I am deathly ill, fever, chills, running a snot marathon and my mouth tastes like a vulture’s crotch. I can barely stand. In a few hours I while have someone drop me off at the polls and I will stay in the line until I vote for Obama/Biden.
I hear the people sing and my desire to sing with them will trump my illness. No excuses. No more Bush. Government of, by, and for the people, the original Republican message and it took a Democrat to fulfill that vision.
Ciao all – JeffreyD
when i showed up there were only around 20 people in line. I called my friend who is in the same district and he said when he went, there were around 150 or so. apparently i had unknowingly cut in line, through a side door! great security there..oy!
I voted sometime last week at City Hall. Burlington, VT is a very small “city” so there was more a small crowd than a line.
One observation just from reading this thread: when I first started voting, way back in the early 90s, this kind of discussion wasn’t quite as easy, in terms of getting perspective from all over, as it was happening, and hearing people’s thoughts. Had to be done in person, over the phone, or through the mediated medium of television/radio reports.
It’s really cool to see people voting (especially voting!), and then uniting with others to reinforce the occasion. Thanks to the posters who’ve reported, whether voting today or having voted early. It’s nice to see the connection.
No kings,
Robert
I just got back from voting. I’d say it was routine and boring. I arrived as the polls opened at 7, and didn’t get out until 9:30. Two and a half hours. I should have brought my gameboy.
It definately didn’t take that long last time. This is encouraging.
Good on you,JeffreyD !
And get well soon mate !!
I wrote in “Paul Z. Myers”
Just a stupid question, why do you have such long lines in the USA, I’ve been voting for the last 26 years in France, never had to wait in line, never heard of such things… Maximum it ever took me was 5 minutes. Oh, but we don’t have voting machines, just old fashioned paper ballots, and probably a much higher density of voting stations ?
Oh, and we have an average turnout of 80% compared with 50% in the USA (both voluntary btw).
And how would you know what a vulture’s crotch tastes like, hmmm? (btw, I imagine it tastes like chicken)
I echo the sentiments of Walton @17 and Antonio @42. Good luck to all of you today.
I voted early.
negentropyeater at #50:
Show off!
In all seriousness, that’s a turnout to be proud of. The United States needs to get better in its turnout numbers.
Sadly, I think some of it in this country is due to complacency. I hope that’s not the case, but it may be. Some people (see the Joseph Heller post previously) may just not want to do it (and that wounds me about Heller; Catch 22 is such a great book, and it’s sad to hear he was ornery about voting just for the sake of being ornery).
But there are probably others on the site with better analysis and insight than I have on why turnout is lower in the United States.
In the meantime, bon chance! from here in the United States, to you and us as well.
No kings,
Robert
Good luck, America! I wish I could vote… so every clear thinking American will have to do it for me… if you are considering not voting, think about the number of people around the world who don’t get a vote in your election but would like one, and do it for them.
I voted early for Obama.
The process took 45 minutes (there was quite a line!) and the process was smooth and uneventful.
I am hoping the big turnout for early voting is an indication of a big turnout for today’s polling.
Oh I wish I could vote. If anyone’s on the fence (although not so likely with this group), throw in a vote for Obama for me… Canada’s counting on you!
Voted for Obama in Massachusetts (I know, not much drama in the presidential race up here in the northeast…) Took 20 minutes, since barely anyone was there :-(. Hopefully bigger turnout later on, after people get out of work.
2 1/2 hours this morning.
Absentee voted. Ballot in the (now purple?) state of Indiana.
No, in Dallas County many polling places use scantron sheets and sharpie pens. You just feed your ballot into a single scanning machine as you exit.
Almosthalf of the registered voters in Dallas and Tarrant (Ft. Worth) Counties voted early. So even heavy turnout today won’t be unbearable here in North Texas.
Routine and boring in Chicago exurbs. In and out in 15 minutes at 7 am. Though one idle poll worker said it was the first lull of the morning. Go BO!
I’m a rural Ohio resident, Morrow County, on the edge of Amish country. About 20 minutes from Mt.Vernon (John Freshwater territory) which is in the neighboring county. Moved from Columbus suburb in January 2008. Wife and I cast our votes for Obama at 7:30. The wait was about 35 minutes, 8 Diebold machines with paper trail, all working.
About 40 people in line, someone in line directly behind me said there was no waiting in 2006. I was the only brown person in line (I’m Asian-American, Pacific Islander). Voters were mostly in their 30’s and 40’s. A handful in early 20’s. Even split male-female. Did not see anyone over 60 other than poll workers.
Woman in front of us was not on the voter roll. She went off to the side with a precinct worker. They were still trying to resolve her problem when we left. Otherwise, everyone was in good spirits and no shenanigans.
Gut feeling: Probably leaning Obama now but I expect later voters to swing it to McCain. I hope I’m wrong.
Also I am pissed that someone stole my Obama yard sign last week! Bastards!
I’ll be going to my polling place as soon as I’m done with work. My Husband will do so once he’s out of school. I’m a little worried about the lines since it will be in the evening, but as long as I can vote I’ll be good.
I’m not sure why I spent two and a half hours in line, honestly. I’ll list all the things that may have been a factor (or a symptom).
I arrived as the polls opened.
The population in my county has boomed recently and they probably did not take that into consideration (I live a little bit northeast of Atlanta, Georgia). There were over 200 people standing in line in front of me when I arrived (someone got bored and counted).
There were only eight voting machines.
And, of course, the young and evangelical voters are showing up in large numbers.
I’d say that the number of voting machines was the most likely culprit. The other lines were moving smoothly, and that last line was holding everything up. How does it go so smoothly in France? What conditions do you have in your polling places? Mine just seemed like a case of poor preparation.
Terribly routine and boring!
After a 4 AM GOTV Lit Drop for the College Democrats here, I went to the polls as soon as they opened at 6 and the nice old lady found my name and all was well.
This after rumors that the Republican Election Commissioner had purged us college kids from the voter rolls. No such luck for her!
I voted early, last week. It’ll be interesting to see if McCain loses his home state. I did my part. :)
I only waited about 5 minutes – I think I was in the sweet spot between firsties and people on their way to work. Took my kid, bought some PTO bake sale goodies.
I’ll be picking up my 6-year-old son at lunchtime and voting then… he’s a huge Obama supporter. It’s pretty cute. Any time he sees a McCain sign he gets pretty irate.
Clarification of my comment above #62:
In my gut I think things will tip toward McCain in my precinct, not nationally.
I voted several weeks ago with a mail in. I like being able to sit down in front of the computer and look up the people you never hear much about. Like the people running for the school board and stuff.
I voted absentee, which means that I don’t get a sticker. Boooo….
While lets see my voting experience? I sat in my favorite living room chair weekend before last and read through the ballot measures. I knew which candidates I would vote for, but all the measures required some work. My feet were up and I had a nice refreshment. The whole process was about 15 minutes, but that included my research time on the two measures that actually needed some thought. Other measures (most) were sponsored a local wingnut dingbat here in Oregon so were easy to judge.
Voting in Oregon is very much a conveience process. recieve your ballot in the mail, mark it when you like (up til 8pm election day, of course), and drop it in a convenient county drop box – ours is at a near by store.
No lines at all in Morris, which isn’t surprising. I was the 110th voter in my precinct, and I voted fairly early, so expect a very large turnout.
Got to my voting place just before it opened, same as every year. While we’ve never (ever) had a line before, this time I spent over an hour and a half waiting.
Happy to do so, I love seeing the turn out, and the crowd was decidedly pro-Obama as well.
I voted before work. My wife was with me but she had to leave for work because of the line. She’ll vote this afternoon. I have the luxury of being somewhat flexible about my start time.
The line wasn’t too long. The workers told us that there were about 10 people already waiting when they opened up at 6 am.
I’m 28. Even though I’ve grown up in a blue part of the country I never thought I’d live to see an African-American have an actual chance to become president. Not a dumb longshot (Jessie Jackson) but someone who may get in. Call me a cynic, I just never thought it’d happen. Here’s hoping!
Voted…for Nader (Obama is going to win my state in his sleep, so it was pretty safe).
In my neighborhood polling places move when there’s a presidential election. I would have known that if I read the mailings or checked online instead of relying on habit. In any case despite going to the wrong place initially the correct place was close, uncrowded, and I was #159 in my polling place to vote. (It was in the county fairgrounds so there was some lingering stench from the last county fair.)
Only noteworthy thing is someone put up signs for the GOP senator too close to one of the polling places. I got to remove one of the signs and give it to the security guard. So not only did I help enforce the election laws, I got to legally remove a GOP campaign sign.
Also, this is in a contested (went red in 2004 and 2000, but by a VERY close margin in 2004) county in Ohio. If we had seen the turnout then that I did today, even this one county would have swung Ohio to Kerry in ’04.
I echo the French comment – we rarely have to wait. On the other hand, we don’t have presidential elections, and the biggie (a general election, where all MPs are elected in one go) can be called at any time – so in a general election we are usually only picking our MP.
I think (no doubt someone from the USA will correct this if I am wrong) but in the US the regular date for these elections means that they are also electing lots of other politicians at the same time – so it could take each voter longer to make thier choices.
Is that right?
I voted by mail a month ago (for the first time, Ohio this year had “no excuses needed” mail voting.) I love it. Until we get some asshole Republican Sec. of State who takes it away again, I’ll never go to the polling place again. Being an unsentimental guy I don’t miss the ritual aspect. And I LOVED being able to go online and research a race I’d forgotten about (state board of ed in this case- it took me all of 2 minutes to discover that the incumbent in my district had voted with Owens Fink and her Kreationist Klowns, and that the challenger appeared to be rational. I’d have had to leave that one blank if I’d voted by machine.)
Voted absentee from New Zealand a while ago. Which meant I had to wait for 30 seconds at the post office, a lot easier than voting at home.
E.V. at #60:
Thanks, good to know.
No kings,
Robert
30 min wait in PA (Phila Suburbs) at 9:30. Was about 3x that earlier when people were going to work.
We’re voting and the rest of the global community is holding their collective breath. After the Bush Regime’s wretched mismanagement (I’m talking to you too, Tony Blair), it’s time to do a 180. I understand the frustration every non-American must feel. We sneeze and the entire world catches cold; but then again we’ve all become so globally intertwined that any infection affects everyone eventually .
The election workers in my district in Mount Pleasant SC (charleston) were 100% un-prepared for the numbers that showed up. Lines everywhere, secondary lines once you checked in. Lines getting mixed up. Heated soccer moms with their kids screaming.
Mass chaos
Dogs and cats living together.
It was a minor nightmare, but they got it figured out.
Penny @#79- Yes, we do, and it could potentially take longer. But I downloaded a sample ballot days before, and researched and marked everything in advance. With my cheat sheet in hand, the actual time at the poll took less than 5 minutes, even though the wait in line was over an hour (only 4 polling stations where I voted).
Northern Virginia, 7 AM, no line at all. They handed me a card that said I was the 104th voter of the day. At this rate, we’ll have 100% turnout by 3:00 PM.
Over 100/hour and no waiting! I totally don’t miss living in Florida.
#49 “I wrote in “Paul Z. Myers”
For president? Thanks for wasting everyone’s time.
Coming from Atlanta, GA, Fulton County.
We got there early, at 6:30 am and were out by 8
The line got pretty long behind us, one of the bigger turnouts I’d seen(though I’ve only personally seen 2 presidential elections)
Over all a good experience, the poll workers kept things organized and moving, and people seemed happy and interested to be there.
Best comment yet from Fauxnews.
Comment by Buckeye
November 4th, 2008 at 10:09 am
“If you vote for Obama you must an imbicle”.
Switch on irony meter again.
Painless and fast (in and out in less than 10 minutes) in Sioux Falls, SD. I am a tiny spot of blue in a sea of red . . . and excited about watching the national numbers. Come on, Obama!
I sent my ballot in 3 weeks ago – another one of those absentee voters who misses out on the election day fun, too. But my vote in Florida will carry a lot more weight than it will where I’m living for the time being: Utah.
Voter turnout at last UK General Election was just over 60%. I suspect the next election should be higher as it should be close.
We don’t have queues on Polling Day. I guess we have more small polling stations.
If they count it
*cough cough
/scurries off ducking
DesertSon,
From the early voting numbers (30 million have already voted until now, compared with previous elections) it does look like this year is going to be well above average (ie well above 54% turnout).
The number to beat will be the Kennnedy 1960 election which was the highest turnout in the last 50 years with 63%.
Silver Spring, MD. Got in line at 8:00 am, was finished by 8:30 am. Had the latest episode of The Skeptics Guide to the Universe on my mp3 player, so the time flew by.
J. D.
British, so not voting – but my job involves monitoring the news all day so I am being a spider in the web for all my voting American pals! BBC 24 is loving this election. Interestingly the only two white people they have interviewed about it in-studio have been some weird Repubs, one of whom seemed to be trying to get as many, mostly false, criticisms in about Obama’s campaign as possible. There’s been a bit of interest from my colleagues too – how things work in elections over there, surprise that there are actually more than two candidates – so I am trying to do my part in the furtherence of knowledge! Making my first visit to the US at the end of this month too so I’m hoping Obama wins otherwise the friend I’m bunking in with will probably be out rioting in the streets and I’ll have nowhere to stay!
Billy C @ 27 – same experience. The line for A-F held the whole process up. My wife and I assumed that because we were here in a suburb of St. Paul (well, OK, it was Minneapolis) that it was because of all the people named Anderson.
Then we remembered all the Johnsons… …and yet that line was empty.
Overall it went well, with more responsible, prepared voters ready to make a statement.
Vote. Please. Thanks.
Robert:
It’s exciting that at least Austin will (probably) be pro Obama. It will be a tight race in Harris County (Houston) and Dallas & Tarrant Counties. But all these small cities little towns are so conservative that they’ll be overwhelming
McCainPalin.No matter what the total state outcome is, ya’ll just go ahead and party down for us all there in Austin, woohoo!
negentropyeater:
That is one of my hopes for today. Thanks for the update. I didn’t know the 1960 election numbers, and I have to confess, I would have expected that number to be higher, but that’s probably me romanticizing the past: “Ah, the good old days, when more people cared enough to get out and vote!”
No kings,
Robert
Penny @ 79: As an example, my ballot had president & vice president, US senator, US House of Representatives, my state representative, 2 different school referendums, one state constitutional amendment, school board, soil and water conservation supervisors, and about 25 judges including 2 state Supreme Court judges.
Penny @ #79
You are correct. Where I live in Massachusetts we had around 8 or so offices we were voting for. Our ballots also included 4 initiatives which each contain a long description of what the measure does and what voting yes or no would mean. If you don’t read up on it ahead of time it can take a while to understand what you are voting for. The initiatives on our ballot included repealing the state income tax, eliminating greyhound racing, and decriminalizing marijuana use.
I did early voting here in Colorado over a week ago (for Obama). I used a cheat sheet due to the number of issues on the ballot, and there was no line, so it only took a few minutes. There were paper ballots instead of machines, which took me by surprise.
I’ve had a previous experience here in Colorado where the voting machines went down on election day, so I had to wait in line for three hours. And the wait is expected to be hours long in many places here today. So I don’t feel like I’m “missing out” by having it done.
Good for you for working as an election judge, PZ.
A pleasant walk in beautiful Indian Summer weather to my daughter’s school at about 9am. Eight poll workers in the room, two voters, one of them me. Some confusion about which binder I was in (the district line runs down the middle of my street), but finally signed in and pulled the curtain on the old-fasioned mechanical-lever machine. Painless.
@50.
I’ve been wondering about that too… I’ve been voting in France and Switzerland (dual citizenship) and while the turnout in Switzerland is usually low, both are very efficient. Never had to wait in line to vote! Even one hour of waiting is insane, and I read reports about 6, 8, 10-hour waiting lines…
This is more a characteristics of third world countries and struggling democracies IMHO.
overwhelmingly
Voted an hour ago in lovely Lee’s Summit,Missouri. Went smoothly, voted for the thoughtful looking 1/2 Kansan, this is a good time to make an exception to that cross-border rivalry ;).
1:45 in Orangeburg,SC this morning. Good mood from everybody in the lines as we wrapped around buildings. Even with the heavy turnout, Obama probably still won’t win SC, but we have a chance to take a seat or two in Congress.
Voted early in AZ along with my fiancee.
I am going to be a nervous wreck all day.
Penny, #79
what do you mean we don’t have a presidential election in France ? Didn’t you vote ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_presidential_election,_2007
Robert your post made me homesick!
Voted in Dallas on Halloween with a limited ballot (registration glitch). Texas may not mean much, but it’s still worth trying. The limited ballot line was short but slow and it was interesting to talk to people who were from a wide variety of places and had found themselves voting in Dallas. It went very smoothly. I used a paper ballot, and I hope there are no complications because of my registration issues.
Aside:
There was a crazy woman behind me who began screaming indirectly towards a man in another line because he was chewing gum. I looked behind me. She was wearing a rainbow neon and sequin studded knits, and I realized that the first time I had seen her I had assumed she was wearing a costume. Not so at all. I wondered briefly how she was planning to vote, filled out my ballot, and went on with my day.
I live in Oklahoma where everyone around me is Republican. It sickens me. We use paper ballets and this morning all the people standing in line to turn their ballots in, that I could see, voted straight republican ticket option. I felt my face turning red at that. Completely involuntary response on my part and not unexpected for where I live either, but I still reacted that way. It was anger. I just can’t understand the attitude of my fellow Oklahomans. The majority here are just Dicks about their beliefs. The funny thing is a few people were finished voting and left the area of the church out the back door and were trapped in the playground with no way-out. They tried to get back in through the door they went out where the booths were. They were knocking really load on the doors. I turned to the election official lady who obviously was ignoring them and said “hey lady, they are knocking on the door out there, you going to do anything about it???” She replied” we aren’t allowed to let them in” Before I could react another gentleman went and let them in. I asked the lady if she was going to just let stay trapped out there all day. She had nothing to say about that. Asshats.
I’m surprised you people go to work on election day. Here in Argentina elections are generally held on Sunday, and if for whatever reason it has to be done on a weekday, the government declares holiday.
Just to annoy anyone having to queue, the story of my voting here (Sweden) in the last election: I took the four minute walk to my local polling place, where there were more voting officials than voters, spent about a minute getting the ballot in order, turned it in, and walked home again.
sjburnt, I wonder if we were at the same polling place or if that’s just a Twin Cities wide problem. I finished ten minutes before my partner because the A-F line was three times as long as the other three lines.
Voted in Howell, Michigan (as Red a town as you can get – half way between Ann Arbor & East Lansing.) Most city and county offices are unopposed Republicans. I did a write-in of my plumber for Drain Commissioner (incumbent is unopposed) who did some really good work for us and is a real character. Just what you are looking for in a Drain Commissioner.
Two interesting propositions – one about allowing people to grow medicinal marijuana (purely a spectator sport for me) and the other proposition providing reasonable guidelines for stem cell research (the Xtians are pretty torqued about that one! The prop is supported by the godless scientists at the elitist universities of Michigan & Michigan State.)
Took about 15 minutes from beginning to end.
Good luck to all you Americans on PZ’s blog, here.
I hope your guy wins, because he’s kinda our guy too!
Greetings from Belgium
Tom K.
I just voted in a small town in Illinois. Short line. Everything ran smoothly as usual. Illinois seems to have it together. Did I mention Obama is from Illinois?
And here in the UK, I stroll along about twenty yards to my polling booth, walk straight in, put my cross on the form and walk out again, giving my number to the three people outside (one from each party) to make sure that they don’t come and knock me up later that evening to persuade me to vote….!
If people had to queue to vote here in the UK, they’d turn round and go home and watch the telly instead.
Andrés @ 114
Some states declare election day a state holiday, but not all of them.
They would never make election day a Sunday nationwide though – a lot of Christians would have a problem with that.
It took me longer to walk to the polling station than it did to vote. Not very crowded. Perhaps I hit a lull.
An election day comic:
http://www.explosm.net/comics/1451/
Routine? Yes. Boring? Not really; I’m always a little excited when I vote. On top of that, it was very, very quick.
So, all in all, a little like sex… if sex were routine.
South Louisiana university student here. I just came back, and what a sad sight it was. There was no line in the out of the way corner of the Student Union that the machines were tucked away in, and three people older than McCain himself staffed the place.
That was one vote for Obama in what is supposed to be the ninth most conservative city in the nation.
Sven DiMilo at #105:
Priceless.
No kings,
Robert
No line, but we got there somewhat early (we were done by 9:00). No ID required or even asked for. Paper ballots, read by a machine. No changes from previous elections, and we’ve been going there since 2004 or so.
This after being warned repeatedly that there would be long lines and that we really should vote early or we would Be Very Sorry. Our one experience with early voting in this area (2004) involved a long line and touchscreen machines managed by laptops running Windows XP, some of which kept crashing, while our experience with the official polling station has generally been as described above (though there have occasionally been 5-10 minute lines). We have been assured that the early voting issues have been fixed — but we still were hearing reports of lines.
I think we win.
We voted for the black guy with the weird name, the slightly less hateful myth-believer running against the Helms legacy atheist-hater, and a bunch of people with “DEMOCRAT” written under their names (except one “LIBERTARIAN” guy running for governor, mainly as a protest vote against immigrant-phobia).
I voted last Friday in what is normally a very sedate (and *very* red) part of suburban Atlanta. This time, however, Georgia has suddenly and quite unexpectedly actually become competitive for the Democrats.
My wait in line was about 3 and a half hours (at 1:30 in the afternoon on a Friday – go figure). I talked to a lot of people in line and the mood was upbeat – hopeful even. Don’t get me wrong – I heard some horror stories. It seemed like everyone I talked to had a tale to tell about how badly they, or their family, or their friends were getting beaten up by the economic meltdown. In spite of it all though, the people I talked to believed that this election was *different*; that this time, maybe for the first time in their voting life, they had not only the opportunity, but a duty to help change the direction of the country.
Inside the polling place, it was a well-oiled machine. I cannot commend the poll workers of Cobb County highly enough for their courtesy, good-humor and incredible efficiency.
So, after a long wait – one more Georgia vote for Obama, and an experience I’m really pleased to have been a part of.
The impression I get I that there is a mood in America today rather like the one we had on 1st May 1997 when we finally kicked the Tories out of office and replaced them with Labour.
I just hope for you sakes that Obama does not turn out to be as bad as Blair.
My county is all mail-in, so I got to vote in the comfort of my own home a week or so ago. Also, thanks to the college’s effort to try to get everyone to vote, I got a free stamp, and still got my “I voted” sticker! Awesome!
E.V.:
Will do. Here’s to it!
No kings,
Robert
Pretty laid back here in the Minnetonka (Minneapolis suburb). Awfully nice day out for November, to be sure.
The elections judges seemed to be pleasantly surprised by the number of new, unregistered voters (myself included, used to live in a different county). Took about 35-40 minutes from parking to walking out.
I think what was really taking so long was the massive number of judges up for re-election. I had finals in college that were shorter than this thing.
I was No 260 for my precinct (about 8:35 this morning).
And now work, boo work.
Easy voting in Iowa!
I voted for Obama
I waited in line for an hour and a half in a Detroit public high school. While waiting in line, I saw many parents holding their children’s hands, overheard several black women doing excellent Sarah Palin impressions and generally had a fine time. Spirits were high, grumbling was low. There was a lot of discussion about voting rights, with voters educating one another.
It was unusual, because prior to this I have voted only in suburban precincts, where there was little to no discussion in the lines – and what talking there was did not ever touch on which candidates were getting our votes.
I live in a backwater, podunk little town in upstate NY, and this is the first time I’ve EVER had to wait in line to vote since I moved here from Boston. It was only 10 minutes or so, but still, there are only 800 registered voters or so in my district, and I was number 122 at 7:00 AM. I’ve never been prouder. I think we’re going to see record smashing turnouts, and that can only be a good thing for America.
In the words of Morgan Freeman at the end of “Shawshank Redemption”… “I hope”.
And if you delete your cookies, you can vote again!
(Four people in line before me at 9:30 this morning; no problems.)
Barklikeadog, # 113:
Isn’t there a secret ballot in the US?
I’m taking half a day off. :-) My employer is also giving out free flu shots today. I was going to mow my lawn as well, but it’s actually raining here in Southern California. Must be them globally warmings. Or November. One of the two.
I’m voting for the *only* rational candidate: Dave Barry
And if you delete your cookies, you can vote again!
Blake Stacey wins the vote. :)
I ate my cookies – they were from the bake sale, and very tasty.
I voted early. I wish I hadn’t.
I wish I *had*. The registrar office that had early voting for all of Los Angeles County is only 15-20 minutes from my house.
@#94
You’re right about that, Rev.
You can rest assured that the possibility has crossed my mind – especially in the county where my “official” residence is located (home of those hardcore Repugs who run stock car racing).
2009-12 is going to be very different from 1997-00 !
I just hope for you sakes that Obama does not turn out to be as bad as Blair.
Don’t worry. He probably will.
Addendum to my comment (#126): We’re in Durham, NC — blue area of a red state (soon to change?), home of Duke University and near the Research Triangle. Our street is full of Obama signs, with one lone McCain/Palin… but my own retired college-prof paterfamilias (same town) is apparently voting for McCain — unless my relentless emailing of links, videos, counter-arguments, etc. actually made a difference and he just hasn’t bothered to mention.
Seems from the majority of accounts that the voting’s going pretty swell for all of you folks.
For some reason, FauxNews disagrees and says it’s a living hell! “Voters descending on polling stations this Election Day are reporting long waits, mistakes, and missing ballots.”
I did a write-in of my plumber for Drain Commissioner (incumbent is unopposed) who did some really good work for us and is a real character. Just what you are looking for in a Drain Commissioner.
I do find it bizarre that most American localities have so many different elected offices, some of which have little or no actual policymaking role. Not only do you elect executive and legislative officers at the federal, state, county and municipal level, many counties also seem to have an elected sheriff, elected coroner, elected prosecutor, elected county clerk, elected recorder of deeds, elected judges, elected tax assessors and elected treasurer, not to mention state-level elected insurance commissioners, superintendents of public instruction, soil commissioners, etc. It begs the question of how an ordinary person is supposed to find the time to read up on every candidate for every petty office, or, even if they do, how an ordinary voter is qualified to judge the quality of different candidates for, say, coroner.
I’d be interested to hear Americans’ views on whether this works well, compared to other countries where there are far fewer elected officials.
I live on the south side of Chicago. Lines for early voting were measured in hours. A friend and I decided to wait to have the “full experience” of voting on election day. We brought coffee (her) and tea (me) and chocolate, and planned on just talking and catching up on things while we waited.
No line. I am not kidding. We walked right up to get our ballots. It was no different than any other election day.
Kind of deflating. Still, I’m glad we were traditionalists and voted on the day.
negentropyeater #79
Sorry – should have made it clearer – I’m in the UK.
Wow, I was going to gripe about my 25 minute wait, but I guess others have it much worse, so I’ll shut up about that.
I wouldn’t have minded waiting longer, though; it’s a really nice day here in Minneapolis. We’re supposed to get a high of 71F today. This is also probably the last “nice day” we’re going to have this year, but what a day, neh?
I can tell that the voter turnout is really heavy, because a 25 minute wait is unprecedented at my polling station. In years past, I’ve had to wait 5 minutes, tops.
That’s part of it. Also, there usually isn’t much of a line, it’s just that this year there’s a much higher turnout than usual. There actually was hardly any line for me. There were just two people ahead of me when I got to the poll. But, yeah, we often have fairly long ballots, especially if there’s a lot of ballot questions and the like.
One of the local news stations did a little unofficial polling last week at the NASCAR track. Guess who won by a wide margin? I’m sure the majority of them, like Palin, also think cavemen rode dinosaurs.
then got to wait in line for 6 hours… to see Obama speak. I’ve had goosebumps for a month.
Seriously, I’m the *only* one who finds this odd or creepy? Goosebumps for a politician?
I dunno… I have *got* to be some sort of changeling or half alien or something. I just don’t get it.
I voted early, representing my home state of Minnesota.
I usually just leave those questions blank, actually. How the heck should I know who would make a good judge?
As I pulled up to my precinct to vote, Stephanie Miller had a call from Al Franken. Then, I went inside and voted for Al Franken and the Obama/Biden ticket. It only took five minutes as things are usually smooth where I vote. Now I have the agony of waiting. I hope Obama wins as I dread the thought of McSame/Failing winning.
I’m not voting. (Yes I’m a U.S. citizen.) I refuse to choose between a douche and a turd sandwich. Nor do I agree that it’s my civic “duty” to cast a secret ballot in support of an illegitimate government. As the great Lysander Spooner wrote:
Good luck cousins.
I’m not voting. (Yes I’m a U.S. citizen.) I refuse to choose between a douche and a turd sandwich. Nor do I agree that it’s my civic “duty” to cast a secret ballot in support of an illegitimate government.
Bob Barr? Is that that you?
About an hour and 15 minutes from 8-9ish this morning in Arlington, Va, but otherwise smooth sailing. I probably went at the very worst time, though; after I voted, I noticed the line was down to about 1/3 the length it had been when I had first joined it.
I do wish that Election Day was a national holiday. It would be easier for us all to vote and volunteer. And I won’t be able to concentrate on work all day anyway.
Voted this morning and everything went smoothly. Paper ballot, 30 minute wait, Obama volunteers with coffee and snacks for those waiting in line.
Let’s hope the Republicans don’t steal this one, and that the Christian mob doesn’t give it to McSame.
*crossing fingers*
I took the Grouchy Old Bastard & I’s (?) ballots to the county courthouse days ago. No lines, quite peaceful.
If Obama looses you can all blame me. Really.
I have never voted for a winning candidate – ever.
Commentors on local radio think the election will be stolen by the re-pugs.
I had to get up at 6 AM to babysit my Uncle (with Down’s Syndrome) while my grandmother hurried to woman the polling booths. But I brought him up there a couple of hours later.
Also voted to Legalize Alcohol in my county, so here’s to hoping that goes through.
From MI: the Mrs and I voted around 9:00am to avoid the morning rush- not much of a line, I was the 244th voter to use the ballot machine. One thing that was very good to see: two precints vote in the same building, and the precinct that is dominated by college students had more people voting than I have every seen. I voted a straight Democratic ticket, Yes for the Medical Ganga proposal, and Yes for the Increased Stem Cell Research proposal.
There’s a nice bottle of MI fizzy wine chillin’ in the fridge for an Obama victory celebration tonight! Blanc de Blanc by L Mawby, very lovely, I recommend it to all.
Remember, an Obama victory is just the beginning. We gots to keep fightin’ for Truth, Justice, and the American Way, just like Superman wants us to.
BluesBassist
That’s your right. But in doing so you forfeit the right bitch about either of them for the next 4 years. Agreed?
I do wish that Election Day was a national holiday.
I always figured holding the election over a three day weekend might work. The fair success of the early voting shows it doesn’t have to happen in one day.
Please vote! Unless of course you’re a Rethuglican, in which case please decide you can’t be bothered. It’s not just your civic duty, important as that is – this is one election that’s vital for all humanity, indeed for all Earthlifekind! The world has not so needed the USA to do the right thing since WWII. We don’t just need a win for Obama – the Rethuglicans must be defeated resoundingly, comprehensively, overwhelmingly, humiliatingly, crushingly. Send the neocons scuttling back under the slime-covered stones from beneath which they emerged! Return Bible Spice to Alaska with an “Faulty Product – Reject” sticker on her forehead! Let McSenile disappear into the footnotes of history!
WARNING: ALARMING 4-WORD PHRASE APPROACHING!!!
A Trevor P. Hirst writes to Private Eye noting that “Vice President Sarah Palin” (I did warn you!) is an anagram of “Is perhaps devil incarnate”. Could God possibly give a clearer message than that, without actually existing? Huh? Huh?
I won’t say you’re stupid, I’ll just say that the wheel’s still turning but the hamster’s dead.
Oh, please. Not this canard again.
Until then, tell us about your voting experiences — may they all be routine and boring.
A week ago I sat down at my kitchen table and I filled out my ballot. I put it into the ballot envelope, signed the envelope, put stamps on it, and put it into the mailbox which is 5 feet from my front door where I live in a Florida condo. No lines. No waiting. No traveling. I could take my time and use google to research the candidates while I was voting.
Everyone knows Obama will win, which I think is why the stock market is going up today, up about 3% right now.
I wish all bizarro citizens like bluesbassist did the exact same thing.
Misanthropes deserve exactly put into the process.
That’s your right. But in doing so you forfeit the right bitch about either of them for the next 4 years. Agreed?
I strongly disagree with that, and not just because of its huge, gigantic, massive cliche-osity.
If the guy dislikes all the candidates that much, it’s his right to abstain, and that should never interfere with his subsequent right to comment on things.
To follow up what Nick Gotts has said, should things really go tits up and somehow Obama looses, DON’T PANIC!
We will come and get you!
My wife and I filled out our ballots at the kitchen table over 2 weeks ago. I pretty much voted the anti-incumbent ticket.
I love living in Oregon. There are no polling places to visit, no long lines, just fill out your ballot and mail it back in. If you waited till today to fill it out, though, you probably had a little bit of a line to drop it off, but those move quick.
Oh, you have to _go_ somewhere to cast your ballot?
I got mine mailed to me. Thanks, Washington State!
Voted in Pennsylvania. Lines weren’t too bad. I only waited 45 minutes. This was my first vote, so I’m really excited and proud of myself.
Misanthropes deserve exactly put into the process.
I’m sorry, what?
I voted by absentee about a month back. Seriously easy to do, just fill it out and mail it back in the 3 (THREE!) envelopes provided.
I’m disappointed to say that I’m the only one among my American friends who bothered to vote from here. Even after i explained to them how easy it was they weren’t up to the task. :(
BluesBassist@155,
Lysander Spooner was evidently an idiot. The point of the secret ballot is to ensure voters cannot sell their votes to the highest bidder. Still, given that you’re quoting him with approval, you probably think everyone should have the right to do so.
I just got back. I picked an opportune time: my mom warned of 34 people in the line in front of her when she went to vote earlier. There were 2 people in front of me when I got there.
The old ladies running the thing are so crabby, though. Sheesh.
But since how long? I’m hungry and a dead hamster sounds delicious.
…Rethuglican…Rethugs…
May main hope for an Obama win is at least a year without childish shit like this. I hate the GOP now more than most as one who was driven away years ago. It’s like how ex-smokers are the most virulently antismoking. But, enough already.
I sympathize with both Quiet Desperation and Bluesbassist (though I have a few quibbles with the latter). Compared to European elections with proportional representation (party list or otherwise), the American electoral system is far less democratic. So it is kinda amusing to see some patriotic types puffing their collective chests over this election (though not so much here), almost as if this is the only country where politicians are elected.
This thread has been nearly as much fun to read as some of the expelled ones. thanks all.
—–
That’s your right. But in doing so you forfeit the right bitch about either of them for the next 4 years. Agreed?
Oh, please. Not this canard again.
Actually, I’m pretty sure this is in the constitution. Same place as the part where they say that they have no idea which branch the VP should be in.
100% right. It gives him the right to comment that both candidates were rotten. That he didn’t have a decent choice.
Course I disagree with his thing against secret ballots… It’s my own business, not my neighbor’s. Plus… Remove secret ballots and you’re open to intimidation. There’s scum in the world, gotta deal with that.
Well if the wheel’s still turning it ought to be fairly fresh, so tuck in! Hmm, anyone got any good hamster recipes?
@Walton #145
I guess I don’t think it is that unusual to vote for all offices, petty or not. We’ve always done it. It does take a little work to make an informed decision and I am not always successful. I’m sure that the office of Drain Commissioner has launched some political careers. Objectively, I don’t know if voters know better or politicos making appointments do. However, political appointments do not generally sit well with me. Elections, for even the most diminutive positions, does provide a certain amount accountability, which, I think, is a good thing.
Yup… as I said, QD… it’s his right. So let me re-phrase what I said. I heard nothing but complaints and bitching in his original posts, and claims of an “illiegitmate government”, but not a fucking thing about a better alternative. So he can abstain all he wants, and remove himself from the process completely, if he so choses. It is absolutely his right. And I will amend what I said earlier… he can bitch about it all he wants, and about the candidates… but unless he’s got some idea of how to improve upon it, or decides to run himself and be part of the process to change what he doesn’t like about it, I don’t want to hear about it. So I will choose to simply ignore him. As is my right.
But thanks for the civics lesson, as always, QD…
My voting experience was a little worrisome. I had registered and voted in the primaries, but when I went in to vote this morning, I wasn’t registered anymore. What’s more, I overheard several others complaining about being in the same situation. Hopefully it’s an isolated incident and not some conspiracy to purge voter rolls of people who voted Obama in the primary.
Luckily I had brought a copy of my lease, SSN, and utility bills, just in case. :/ 20 minutes later I was registered and voted. I’m a little upset that I didn’t get an “I voted” sticker though.
I wish my experience had been boring. Paranoid that I am, I’m worried my vote went through!
I’ve been in Iraq since last December, and early last month I finally (FINALLY!) after ten months got to go on leave. Since I knew I’d be returning to Iraq right around the election (this past Sunday night, turns out), I knew I needed to fill out an absentee before I left.
So I go to my S-1 (the paper pushers) and get a generic form. The only actual spaces marked were “President/Vice-President,” “Senator” and “Representative” and it was a fill in the blank, no bubbles or anything. Then there was a bunch of blank lines for local elections, measures, propositions, what have you.
So I filled out everything (I take democracy seriously), down to all the state propositions and county measures and everything. Then I put it in the envelope, sealed it, marked it as told, and turned it in.
But I didn’t get to feed the paper into the machine or get the stub off it or get the I Voted sticker, the nice bonuses that come with voting at the polling place.
And like I said, I’m paranoid, so I’m worried that even though it’s been over a month, something happened to my ballot and my vote never went through. Not that Obama will lose California if it wasn’t counted…
But this will be the first time the guy I voted for won (after Nader and Kerry previously). I just wish I had assurance I ACTUALLY DID vote for him.
*
PS: once I got back from leave I got all my absentee materials. Useless now…
My wife, daughter, and I voted on Saturday. It was about a twenty minute wait. Don’t know what the polls were like this morning. BTW this was my daughter’s first time to vote. She turned 18 last week.
I was the only one in line at Shoreview City Hall last monday. Dull. Boring.
I sympathize with both Quiet Desperation and Bluesbassist (though I have a few quibbles with the latter).
Hey, hey, hey! I’m *voting*, sport. I just can’t get myself to be enthused, much less raise a single goosebump, over any of these people anymore. I’m voting Obama, but under protest. I’m one of the few skeptics here that applies his skepticism to politics as well.
the American electoral system is far less democratic.
I’d be happy just to see the rise of a good third party with a moderate or centrist attitude.
I voted around 10 AM here in New Jersey. Lots of cars parked in the school parking lot (there are about 10 districts who cast ballots here), and there were no lines I could see.
I was between an older man voting and a hispanic-looking older gentleman who told me this was his first time voting in Ocean County, NJ where I live. He had moved from somewhere out west (I don’t recall which city or state). I said, “Well, Welcome to Ocean County!” and he kind of blushed.
For me, voting took maybe five minutes, tops. I voted a straight democratic ticket and said yes to one proposition and no to another. It took longer to ask how to get an absentee ballot for my mom (who is bedridden and can’t walk) for next year than it did to actually vote.
Vote was by machine, the electronic ones with the light-up X’s, which have been standard since I started voting here 9 years ago. For verification, they asked my address, and had me sign the register, and that was it for me. All in all, a very quick, pleasant experience, especially compared to some of the comments I’ve read.
Voted, then hung around to beat up and intimidate McCain supporters.
Nah, I’m a Canadian really, I didn’t vote.
But thanks for the civics lesson, as always, QD…
I’m not a big fan of Hondas, actually.
That’s the right attitude, QD… As shiny as they can be, a politician stays a politician and you can NEVER trust them. Never ever ever.
So, what you call a bluesbassist in a suit?
The defendant. :-)
Got there at 7:00, waited an hour. The line had an elevator in the middle, so everyone got their turn spending 10 minutes in it with about 10 others while the line moved enough to unload. Weird.
The scanner was not working, so they collected the ballots in a box under the machine. Kind of unsettling. Also, this prevented voters from correcting improper ballots that would have been caught by the machine and spit out on the spot.
Done!
BluesBassist at #155:
The ballot I had this morning had an option to write in a candidate (for the Presidency, at least). Granted, that candidate has a higher hill to climb in order to win, but it seems to allow the opportunity to voice opinion for someone other than the “douche” and the “turd sandwich.”
I don’t know how to help with this one. I’d have to have a better understanding of what makes it illegitimate.
No kings,
Robert
Oh… and that’s three for Obama here in Arkansas.
QuietDesperation Re: BluesBassist
Sure he can abstain. What he cant do is not show up. If he doesnt like either of the major candidates, he can vote for the Working Families Party or the “Boss for President” candidate (Can you guess who that is?) or any of the other small parties without a hope of winning. He can write in his own name, or “None of the Above”. If he really thinks the election is a fraud, he can show up, sign his registration card and then state, “I refuse to participate in this flawed election process” and walk out. But if he cant be bothered to show up and make a statement, any statement, at the one time that society is asking for his opinion, why should we give a southern fried rats ass what he has to say any other time?
By the time I got around to registering to vote, I was no longer able to. I waited until Oct. 14th to look up info on it, to find that in my state, you have to register 30 days before.
@131 – Yup, it is amazing that the coroner and the dog-catcher appear on the ballot. I wonder why they still appear. How much difference is there between the Republican and Democratic view of cutting someone open or hunting down a dog?
But some of the little offices have a pretty big impact on daily life too. The Repub Attorney Gen in Indiana put in place a do not call list, then defended it against the feds, and actually vigorously used it to smack down the offenders. He got my vote last time around (not running this time.)
And given the state of science education in this country – the State superintendent can have a impact on curriculum, either directly or indirectly.
The only thing I can think of it is to avoid the political cronyism. If the dog catcher is elected, it can’t be appointed by the mayor as a favor later.
James
Ok… yeah… this was hastily said and I do actually understand what’s wrong with the statement. It still gets under my skin, personally, to bitch about a process and think that simply abstaining from that process is a means to fixing it.
And perhaps I assume too much, and BluesBassist has wonderful ideas on better solutions for our electoral process… I just didn’t see them mentioned in that post, and reacted hastily.
Ugh. I need more coffee.
QD (#191)I voted too, btw (though for Nader in an overwhelmingly Obama area); I meant I sympathized with your general attitude about this election (even though–or maybe especially because– I am probably to your left politically). I would really like to see a social democratic party that is also very strong on civil liberties.
Hal @185
UKian here. I see your point about elected officials versus politician appointed ones, but it’s always seemed odd to me that you lot vote for the local dog catcher or what ever, then allow the executive cabinet to be made up of non elected officials. Surely that’s all a bit back to front?
I found this on Pundit Kitchen: “Rednecks for Obama.”
Vote in good health, everyone!
Civic duty?
My civic duty is to not force leaders onto others, and ask them to afford me the same courtesy.
Dont Vote!
@201
Let me ask you a simple question: if the person you vote for wins, do you still get to complain?
Phillip P at #188:
Thanks for serving. Keep your head down, come home soon.
No kings,
Robert
I voted last week.
We had two, first-time voters in our group. One of the volunteers called it out and everyone broke into applause. The young lady turned about eight shades of red, which, of course, brought on more huzzahs and applause. They received special stickers and hugs from all the election volunteers.
The older lady working our table actually teared up and said “It’s so nice to see young people voting again.”
Sometimes, it’s nice to celebrate the small things.
you guys have to go over to fox news and read the comments on the “who will win” poll.
Never was there a more wreached hive of scum and villany.
Pretty much sums up the paranoid, racist, ignorant, bigotted, disgusting rethuglicans. Its as if every white supremicst and KKK member just figured out how to go online.
Fortunately, I live in a state (Hawaii) that allows early voting and it could not have been easier and less hassle-free. The whole process took about 15 minutes, there was practically no line, and the polling staff was extremely informative and friendly. In fact, I even had a long conversation on non-human perspiration in certain animals with one of the volunteers. One other benefit of early voting, besides the relief of not having to pay any more attention to the mind-numbing two year campaigns is the well placed apathy post voting apathy. It’s great to feel disassociated to some degree.
tsg – Of course. Why wouldnt you?
@Qedpro: I have read some comments on foxnews before, and I’m not sure I wanna repeat the experience. I Was reading up the comments on that psycho bitch with the B on her face… My god. It was crazy. What is wrong with these people?
When it turned out she was a liar (like everyone with half a brain guessed off the start), they blamed all her lies on DEMOCRATS or PRAISED HER for trying to show the world that Obama’s supporters are scum.
Unbelievable.
Turnout was great! The polling place was a little weird – 4 precincts, each with there own line out the door – some people told me they went through the line only to figure out that they were in the wrong one and had to do it again. It seemed like the poll workers were noticing it and put a person outside to make sure everyone knew what they were doing.
Another vote for Barack here in California (goin’ blue, of course), and a vote against discrimination!
Then how do you justify telling someone they can’t complain about the guy they didn’t vote for?
Not sure about you, but in my country we can express our displeasure.
The Canada Elections Act was amended to include
” (e) the following provision shall be set out after the name of the candidate that last appears on that paper:
“I DECLINE TO VOTE FOR ANY OF THE ABOVE CANDIDATES” ”
So that there is a legal way of expressing your sentiments.
tsg, those who don’t participate should keep quiet as to the choices. Those who do vote, no matter who they voted for, can complain as loud as they want. Sometimes the lesser weasel is still a weasel.
#155, please vote, THEY want you to stay home. When non-voters show up, it can make life less predictable for the dark disciples of Lee Atwater, and what’s wrong with that?
Just got back from voting in SF, CA. There are a number of local things and CA specific stuff I feel are really important — and almost no matter how that stuff goes, I’m really happy to see Obama take the presidency. Good times.
——-
Also, i’m doing my best to stomach Fox News as they whinge.
Patricia @ 160:
I took the Grouchy Old Bastard’s & my ballots to the county courthouse…
(since you asked!)
Therein lies the rub. So many Americans cling to party affiliation -Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Green Party- so that many who are elected owe a great deal to ignorance and blanket ideology. There is a reason Ken Ham is so successful here, Americans tend to be overly sentimental and credulous when it comes to patriotism, patriarchy and religion. Flags go hand and hand with churches and homilies starting with “my Daddy…” or “my Grandaddy…”. Oh we love our matriarchy too, we’re just not sure we want a woman to be at the top in politics since they tend to be a little emasculating (Barbara Jordan, Anne Richards, Geraldine Ferraro, Hillary…). Perhaps Palin’s tomboy with a Playboy Bunny’s figure accounts for much of her success. She can gut a moose and still look great in a bikini! WIn/win for Bubbas!
A few Libertarians will be elected here and there in mildly contested races. But the bulk of the spoils go to those who became members of the Republican and Democratic parties, though each party is a mixed bag. I’ve wondered if moderate (they never use the term liberal) Republicans and conservative to moderate Democrats would break off from their respective parties and form a more centrist party, but the reality is that the extremes of each party supply the energy to propel or repel voters – many times we are voting against something rather than for it.
The term socialist became such a perjorative after the McCarthy era, that no party would use that term , much less communist as a descriptor paired with any party, such as The Democratic Socialist Party as they do with much of Europe’s multiparty systems.
Are incompetent people going to be elected or more importantly re-elected because the voters remained ignorant? As one infamously incompetent person on the ballots would say, “By golly, You betcha!”
Why?
My thoughts exactly.
I didn’t vote today – voted three weeks ago, though! We have no-excuses mail-in ballots here in CO, and I voted/dropped mine off as soon as I was able. Hubs voted at early voting last week, so that’s 2 for Obama. If our almost-7-year-old could vote, it would be 3.
My experience was quite pleasant; sitting at the kitchen table, coffee cup in hand, is a voting WIN. Hubs’ experience was pretty good too – no lines at all, the whole thing took about 30 min. from the time he left the house until he got back.
@balhamblah #206
Agreed. It is upside down. No argument. I think we had an Arabian horse expert appointed the director of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (one of the more obvious gaffs of an incompetent administration.) Political patronage at the highest levels is ingrained in the American system of government. I guess it can be ultimately good (my history may be wrong, but wasn’t Abraham Lincoln appointed postmaster or something?) or really bad. Guess it depends on who is doing the appointing and whom they are appointing and why. I guess we vote for whomever we can when we are allowed to. As UKian’s often say, “There it is.”
Haven’t stepped on American soil or voted in an American election in about 20 years, but this time I got off my ex-pat arse and via the clear, helpful instructions at Obama’s site, got registered, promptly received my ballot from Oregon, and mailed it in about a month ago.
tsg – I dont try to justify that, because that not what Im telling anyone. Im saying that if you dont bother to make a statement, any statement at all, at the one time society actually asks for your opinion, theres no reason we should care about your opinion the other 364 days of the year. He can show up, sign his registration card, sing a few bars of Alice’s Restaurant and leave, that would be a statement, if a rather obscure one. I dont care. As I said, he can abstain, but abstaining is different from not showing up at all.
For those states that allow early voting, and especially for those who allow mail-in early voting, I don’t understand people who will stand in line for 5 hours to get a stupid little sticker when you could have voted weeks ago from the comfort of your home, like I did, and got your ballot in.
Makes no sense to me.
I was tempted to vote early (On Sunday- right after the Obama rally in Columbus), but FIVE HOUR LINES!. This morning it took from 7:15 to 8:30
#226
As a “UKian” – can I just say that I much prefer the term “Brit”?
Just saying…
I was going to invite the Canadians and other non-eligibles like myself to Pharyngulate this poll, but it’s already at 74.4% for Obama/Biden, 14.6% McCain/Palin, and 11.0% undecideds.
Go liberal Edmonton. Wait a minute, then why then hell couldn’t you do better than one measly NDP seat in a sea of blue back in October?
How is it different?
I wrote a long blog post about my problems voting. I don’t trust the touch machines at all. I trust the optical scan system only slightly more, so I used the paper ballot. That was a problem for the ancient woman running voter check-in. Here is a link to the complete post.
http://pegthegeekmeter.blogspot.com/
@ 162
Another voter in MI here. Voted yes for the marijuana and the stem cell research. Been pulling for Obama since January. I also have a bottle of L. Mawby waiting for me. Great stuff!
I voted straight down the democratic ticket. love doing that. waited about 20 minutes, vote casted around 9am.
My son cast the vote for Obama when he went into the booth with his mom. He said “I want to vote for the brown guy.”
Never thought I’d get to hear that in my lifetime. I really hope we make history today.
Painless half-hour line at 11 AM in northern Mecklenburg County, NC. Our county will certainly be blue (as in 2004), but can we dare to be hopeful that the whole state will turn blue this time?
Lines were short (1-2 voters) at both of the polling locations I went to. (I went to the right location first. A poll worker misread my address and confused me about where I was supposed to vote. So I detoured to the wrong location and then back to the right location before voting. Poll worker offered heart-felt apologies.) Poll workers seemed to think a lot of people had voted early. Paper ballots were available in large stacks. However there was only one booth for paper ballots. 4 booths for virtual ballots.
it is amazing that the coroner and the dog-catcher appear on the ballot. I wonder why they still appear. How much difference is there between the Republican and Democratic view of cutting someone open or hunting down a dog? – James
Votes for these minor offices are something I like about the US system, on the whole – but do people vote along party lines for them? However ardent my political preferences, I think I’d vote for the dog catcher who looked likely to be best at catching dogs! Or maybe dogs should get to vote on this one? Let them sniff something belonging to each candidate, and measure the wagging speeds!
It depends on the locality, but in some places, the “coroner” is just a guy who comes along to kick the corpse and make sure it’s dead; an elected official, he does not necessarily have medical experience or qualifications, and he leaves the actual cut-up work to a medical examiner who does.
I voted early in Texas a little over 2 weeks ago. Was fairly uneventful, except for being sweetly asked “Is this your first election?” for what’s now the third straight election. I get it; I have a baby face.
Electronic voting machines, too. Which made me feel all kinds of uncomfortable, but as long as I turn Texas a little bit bluer, it’s all gravy.
“If the guy dislikes all the candidates that much, it’s his right to abstain, and that should never interfere with his subsequent right to comment on things.”
I’d disagree – I think if you don’t like a candidate, still put in your ballot, write in your name or undervote (choose none). Not saying you don’t have the right to comment on the administration, but I hate the “Both candidates suck so I won’t vote” garb – get out and vote, for local and state at leased, make your voice heard that you didn’t like your choices.
Chris Ray wrote:
Welcome to the rolls of voters, Chris. I voted in Bucks County, Pennsylvania, the 8th Congressional District, a Philadelphia suburb. I waited 34 minutes, by far the longest I’ve waited in over 30 years of voting. I’m pleased and impressed that for you 45 minutes doesn’t seem like too much of a sacrifice to assert your franchise.
Note for US Americans – blue is the conservative colour up here.
Voting in Hells Kitchen today was easy for me, taking about 10 minutes. Folks from local districts with new high rises had longer lines than mine, up to 30 minute.
tsg- can you really not see this? One is an active statement, the other is a failure to bother. If what Ive stated so far doesnt make the difference clear, Im really not sure how I can explain it any better. If the concept of Quorum applies to our elections, I could grant non-appearance as making a statement of some sort, but it doesnt. To the extent that not showing up makes any kind of statement, it says you (the generic you) dont give a shit, and if you dont give a shit, why should we give a shit what you have to say any other time? Show up and do something, even if that something is a complete repudiation of the process, and Ill listen to what you have to say. If you cant be bothered, I cant be bothered to listen to you when you do feel you have something to say.
Having studied elections in Montana, Wyoming, Utah, and Texas, I am convinced of two things: (a) Cows vote. (b) They’re very conservative. Perhaps this explains Alberta?
Beautiful day in suburban Milwaukee, WI. Rode my bike to the polling place: 10 minutes; got my ballot, Obamasized it: 1.5 minutes; rode back to my home office: 10 minutes. Total elapsed time: 21.5 minutes. Piece of frommage!
My first presidential election! Took a bit over 2 hours, but it was pretty fun. I live in Hyde Park, a little bubble of affluent, largely white college students in the middle of a working-class, primarily black area. My polling place was situated such that there was an approximately even mix of university and non-university voters, so it was one of the few times you actually got the two groups in the same place at the same time (we largely self-segregate, unfortunately). Everyone was very friendly, lots of chatting with the people we found ourselves in line with. I got to educate a few people on the Constitutional Convention measure on this year’s Illinois ballot, something that is on there only every 20 years and which IMO was insufficiently publicized and discussed (I wonder why….). Someone else asked me if they were obliged to vote on everything, and I explained to him that no, it was his right to choose not to vote on anything he didn’t want to (personally, I think it’s the ethical thing NOT to vote if you are not informed about something). I don’t know how I became the impromptu voter educator, but I kind of enjoyed it. Much more fun than the absentee voting I’ve done in the past. There was a real sense of community, too, probably because 90% of us were all voting for the same presidential candidate.
I got on line to vote in the Bronx at 8:30 am and got to work (2 blocks away at 10:15. I’ve voted in the same place for 35 years and never had more than 8 people ahead of me. And while the process was slow, it was also smooth.
This community is very poor – the poorest on the East Coast. Turnout is usually low — so it was exciting to see so many folks out there, most for the first time.
I’ve been a (gasp!!) community organizer here all my adult life. I believe in empowerment – and that’s what I saw today — and it was very good.
PS — to folks wondering why the lines are so long – it because too many Americans have not been voting — the budgets to pay poll workers (at least here in NYC) were requested back in December of 2006 based on previous turnout numbers from 2000 and 2004 — so while the lines are tiresome they are a good sign
My north Florida precinct has an African American majority, but there was one really annoying white guy with McCain stickers on his jacket who was trying his best to hold up the line at my polling place. He kept arguing with the poll workers and complaining about voter fraud. Fortunately he didn’t take up too much time and didn’t make too much of an annoyance of himself.
qedpro @ 212
Oh, I beg to differ. Have you ever read the threads on Free Republic? The hot topic last night was how Obama killed his grandmother to keep her from telling everyone that he’s not actually a US citizen, or not actually a Christian, or something.
Why do you assume refusing to vote is a failure to bother?
If you start with the preconception that they only aren’t voting because they don’t give a shit, of course it will look like that.
I would think refusing to participate would also count as repudiating the process if you don’t automatically chalk it up to indifference. But, for the sake of argument, how does showing up, singing “Alice’s Restaurant” and walking out appear any different to someone like you who wasn’t there to see it. The end result is the same. This person didn’t vote and you can’t tell whether or not he showed up to protest.
Why do you assume it’s only because they can’t be bothered?
Another vote in Ohio for the socialist muslin terrorist!
Go Buckeyes!!
No line, but I went at the slowest time of day.
Indiana: It smells like McCain.
Just got back from voting and getting my free coffee at Starbucks.
I say Indiana smells like McCain because there was hardly any line at all and when I left, there was no one outside coming in. It’s almost exactly the same way it was in 2004 here when Indiana went for Bush. It seems to be the same people voting that voted in 2004.
I had been told there were long early voting lines, but I didn’t see any.
I voted absentee a couple weeks ago. I feel like I’m missing the action..
Etha Williams! Good to see you again. Congrats on your first presidential vote.
Like The Chemist, I feel slightly left out of today’s festivities because I had to vote early. My mother became seriously ill last week, I had to drive to another state to visit her in the hospital, and I wasn’t sure I’d be back home before Election Day, so I went to my county election office in downtown Rochester and filled out a ballot there before leaving town.
The good news is that Mom is doing much better — and she’d already voted by absentee ballot because even at her best she’s a bit too physically frail to stand in line at a polling place. She’s proudly wearing the Obama-Biden button that I brought her, and has definitely been leaning on the nursing staff to get out and vote, dammit!
Since she was obviously so much better, I did get back to New York before today. Hmmm, I wonder if Starbucks will care whether I still have my sticker?
Saying the (presumably) obvious, it strikes me that refusing to express support for either candidate is rational enough at least (structurally, anyway), if you’ve thought it over seriously, and genuinely feel neither is a significant improvement over the other.
(Partisan mode on: I don’t, for the record, feel that at all, myself, and trust me, I’ve done one whole hell of a lot of thinking about it, the last several months, even though I can’t even vote in the US. I’m a Canadian citizen, tho’ I’ve lived in the US previously, and am now under sporadic pressure from my mostly US-based employer to move over to their side of the border and get some immigration paperwork moving. I’m a bit sympathetic, all the same, to someone still suspecting it’s not much of a choice, as I did go through a period of thinking that myself, prior to the conventions, anyway. But on balance, yes, I absolutely have moved on from that, and even being more than a bit cynical about what little it still might mean to have a charismatic and ‘inspiring’ candidate in office, I’d still be giving Senator Obama my grudging vote now if I had one for a host of reasons, perhaps chief among them a faint hope that the Democrats would take a stronger mandate as a prompt actually to grow some stones and go after certain Bush administration players who really, on balance, probably should be in jail, for everyone’s protection, and the considerably less faint hope that they’ll actually get off their asses and reverse some of the more lunatic moves that sordid crew made–or, at least, those that can still be reversed–pronto. But then, of course, that’s just me… Partisan mode back off…)
… All that said, I have to express my respect and gratitude to everyone here who, having thought it through, is doing what they think is the right thing. And it really is heartening to see some nice participation numbers. In the long run, I think, it’s probably a good thing, however it goes after 19h00 ET this eve.
@ 229, while I don’t think I could last for five hours of waiting myself, some people enjoy the sense of community and occasion that comes with voting on the actual Election Day, even at the expense of waiting in line for a half hour or so. It’s kinda like waiting for the midnight release of the seventh Harry Potter book. You don’t go because you can’t wait a few more hours to buy it in the morning; you go for the sense of excitement, anticipation, and the humorous costumes.
Took me all of 8 minutes to vote. NO LINES at all. Very organized and friendly, UNLIKE the conversations I had earlier this morning w/ 2 of my siblings whom intend to vote Mccain. This could ruin the Holidays but, I don’t care. One sibling is ONLY concerned with HIS PORTFOLIO while the other sent me an email this morning which stated “Go ahead, vote Obama and kill more babies.” I suppose it would be a waste of time to invite them both to my atheist group on Thursdays.
I’m nearly giddy w/ hope here in Chicago.
I assume you’re being facetious about Republican vs Democratic dog catchers.
I assume that these minor offices are elected to prevent them from being appointed by the mayor to his brother-in-law and drinking buddies. Most of these offices usually run unopposed unless the person starts screwin up.
tsg
I know you’re having this debate with Dave, so sorry for re-inserting myself back in to the conversation… I hear what you’re saying, and I never meant my initial post to argue against the points you’re making (and I know my one-line retort did just that, which is why I’ve since amended it).
Conscientious objection is a valid form of activism. I get that. It was the tenor and tone of the rest of BluesBassist’s post, beyond simply stating that he refused to vote, that caused my reaction. His post did lead me to believe that he was only interested in complaining about the process and his “illegitimate government” quip further solidified my opinion that he was not interested in doing anything other than whining about the process. That makes him different than the “conscientious objector” you describe.
And as I said earlier, I may have been too hasty in that assessment. It was an admittedly short post, but I’ve not heard him qualify his position otherwise… so…
It’s just a state of mind, but i get it. It’s sort of like opening christmas presents a day or two early and then feeling let down with little to look forward to on christmas day. Look at the bright side: it doesn’t matter when you voted – the election returns and all the watch parties are tonight. We’ll all know the results at roughly the same time, for better or for worse.
When I opened my blinds this morning I saw two Obama volunteers working GOTV. I opened the window and called out them “Good luck today, and Thank You!”
I voted two weeks ago for Barack Obama.
I’ve been saying that they would for a long time, but I now think the early voting, ~7% Obama lead, and projected ~2% chance of victory for McCain puts the result beyond the few percent that fraud can swing the polls. The consensus seems to be that there is no winning scenario for McCain where he loses PA, so I’ll breathe a sigh of relief if the result there is very clear.
Link: http://foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/11/04/youdecide_1104/
The posts over there are truly scary (and mostly all caps), but prove beyond any shadow of a doubt that the Fox Noise audience are credulous, racist, theofascist wingnuts.
I voted on my way to work. No issues at all. I was 6th in line. I live in south-central PA. Our polling location is a Catholic-parish…(make your own joke.) We use the touch-screen voting machines.
That’s the right attitude, QD… As shiny as they can be, a politician stays a politician and you can NEVER trust them. Never ever ever.
Was that sarcasm? I can’t tell. I’m at work an surrounded by $100 million or so of space communications equipment, elbow deep in electronics and my head full of object oriented code, so I become a bit dehumanized here. :-)
Look, I just think our system has a way of filtering out anyone truly rational or even fully sane even before the primaries.
It’s like the scene from the Andromeda Strain (the old one) where they are using successively tighter filters to try and isolate the virus. Don’t be surprised at the end if all you have left is a deadly space plague. ;-)
Voted for the first time this year, was a few months too late in 2004. My school had early voting set up in our student union, so I did that. There wasn’t even a wait!
@Celtic_Evolution #263
I understand. Unfortunately the sentiment expressed by your one-liner is a widely held view, even if it isn’t one you share.
And, for the record, I am not necessarily defending BluesBassist or his views.
I voted over two weeks ago.
Any voters out there from Montana? I’ve been watching this state from afar (northern California), watching the polls develop in a state I’m starting to like, and it seemed like it might be slipping Obama’s way. I like that development.
Just curious if I can get a report from, say, Missoula or Billings.
(Complete aside: I also followed Helena’s “controversy” over the book “The Joy of Gay Sex” at the Lewis & Clark library. That was a fun one to follow.)
I voted this morning around 8am. It was quick and painless, just as it should be. Dunno how much a vote for Obama will count in KY though. Can’t hurt any :)
One sibling is ONLY concerned with HIS PORTFOLIO….
And he still votes Republican? Yikes!
Yeah, I get that… I usually don’t make hasty posts (except to Quiet Desperation… right buddy? Heh) without looking them over once or twice to make sure I’m conveying what i want to say accurately and intelligently.
I still take issue with BluesBassist’s post, as is, but shouldn’t have generalized as I did about refusing to vote for one candidate or the other.
Truthfully, as much as I support Obama and have hope for his success as a president, it really does bug the shit out of me that we never get any realistic 3rd or 4th options. However, I would personally never think for an instant that refusing to participate in the process will help that situation.
Ok… that’s really all I have to say on that subject.
Voted after teching my early class. It felt great. No problems, almost no waiting (11 AM isn’t usually the busiest of times). Picked up something to drink for tonight, hopefully in celebration and not for drowning my sorrows in.
What about the canvas terrorist?
I dont. This is a misreading of me that you seem to be consistently making, despite repeated explanations of why that is not what I am saying. Once more: I assume not showing up is a failure to bother. As I have explained several times, it is entirely possible to show up and not vote. As Ive made clear, even in parts you have quoted, Im fine with not voting, its not showing up that will cause me not to listen to your complaints about the government and our elected officials.
No the end result isnt the same. To begin with, hes disrupted the process albeit minimally (the election machine was set and now has to be reset, and the poll workers have to account for the lack of a vote.) And while I may not have seen it, other people did. Only if he doesnt show up will noone see it. This isnt about a failure to make a statement to me, its a failure to make a statement to society, and parts of society will be a the polling station.
Shrug. In a perfect world, I would agree with you. However, in the world we live in, there are approx 100 million people who dont bother show up to most elections. If you want to claim that any but a minute minority of those are making a statement to repudiate the process, I guess thats your right, but it seems rather fanciful to me, and quite to the contrary of my experience. I think its quite reasonable to expect those who are trying to make such a different statement to take some action to distinguish their statement from the vast majority doing the same thing because they simply cant be bothered.
Just another point, my polling place was in a Catholic church gym. However, I didn’t see a single piece of religous paraphernalia–good for them, I guess :)
In the spirit of offering solutions, I’m a proponent of IRV.
Voted in Austin.
In a hard core red state (or blue one) you may think your vote doesn’t count, but it does in at least 2 ways:
1. The popular vote for president influences public opinion (even if Bush’s mandate 4 years ago didn’t get him anywhere)
2. Local elections. In many ways these have a larger impact on your life than the presidential election, and you have a larger impact on their outcome. Pay attention.
Remember, vote early, vote often.
The lines were fine at my polling place in Baton Rouge. However, the ballot sucked.
The Libertarian candidate wasn’t available because he didn’t apply in time due to Hurricane Gustav (both the Republicans and the Democrats were late in Texas, but naturally they still managed to be included on the ballot). With no L to vote for, I got angry and voted for Obama in protest against neocon Republicans. I really wanted to vote for Bob Barr though.
I voted L for senate and D for the house. I abstained from some small local vote that had only two R’s running. I voted no for every proposition because, unlike last time, there were no summaries explaining in plain English what they meant (although I did glance over them and make sure none of them were overtly good propositions before protesting with blanket no votes).
Good luck, America. The more neo-cons and theocrats you can drop-kick out of office, the bigger the favour you’ll be doing for the rest of the civilised world.
You know guys, just because the poll is in a church doesn’t mean there is a problem. Churches have BIG ROOMS. And for voting you need lots of space.
Sounds like a fair deal to me. A room is a room.
I voted at 9:15. Took all of 5 minutes. The only downside was that I had to vote in a church.
Doing my part to TURN NORTH DAKOTA BLUE!
Doing my part to TURN INDIANA BLUE! Come on, Hoosiers!!!
I stand corrected and will rephrase the question: Why do you assume not showing up is failing to bother?
Is this particular person not allowed to decide that this is a completely ineffective means of protest?
And I am challenging the assertion that the “vast majority” are indifferent or lazy. On what do you base this claim?
Can’t vote being a Brit, and due to the time delay some 5 to 6 hours it will be around 6 am British time before the results are fully known-that said we wait for a better day and a new Prez and hope to god theres no cheating or dodgy polls or counts-remember the debacle over “chads”?
Please god don’t let it happen again
Think of it this way: it’s making use of otherwise wasted space.
I just got back from class and wow – I drove past I think three polling places on the way to the university, and they all had packed parking lots with lots of people waiting for a spot or walking in. Possibly because it was lunch time, but still, very good to see (even if they’re voting for the Godawful Other Party).
On the other hand, I was bewildered by the folks at the corner of one of the major intersections with signs for “SARAH.” It was so weird to see them trying to get folks to vote for the V.P. candidate, not one of the candidates with top billing, and furthermore, to be waving signs about that emphasize a first name rather than the last name as usual.
But I thought it was really weird that Senator Clinton traded heavily on first-name recognition as well, though that’s more understandable since there was another Clinton already president.
I just returned from voting and then lunch.
The line was short at my polling place (3 miles away) but was very long at the polling place within walking distance of my house but is in the same district. (The polling places are determined by zip code and not geographical efficiency; ergo, a single polling place may include more than one district, such as where I vote.)
Thankfully my state uses very simple scan-tron ballots. I saw on the news that VA, a swing state in this election, is having problems with paper ballots getting wet and then clogging machines. I lived in Northern VA for almost 3 years and my district used non-Diebold electronic machines. So what dumb-fuck thought it would be a good idea to put a paper ballot system outdoors, in the rain!!
I voted absentee already. This is my first election (and a great one to vote in). As a Californian, my Presidential vote doesn’t matter that much (voted for Barr, pulling for Obama).
I cast the vote against California’s Propositions 4 and 8, and hope to see them gone.
Suburban Columbus, OH. No wait at 10 am (well, maybe 3-4 min.). We had mail voting, but I didn’t see the point (I live about 300 m from a voting center, and I brought a book).
The problem with not voting as civil disobedience is that it is ambiguous – the people who run the government can’t tell “I don’t believe you should have the authority to rule me” or “the choices in this election are pathetic” from “I drank too much last night and couldn’t be bothered”. Most governments in the US don’t appear to care much about low voter turnout as a measure of legitimacy (one of the major Republican illegitimacies is their discouragement of voting, which looks just like the actions of a junta who wants the appearance of legitimacy but not the actuality), and so not voting doesn’t make anyone listen. The federal, state, and local governments still maintain substantive power over your tax money and what they spend it on, and not voting cedes any power over them to others. If you don’t believe that your power to change governments’ actions by voting is substantive, the pretense of others that voting can change government behavior is still maintained by the absence of a vote. A write-in vote would send a more effective message of disenfranchisement than the lack of a vote.
tsg,
as one says in spanish,
si se puede cambiar !
This is true.
However, I don’t have a problem with voting in a church – my last polling place before this was a Masonic Lodge, and before that it was the cafeteria of a Catholic school. I have a problem with all the obnoxious people outside the church with their “VOTE REPUB. OR GO TO HELL” and “GOD SAYS VOTE YES ON No. 2” signs. (Not sure if the first is an actual sign, but I wouldn’t be surprised – I have seen the second – Amendment No. 2 in Florida aims to define marriage as man+woman only, and to do away with benefits for non-married couples, even if they’re man+woman.)
I try to avoid that kind of crap since I’m an ex-catholic with the guilt complex, and being shouted at that I’m going to hell if I don’t do X tends to be traumatizing.
Besides, I never see that kind of signage or hear that kind of shouting except around the Church polling places, especially the Southern Baptist and Assemblies ones.
Celtic_Evolution @263 wrote:
Conscientious objection is a valid form of activism. I get that. It was the tenor and tone of the rest of BluesBassist’s post, beyond simply stating that he refused to vote, that caused my reaction. His post did lead me to believe that he was only interested in complaining about the process and his “illegitimate government” quip further solidified my opinion that he was not interested in doing anything other than whining about the process. That makes him different than the “conscientious objector” you describe.
You could not be more incorrect. I donated to the campaign of one of the major party presidential nominees (who did not get the nomination), and participated in a fund-raiser for a House candidate. (I can’t vote for him however because I’m not a constituent in his state.)
I did not vote for a number of very well thought out reasons, which are too lengthy to post here, and with which you will undoubtedly disagree. Suffice to say that I consider both major party candidates to be so unethical and incompetent, I can’t in good conscience vote for either of them.
I don’t understand what you’re trying to say.
Northern Virginia, in and done in ten minutes mid-morning. Good turn-out, but smooth no-problem voting. The exciting part was when I arrived and ran into my neighbors who had just voted. They are originally from Kyrgyzstan, just got their citizenship this year, and this was their first time voting in their entire lives. As great as I felt voting, it had to be ten times better for them!
@260.
I wouldn’t stand in line for Harry Potter, a new video game console or anything else. As I told a friend on the phone last night, I wouldn’t wait in a 5 hour line for a blow job. There is *NOTHING* in the world that is that important, especially if you can do it with zero wait early.
Quiet Desperation said:
We’ll stop it when they stop leaving the -ic off the adjective: “The Democrat Party” “The Democrat Senator.” Seriously, if they think they’re insulting or belittling me in some way, they’re wrong. They just make themselves sound like totally illiterate fuckwits!
Just got back from voting at 10 AM. ~20 people there instead of the usual 2. Not like Washington was in play, but we need a landslide! VOTE, people, and yes, if you don’t vote, Quit Your Bitching!
The system is not set up to make that differentiation. Stop looking to it to make it.
One could argue that voting for other than one of the two candidates that can win does precisely the same thing.
Matt Penfold (#128):
Ah, happy days … So, were you still up for Portillo?
(I was, and I fully intend to be glued to the BBC’s election coverage tonight until the small hours of the morning, in the hope of recapturing something of the May ’97 feeling. Since we can’t kick out the current UK government without replacing them with something worse, I’m going to have to live vicariously through our American cousins.)
This is the sixth election at my current location. For the previous five, I never had to wait more than a few minutes and the lines were, at most, ten people deep.
Today I had to stand in line for an hour. The other precinct at my polling place had a line twice as long.
I live in a true blue state and still the turnout is huge. I think nationally the voter turnout is going to be higher than current estimates. At least something more respectable than 50%.
The only problem I had was a man who complained when a pregnant woman was moved to the front of the line. My wife saw her and notified an election volunteer, who chose to move her up. The guy who complained worked in the defense industry. (Republican?)
Keri @294: Depending on how close those signs are to the polling place, that could be illegal.
Me, my wife, her mother, and my oldest son voted today in North Carolina. Four votes for NOBAMA.
Great! Good to see you and your family participate.
http://firedoglake.com/2008/11/04/fired-up-ready-to-go/
I’m ready to go.
Dilly-dallied working at home until 10am to avoid the expected lines. I was #243 in the precinct. Five (or was it 6) machines, no waiting — I was the only voter there until my neighbor showed up 2 minutes later. Negatives: they were out of stickers; the machines are electronic which makes me a bit queasy (but they do print a paper copy). Positives: I got to vote for a real scientist as my Representative (Foster, yeah!).
The weather here great (the warmest election day ever?). I’m pondering blowing off the afternoon, going home, picking up my 10yr old son and taking the train into Chicago.
*sigh*
@298. Yes, I understand that ;) I only wanted to point out that some people enjoy elements of the experience that appear to be meaningless to others such as yourself. Kind of like how some people like roller coasters or fireworks, and others don’t. That’s all.
Me, my wife, her mother, and my oldest son voted today in North Carolina. Four votes for NOBAMA.
Let me be the first to say, fuck the lot of ya.
And I believe you to be a self-indulgent ass-wipe, for a number of very well thought out reasons, which are too lengthy to post here, and with which you will undoubtedly disagree…
Or can we stop assuming one another’s positions now? (With the understanding that this is an admission that I did that to you, earlier).
Of course I have to go to the CHURCH to vote, which is bad for them because the floor scorches wherever my hooves tread those places.
For YOUR election day irony, I offer some vintage Molly Ivins and Sarah Palin for your surrealistic listening pleasure.
http://acksisofevil.org/audio/inner199.mp3
I voted Obama, I wish I could have over and over. I’m here in MN, and PZ, I made a point to vote Anderson for Judge because of your heads up!
After hearing reports of early voters waiting in line between 2 and 6 hours, I was surprised to walk right in to my local plumber’s union and vote. I’m a little disappointed that the optical-scan ballots that Florida has gone with this year don’t give feedback to confirm that they’ve scanned correctly, but at least my ballot should be nice and legible for the inevitable recount.
My mother, Step Father (life long republican), Brother, Sister, three cousins (that I know of) and two aunts and uncles voted in NC for OBAMA.
So there.
CJO? Voting for Obama is bad?
They were saying the voted for THAT ONE.
tsg,
Correct me if I misunderstood you, but you are not voting because you consider that both candidates are basically of poor quality and won’t be capable of implementing the kind of changes that you think are necessary.
All I’m suggesting is that with McCain, you’re guaranteed nothing’s going to change, with Obama, based on his campaign in the general election one might think the same , but most of it was based on an electoral dance he had to perform in order to get elected. Based on his personality, his background, his intellect, his personal experiences, I believe real profound change will be more likely with Obama than with any other president before him since FDR. Especially taking into account that he arrives at a moment in history that represents a discontinuity from a global perspective.
Now if that’s not an opportunity, I don’t know what is.
So on one hand you have the certainty that nothing will change (McCain), on the other, the hope that we can change for the better (Obama). Still, the hope is better than the certainty.
Here’s a list of free food for voters!
http://forums.slickdeals.net/showthread.php?threadid=989221
Starbucks…Ben & Jerry’s…Krispy Kreme…more! Save that “I voted” sticker or ballot stub (although many will take your word for it).
Isn’t a vote for NOBAMA a vote for Obama?
Emmet Caulfied@266
I think I’ll wait until Obama’s victory is clear from actual results – not that I have any doubt he’ll win now, but at present the slimeballs would still make me angry – later, I’ll just laugh with uncontainable glee!
We have optical-scan ballots where I voted and have had them for at least 16 years as I remember. Considering all the controversy about other methods, why would other methods be used?
I’m challenging the assertion that people who refrain from voting are necessarily apathetic or lazy.
Let’s see. Fifty states, some of which dictate what to use, and some of which leave it up to the counties/cities to run the elections in their area.
Western MA, in a multiple-college town. Voted (paper ballots) at 10:30 this morning, in-and-out in about 10 minutes, although there are reports of lines in other precincts.
I can’t recall seeing any McCain posters around town, although there was a rah-rah table for McCain/Palin at campus today – not getting nearly as much business as the rah-rah table for Obama/Biden. Many students and some faculty/staff wearing Obama hats, shirts, buttons, etc.
The in-laws in eastern MA, however, are another matter. Staunchly republican, and who think Palin is terrific and will be a serious presidential contender two cycles from now. I’m not looking forward to Thanksgiving dinner.
Where in NC did you vote Eric? Are you in one of Wake, Guilford, Meclenburg or Forsyth counties? That seems pretty high tech considering I was voting on paper 4 years ago. I’m guessing cost is the biggest factor with those.
Isn’t a vote for NOBAMA a vote for Obama?
Well it’s really a vote for McCain, but I perfer to think of it as a vote against Obama.
Lesser of two weevils.
Did my part to make Kansas just a little bit more blue.
There were about 25 people in line at 5:45 when I got to the polls. The workers were about 10 minutes late getting everything moving, and didn’t really have a good plan to get the lines started. I was pretty close to the front, though, and things went smoothly.
We may even gain a dem in the senate from here today (not likely, but the recent polls have been getting close).
Cheers.
CJO? Voting for Obama is bad?
Not at all what I meant.
I am presuming that “NOBAMA” is faux-clever redneck moron speak for the negation of Obama.
But I’m not fluent in faux-clever redneck moron, so I might be wrong. Eric’s done plenty to earn my disdain, though, (yesterday he referred to Obama as “the magic negro”) so no retraction would be in order either way.
#300: 1) I’m aware that the electoral system isn’t supposed to make those distinctions, which was my point. I don’t expect it to make them – if I want people to know what I want I have to tell them. The people in office may choose to ignore me, but I can’t stop that. Other people (if there are enough of a mind) might leave a message for others to understand and follow.
2) I haven’t voted for a third party candidate because I haven’t found one that I would prefer to the D (or R) candidates, and in recent experience, votes for third party candidates have helped to elect the person they would have least preferred (at least at the Presidential level – Perot in 1992, Nader in 2000). If you don’t think anyone is listening, though, then voting for a third party is better than none at all. It sends a message, though whether the message is heard above the noise requires lots of other people to think as you do (so that other voters know that your candidate exists as an option, and perhaps that the major party candidates know there is a dissatisfied majority willing to act). In the short term, voting for a third-party candidate gives away leverage on some issues, with the hope that in the long run there might be candidates that more closely represent your beliefs and can implement them.
Hairy Doctor Professor
The impression I get I that there is a mood in America today rather like the one we had on 1st May 1997 when we finally kicked the Tories out of office and replaced them with Labour. Matt Penfold
My experience of 1997 was different. I knew when Labour lost in 1992 that the party was going to be pretty much fully Thatcherised, as indeed it has been. I was still delighted to get rid of the bunch of Tory sleazebags we did (and I was still up for Portillo – that was the best), but I knew BLiar was going to be bad. (I was wrong – he was much, much worse than I could have imagined!) I happened to be in Edinburgh for a conference a couple of days later, and got chatting to some guys in the pub. They felt much the same, but as one of them said “This taime it was pairrrsonal!“. I get a much more hopeful feeling from the US now – here’s hoping Obama doesn’t do a BLiar on you!
Oh well.. funny how I didn’t notice it was the douche bag Eric.
Yeah he voted for McSame/Pain.
Rev.
Johnston County, NC
I remember voting in the 1992 general election with Optical-scan ballots and remarking how simple they were compared to the old mechaincal voting machines. I think I used the old voting machines in the 1990 election.
Got to my poll in North Minneapolis ten minutes after it opened and found a line half a block long. It took an hour but I had a couple of new friends by the end. I was voter number 173. Everybody is enthused about Change and excited to vote. And all commented that they had NEVER waited in line at this precinct (I just bought my house here a year ago). Then I spent the rest of the morning driving voters to the polls for the DFL. Cautiously optimistic…
I stopped to vote after dropping the kids off at school. No line – took about 5 minutes. Somewhat anticlimactic in such an important election!
Ahh near Raleigh. When I was in college at NCSU from 91-95 … hell I can’t remember what I voted on there, but I’m betting that would have been back home in Forsyth county.
In 2004 I voted on the Isle of Palms, a pretty high dollar per capita district and they still were using paper punch cards if I’m not totally forgetting.
I guess that’s south carolina for you. Hell with the disorganization of the voting this morning I shouldn’t be surprised.
One vote to keep Michigan a blue state here.
It was my first time voting in this precinct, but others there said the crowds had never been like this in years past. Mostly african-americans there, so I’ll be interested to see how many new voters Obama managed to get to the polls.
Voted this morning in Seattle. The polling place had to be moved to another location (very close) because of the high turnout. Took about 30 minutes.
Washington is a very blue state but we’re also home to the Discovery Institute. Grr.
There is 100% probablilty that Maryland will go for Obama; the husbeast still used the election (almost certainly his last presidential opportunity) to avoid going to cardiac rehab in the morning. “What if I died at rehab and didn’t get to vote for Obama?”
Not to fear, he gets up in the morning and realizes he is still on the right side of the grass, and engages life. He is not even afraid to buy green bananas.
Our polling place in a geezer home had the longest lines I personally had ever seen there – still we were out in less than half an hour. Very efficient and I made a point of thanking some of the workers for their efforts.
Rev.
Moo. U.
My son has applied at NCSU in Nuclear Engineering in 2009.
With his grades he should get in. What did you study and did you like it there? If you don’t mind my asking.
#324: I know there’s not much rationality present to start with, but how do they expect that to happen? Brain transplants are likely to take longer than eight years to develop, let alone integrity transplant. Perhaps they figure that DOD will develop a weapon of mass stupidity whose us will enable most of the population to believe that Governor Palin is competent to run a 7-11, let alone a country.
“First, we take Alaska, then we take…Butte?”
My voting experience did not start well. We knew that our polling location had moved since the last election, but the map we printed from the League of Women Voters was wrong. Off by 3 miles wrong. Luckily, I knew the construction history of the area and was able to figure out why it was wrong (the street had been re-routed and part of it renamed) so we eventually found it.
After about an hour wait, we got our ballots and headed to the booths to fill them in. Optical scanner, similar to scantron fill-in bubbles (previous elections had optical scanners where you drew a thick black line – I like those better). All those standardized tests finally proved useful!
Then I had to turn in the ballot. The stub gets removed by the worker and cross-checked against the list of registered voters (fourth time in the process!) and then I take the ballot to the scanner. The scanner displays a tally of the number of ballots inserted. Guess what?
My number was 666.
I am the Beast!
Ecosystems Assessment aka “Environmental Consulting” in the Natural Resources department.
I loved school at NCSU was not as big of a fan of Raleigh. I learned a lot but unfortunately decided that becoming a ski/climbing bum in Jackson Hole was more important than seriously pursuing a job in the field. I should have gotten a computer science degree as that is what I’m doing now. I have a high respect for the school and the quality of educators they hire there. My grandfather was a professor in the Entomology department there for decades so I was around people who taught there from the time I was a wee lad until he retired.
It’s a great school for any science or agricultural endeavor.
Texas voter here. Obama has my vote via the mail-in ballot I sent through the pipe four days ago. Sorry, no grievous standing-in-line experiences this election.
We all knew that Satan was at work in this election. ;)
Make that 2 for KY, I think, plus my wife, for Obama.
My problem with not voting as a means of protest is that there is no way to differentiate your protest from people who really don’t give a shit.
Also, if Eric is using the phrase “magic negro” for Obama, you can bet he didn’t come up with it on his own. Its been a Rush Limbaugh term since he appropriated it from classic Hollywood for an acceptable, non threatening black person who could dance, sing, etc (Uncle Remus).
I just had a moment of clarity about Eric A.
For the record I voted for Obama.
Also, in my district one Senate and one House seat were up for re-election. The Senate seat, held by an incumbent Repugnant, was uncontested so I wrote in “None of the Above” to cast a vote against him. Leaving the category blank would not count as a vote against him.
My city is the largest city in the entire state and is overwhelmingly Democrat; however, due to how district lines are drawn I have Repugnant representatives. District gerrymandering is a huge issue in my state.
tsg,
The population that doesn’t vote is huge, on average 46% of the electorate, so it would be a bit ridiculous to affirm that they are all apathetic or lazy !
Some are really lazy or not really interested or demotivated or apathetic, some are just refusing to vote for the lesser of two evils because they aren’t satisfied with the choices.
I don’t know what are the proportions, and my guess is that the motivations will vary depending on the traditional low turnout categories (youth, ethnic minorities, low income, low education).
The real problem in America is that typically because these categories have systematically refrained from voting election after election, the result has been that no real social-democratic change has ever taken place. It’s been like a fait-accompli.
And they don’t even seem to realise it. It’s just like giving up on democratic power, the only power they have !
As I told a friend on the phone last night, I wouldn’t wait in a 5 hour line for a blow job.
Well… who’s doing the BJ?
Thanks Rev.
Then that isn’t a problem with not voting as you originally implied.
I disagree. I think it is precisely the same as not voting.
The message that voting third party sends is indistinguishable between “I think this person is the best choice”, “I think the other two suck”, and “I think the system is broken”. In the latter case, it sends precisely the opposite message: “I think the system works.”
For this to have any effect whatsoever, it would require a large number of people to vote against their best interests. A major flaw in the first-past-the-post system is that it causes two similar candidates to split the vote giving the candidate that most disapprove of the election and becomes an “if enough people do it” problem. There is some number of people X required to make the action effective. For everyone up to X-1, they are risking their least preferred candidate being elected for no gain. For everyone X+1 and higher, they are taking the same risk unnecessarily, since it will happen without them. Since the action only makes sense when the person will be number X, and they can’t know that beforehand, they will tend to vote for the one candidate they prefer of the two who can win.
But let me ask a question, if everyone was dissatisfied with the election process and followed your advice of voting anyway, how would we know they were dissatisfied with it?
You know guys, just because the poll is in a church doesn’t mean there is a problem. Churches have BIG ROOMS. And for voting you need lots of space.
Also, they are quite often the only places in residential areas (other than schools) with parking lots. Sometimes practicality just has to trump everything else.
I’m probably more anti-religious than Chris Hitchens, but polling places in churches don’t bother me at all.
If you start with the preconception that “don’t really give a shit” is a primary reason, that is.
You would think, but here I am having that very argument with several people here.
I motion for a vote to change the federal elections to a standardized paper ballot system (based on one format) countrywide, with electronic counting machines.
End electronic voting machines until they can add 2+2 and get the right answer (5…j/k). I’ve never heard of computers having so many inherent problems, and I’ve been in front of a damn computer daily for 14 years. I’ve built them, I’ve fixed them, I’ve yelled and screamed at them. Yet none I can recall were so inherently faulty out of the box they came in. Electronic voting = threat to the US in its current form.
[bloody hit “post” instead of “preview”]
The problem with voting when you are dissatisfied with the system is that there is no way to differentiate your vote from people who think the system works.
tsg,
If you start with the preconception that “don’t really give a shit” is a primary reason, that is.
Point taken, but does it matter? Since the preconception is that they don’t care, just not voting does nothing to break that view.
I went to vote — in my first election ever — at the YMCA right after I got out of my geography class this morning. The whole thing, from riding my bike there to casting my ballot and getting back to the university, took just under half an hour.
I would say it was boring and uneventful, but that would be lying. I’m really excited to have voted. There were, however, no complications. Everything was very efficient.
I really don’t see any advantages of using touch screen or other computer technologies, over scaned paper ballots.
Any comments?
Neither does voting do anything to voice the opinion that the system is flawed.
The point is don’t look to the system for an answer it can’t give you.
Wishing America and all its citizens the very best for this election…
I hope Obama will be your President tomorrow morning…from a foreigner aspect… he seems the best thing since Kennedy…after the last few years America deserves something a lot better then dubya shrub…
Barack can revive America and its fortunes…the opposition ticket will only kill it off…then claim tis gods will…
Good luck….
( regards from a Brit who is a long way from home)
Personally, I like the optical scan ballots. The technology is very good, and there is a paper trail in case of recount. There is a problem with them, in that certain people who cannot fill in the circle properly, like some of the elderly with tremors, may not have their vote read properly. My county uses a touchscreen to mark the optical ballots for these people, insuring a correct vote. My two cents.
I really don’t see any advantages of using touch screen or other computer technologies, over scaned paper ballots.
Other than that it makes it easier for the lying scumbags you just voted for to steal the election? Nope, not a one.
Quiet and boring out in Santa Rosa,CA. Nobody got hysterical, started speaking in tongues, or even raised their voice. Quick and painless.
If I vote for Mickey Mouse, it should be clear I don’t think he’s a viable candidate, and it would be differentiable from a vote for a third-party candidate. It would not distinguish between “the candidates all suck” and “the system is broken”. It’s an improvement over not voting, because not voting doesn’t distinguish between any of the options (and doesn’t eliminate the “I don’t care” option).
The few people I have heard who voted for third-party candidates did so because they believed that neither candidate was in their best interests, and that both the major party candidates were functionally equivalent – thus they would not be sacrificing leverage now for potential leverage later (because they didn’t care which of the other two won, and so had no leverage now). For other people, it probably doesn’t make as much sense – if you think that there is a difference between the candidates, then voting third party seems likely to elect the one you least want.
If you think that everyone won’t vote, not voting would work to indicate “the system is broken” – but the ability of a few to control the outcome at that point makes low enough voter participation hard to obtain. (More people are likely to vote if they have enough leverage to choose the outcome). Low voter turnouts (10%) haven’t fazed elected officials yet, and I don’t see how not voting would generate low enough participation to force them to be concerned.
I don’t have the imagination to see how to control government (or change its size, or shape) without voting. To change elections requires changing elections, and depends on the ability and desire of other people to vote to make changes happen. You can try to start a company to do pieces of the government’s job, I guess, though they tend to be coopted to other ends (because the investors want first and foremost to make money).
Just voted in Wisconsin. Zero line, choice of optical scan or touchscreen voting.
jeez. color me dumbass.
I’ve been researching biometric security for our sales force and when I real Optical Scan Ballots I somehow made the optical scan connection with ballot like there was some identity verification ….optically.
Ok. What an idiot.
Yes we had optical scan ballots today…
sheesh. Time to go home and have a beer.
Sorry for being a while, RL intrudes sometimes.
Yes there is, if you write in “Fuck the System” as your presidential candidate, thats a pretty clear statement that the system doesnt work. If one person does it, I doubt anyone will pay attention, but if 100,000 people do, it will get some attention; if 100,000 more people stay home on election day, no one will even notice.
Ill try to address some of your other points later.
CJO.
Go fall in a toilet.
Flush.
Yahoooo!!! Election Day! I voted, and noticed there was no line. I was in and out in no time. However, that didn’t mean turnout in my locality was low, quite the contrary. The counter was up about 240 more people than in previous election around the same time I went in 2004.
Many in my area voted ahead of time, over 26,000 over the weekend. And during that particular time, a State Senator was removed from the voting line by police because she was campaigning for Obama. Ouch! She should have known better! The line to vote is off limits for campaigning. First time it’s ever happened in my area.
The problem with voting for Mickey Mouse is that it does precisely nothing but annoy the volunteers at the polling place who have to fill it in on all the forms and who are powerless to do anything about it. No government official cares if you vote for Mickey Mouse, if he’s even aware of it, because he’s in office without your vote. It is a pointless exercise. You might as well complain to trees.
I’m not claiming that not voting is a means to change the government. I’m specifically taking issue with the assertions that people who don’t vote are just lazy.
One could argue that since the only people who have the power to change the system are in power because of it, it isn’t very likely to get changed by working within it.
Posted by: Celtic_Evolution | November 4, 2008 2:19 PM
Amherst or Springfield? :)
Amherst.
It’s a fair question… honestly, at this point with the technology, I’m not sure I could make a convincing case for touch-screen and other computer technology… (and mind you, this is coming from a network manager).
In an ideal world, touch-screen / computer based voting would be more accurate, quicker, and easier to use (just point and touch to cast your vote). Additionally, it would potentially allow for information regarding bills that are up for vote to be displayed in a more informative manner. There are advantages, certainly.
However, this is clearly not an ideal world. The technologies should work, but real world results indicate that the current crop of electronic voting machines are notoriously unreliable. And there’s a lack of vote verification output (a simple printout indicating your vote after you’re done would solve this, I think), which is a major problem.
At this time, I’d have to admit that I feel more comfortable with older style voting systems… and that’s saying a lot considering what I do for a living… or maybe it’s because of what I do for a living that I’m wary… either way, I see your point, Eric (and that may be the first, last, and only time you will ever hear me utter those words).
Can we make a distinction between the group of people who fail to vote for unknown reasons, only some of which are apathy and laziness, and the group of people who announce that they don’t vote? Like the self-important “undecided” voters, the libertarians wearing Guy Fawkes masks, or, I don’t know, furries, most of these people just want attention.
Maybe they have rational arguments behind their ornery proclamations, maybe not; many of us won’t hear those arguments because we’ve already been cued to the fact that we’re not talking to Mr. Social Skills when he starts in about “turd sandwiches.”
Voted in downtown Philadelphia for Obama this morning at poll opening. I was with my neighbor who had never waited in line before to vote at this location. It took 40 minutes to vote, in downtown Philly which is a huge indicator for Obama. Everyone seemed to be in good spirits before and after.
Far as I’m concerned, you did your civic duty in a thoughtful and considered manner. Which is more than I can say about a lot of folks in this country.
Not that I agree with your choice, but….that’s why we vote, innit?
Really? Then why are we even talking about it? Why is “voter apathy” an issue in every election? Why the weblogs just like this one and a whole bunch of other people chiming in with “just vote”, voter registration drives, “Rock the Vote” and any number of other initiatives trying to get people to the polls? Seems like people have noticed that people aren’t voting. The step they are missing is finding out why. But that’s the hard part. It’s so much easier to just assume they are lazy and indifferent because it means that you don’t have to admit there might be a problem.
Let’s assume, just for the sake of argument, that you are right and the vast majority of people who don’t vote simply “can’t be bothered”? Why aren’t they interested? Don’t just assume you know the answer to that question. Find out.
How anyone can see almost half the voters not voting and still say it’s not a problem with the system is beyond me. How anyone can see 100 million people saying “fuck it” as not a statement against the system is just sheer blindness. And how anyone can just blindly call those 100 million people indifferent without bothering to find out why they “can’t be bothered” is, well, lazy.
If you can’t be bothered to find out why they aren’t voting then I can’t be bothered to listen to your opinion about them.
@ Hairy Doctor Professor
“Anherst”
Excellent. My sister is a UMass-Amherst grad. Figured you had to be talking about that area…
No problem Rev., a belt or two of your favorite hooch and you’ll be fine.
I keep calling them “scantron” sheets because they’re just larger versions of what we used for testing in High School and College; of course we didn’t load our own scantron sheets into the scanner then.
Though I’ve been voting since 1980, I’ve never had the conventional experience of having actually “pulled a lever” to vote, although I have used the stylus and punch card ballot.
Anyone had “punch” ballots this election? Any hanging chads?
What aspect of voting or “the system” are people unhappy about?
Could we all please bow to tsg’s completely superior lack of laziness and move on? The American political machine is not going to change based on word count here, either, so let go of this overchewed bone and give everyone’s jaws a rest.
If you can’t change things within the system, then one has to create a new one and either destroy the current one or cease existing within the current one. For the former to be successful, a lot of the people who are not voting have to agree on a system (or even on the ends to which one might be put), which is a low-probability event, and which renders revolution destructive and likely to lead to something worse (because the people likely to take control of violence are likely to be those most willing and able to use violence, and not likely to be able to use other means effectively). Of course, with that many people, you could determine the outcomes of the current system, and change them (or require a lot more work to fix the outcome). Alternatively, people could drop out, but that would require lots of civil disobedience (people willing to go to jail not to pay taxes) or separation from the economic system (to avoid having money that can be taxed). I don’t really see a whole lot of evidence that either of these is happening, and little to think that either provide an effective route to change the system externally. Not paying taxes would force people to take notice, but it would require lots of people (more than 10%) to achieve anything other than expanding the penal system.
I haven’t seen evidence that any of these things are happening. In their absence, not voting doesn’t seem like a productive way to make my voice heard – it seems like a choice to silence myself, instead, and hope that my inaction will change things. Annoyance is imperfect, but that’s why kids scream when they can’t get their way – they do get heard, even if they don’t get what they want. If enough of them scream, their parents aren’t getting their ways, either.
No one’s forcing you to participate.
I mailed my absentee ballot back to NH last week. I love absentee ballots because they let me look up any candidates I don’t know about while I vote.
That one woman running for a county office who was listed as running against herself was strange.
All voting in NH is done paper-and-pencil, by the way.
That’s all I can really think of to say.
There. Done.
I’ve done my duty and cancelled out that rich guy who owns a 300-acre ranch with 20 horses and several other properties, who’s thrown his weight around dictating policy in our area for decades, inveigling his interests with area churches and other groups, gets his way thereby with his several area businesses, and who, right after the Republican National Convention, placed the biggest and most obnoxious McCain-Palin sign out in front of his main estate to be seen anywhere within a 50-mile radius, an eyesore wrecking the otherwise gorgeous rural scenery along that major road, legible from a quarter-mile in either direction…
Me, just a little guy of modest means, no political connections, no agenda, no religion, no allegiance to anybody or anything except the welfare of my country and the conviction that I can decide for myself what is best for the future of my country and its people, was able to do that. Just that. With a single vote. Canceled that one schmuck out. Evened the score, an end in itself. A singularly beautiful act of sacrifice.
And if that’s all my own vote represented, that is quite sufficient for me…and I feel mighty, mighty good.
@Hap #383
None of that addresses “just vote” as useless advice.
WOW! What a lot of inspiring posts! I get tired just reading about your waiting and lines. I’m with the rest of the Europeans it seems: Walk to ballot-point, vote, walk out, stay two minutes to inhale the wonderful air of democracy, go home with nice feeling of accomplishment. Time spent 6-10 minutes.
In Denmark we also have around 80% turn-out for our government-elections.
You have no idea have much we’re rooting for Obama on this side of the pond. This election is a VERY big deal to all of us.
That said, I have to go to bed now… getting close to midnight here. Can’t wait to yell YESSSSS at the top of my lungs when I wake up to hear Obama’s won.
I voted! I voted! I voted! On paper too! And not by some machine that could be rigged to disqualify my vote or “change” my vote. I am very, very happy! The wait was 15 minutes, the vote took me 37 minutes (I read every single line twice to make sure I am fully informed), made my choices, and I was out of there. Any candidate elected, I look at this as a historic moment. I feel GRRRRRREAT!
“No one’s forcing you to participate.”
Back at ya babe. Either by voting or here. But thanks for the brevity.
I really hope we have a landslide for Obama- the fundies will be beside themselves! ‘Course they would take that as evidence that they really are a persecuted minority.
pyrogirl@235: an early Cheers! to you and yours.
I voted a couple of weeks ago in Georgia’s early voting period. For Obama of course. Some pundits and commenters (see 538 dot com for one example) are saying that due to high youth and african-american turnout that Georgia may actually flip for Obama. That would be great, but I’m just happy to be on record regardless.
Of course, I also voted for Jim Martin, hoping for that 60-seat majority in the senate and also taking a shot at the odious Saxby Chambliss (only georgia can give you politicians with names like Saxby and Sonny… )
I can’t speak for everyone, but these are a few that I see:
* third party candidates have no chance
* it’s more a choice of “second worst” than “best”
* both major candidates take funding from corporations that, by their very nature, don’t spend money unless they are getting something in return.
* few people who get elected as a result of the current system are going to be motivated to change it.
This is by no means an exhaustive list, but a few of the major points.
I would have figured that it would be my priority to tell people why I’m not voting rather than someone else’s job to find out – it’s my money that the governments spend after all, and which (for the most part) I’m giving up without a word. (I’m again assuming that little to implement an external system or to overthrow the current one is being done – the former should be detectable by decreases in economic variables, and the latter should be kind of obvious.) It’s in my interest to tell people why I don’t vote, either to potentially change the situation or to make clear that there are enough people to change the system without its consent. It would also require some output on the part of people who don’t vote to even make it clear that the system is not legitimate without sufficient voter participation – that there are unaddressed issues. Again, all of these factors mean that people who don’t vote for reasons other than they don’t care have a vested interest in telling people why they don’t vote, and a disincentive to remain silent. It shouldn’t be necessary to dig for their opinion.
Just in from San Francisco: Voting was boring and routine. My voting place is a block from where I live and three from where I work, and I convinced the lab to go to lunch today across the street from the polling place. No line for me, but the two guys who came in right after had to wait a minute or two. I voted on everything: the presidency, a bunch of local and state offices, 12 state propositions, and 22 city propositions.
All hail President DRE700!
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=tSEOXRLSpVc
What do you think I’m doing?
Vic,
Not only that, but Arizona (ARIZONA!) is within the margin of error from the last poll.
I have so much frickin work to do tonight, I have no idea if I can get it all done and read the blogs and watch the returns, so the important stuff has to come first and my students will come second.
Just kidding. They’ll come third.
Whatever.
tsg,
My problem with the current third parties is that they are unworkable. I like some of the polices of the Greens, but Nader won’t work with local greens to get a presence in state races, without which they have no chance at having any pull anywhere.
The Libertarians are more corrupt at the party leadership level than the GOP, and the Constitution party is the most inappropriately named party ever, fighting with the GOP for the theocrat vote.
A real third party is viable in the US, but only with organization and a grassroots movement simultaneously.
If it helps at all, Vox Day has predicted a McCain win. Something about Democrats always being favored by about 5 points, plus seven points of hidden racism, overestimation of the youth vote, and poor polling techniques.
Of course, Vox was also predicting Hillary as the Democratic candidate as late as July (thinking Barack was going to pull some sort of dramatic “step-aside” maneuver), so his prognosticatory skills are probably better left to economics.
#383: A fractional chance to change an outcome (voting) is better than zero chance to change it (not voting). The only way that that doesn’t make sense is if the effort to vote takes enough away from my ability to influence the system by means other than voting to decrease what I can do overall, or if I believe the effect of my vote is exactly zero (in which case any effort is wasted). Neither of those situations seems to be operating.
Third parties would have a much better chance with a voting system that didn’t punish candidates for being too similar and voters for choosing other than from the two majors. Then you might see some reasonable people running and with better organization. If people could have a “second choice”, they wouldn’t be so afraid of voting for the person they thought was best for the job rather than for the lesser objectionable of the two that can win.
I voted on everything: the presidency, a bunch of local and state offices, 12 state propositions, and 22 city propositions.
What do you elected representatives actually do then ? There seems little point in having them if they just ask the electorate to vote in what seem to be referenda.
Is it illegal for an Australian to ask an American to vote, on behalf of aforementioned Aussie, for Barack Obama? True, I don’t have American citizenship, but can’t we please have someone with a brain in charge of the United States?
TIA, NewSkeptic.
Or if you believe that perpetuating a broken system by participating in it is more harmful than the benefit you get from participating in it.
1st exit polls, 5 PM EST
it’s the economy stupid.
Duh
Re my #406:
That should read “than the benefit you lose by not participating in it.”
“Not only that, but Arizona (ARIZONA!) is within the margin of error from the last poll.”
That would be so unbelievably awesome! If there were ONE thing I could wish out of this election, other than an Obama victory (and of course keeping that disgusting MoFo Dino Rossi out of the Governor’s Mansion) it would be that!
Could this be indicative of something wider, though? McGovern lost 59/41, but even HE carried South Dakota!
Bullcrap.
If you don’t have the organization, YOU MAKE IT. Or you co-opt it.
No excuses.
Did anyone else vote in the municipal liquor store? Paper ballots and an optical reader, like Jesus and the founding fathers intended. There were 8 poll workers and 1 voter when I voted. I was no. 275 at 3:00. Gotta love those small towns.
Today was my first voting experience. I walked with two of my friends to the polling place which was about a 15 to 20 minute walk. There have been thousands (I’m tempted to say millions) of Obama posters/stickers/signs all over campus, and not a single McCain poster. I actually received mail from Obama instructing me on exactly where I had to go to vote, what I had to bring, and what I had to do. Campaigners where handing out all sorts of nifty Obama gear for free all day. The Pennsylvania Democratic Party actually rented out buses that where shipping students to and from the polling places for free. I haven’t met a single person on my campus who is voting for John McCain, and how could you blame any of them after what I just explained? John McCain (and the Republican Party in general as well) doesn’t care enough about the common people or their opinion.
No, actually, he didn’t. He won Massachusetts and DC only. I remember it well; I was young (too young to vote) and idealistic and those results were just incredibly disillusioning. I’m sure that election was formative in establishing my misanthropy.
Hoping for better news this year!
Here in the UK the local councils, who run the actual elections tell you all that.
As for what you need to bring, well it is just yourself. If you take along the card they send you it helps them find you on their list a bit a quicker but if you forget it, it does not matter.
I am getting the distinct impression the US has problems with running elections. Not the political side, but the practical side. A number of people have talked of scanning machines and the like not working. What is wrong with paper and a pencil on a bit of string (so no one steals it!) ?
Here in Greater Seattle (King County) Washington the state, they are phasing-out live voting. Next year it will all be mail-in ballot.
Himself and I filled out our ballots last night late, around the kitchen table; we’d already looked through the voter’s pamphlet and made our decisions on most of the positions and other measures. On the last couple, we did some discussing and assessing. I think we probably voted the same on all but 1 or 2 places on the ballot…
Anyway, sealed ballots in hand, I drove down to the King County Election headquarters in Renton, to drop them off at the dropbox. This was about 11:20am. I had to wait in a line in the parking lot to pull up to the box and put our ballots in. There were armed sheriffs keeping an eye on the box, and the Elections staff were checking occasionally to make sure the box didn’t fill up too far.
The big issue on the ballot here is the governor’s race. Four years ago, Rossi and Gregoire were in a virtual tie after the initial tally–Rossi was the winner by about 200 votes. Then an arduous hand-recount began, and King County “found” a bunch of ballots they had somehow not located on election night (and several days thereafter). Eventually, Gregoire was declare the winner by a 133-vote margin…I think nobody was happy with the process, regardless of which candidate they supported. The County spent the last 4 years upgrading their procedures and moved into a new facility earlier this year (over the objections of the Citizen’s Advisory committee, which was concerned that the move and a Presidential/Gubernatorial race was too much to accomplish in the same election season).
No matter who wins, I just hope that there is a transparent and obviously valid process involved in the voting and vote-counting.
It is heartening to see so many people caring about this election! I always wave at sign-wavers, no matter who they are supporting, because I am so glad to see people involved in the process.
May you all have a relaxing and safe election night!
voted in my old elementary school with my mom and grandpa
first timer and i feel good doing it
Further to my #43 above, despite illness and almost passing out, made it through only a 2.5 hour wait and voted for Obama/Biden in SC. Everyone was nice and in a good mood, poll could have run better, but it was ok and the workers were very patient and helpful.
In 1972, my first presidential election, I voted for Shirley Chisholm. I think my vote finally registered today.
Bed time, chicken soup, rest with an easy heart.
Ciao y’all
Here in my polling place in Tulsa, OK, I voted anyway.
I thought about it long and hard: due to the stupidity of the electoral system, my vote won’t actually count for anything.
My idiotic fellow Oklahomians continue to vote for the guy who will _effectively_ raise their taxes, but fail to vote for the guy who’s policies would actually give them some relief. (according to the independent groups who watch over these things, Obama’s policies would be better for that idiot Joe the Plumber than McSame’s would be…..idiots)
But, I steeled myself, took along a good book and went to vote: 2 hours and 10 minutes later, I was done.
I’m very glad I did: I met several very nice people in line, and we all chatted about the forthcoming Change– each looking forward to it with different perspectives. One very gracious older lady was a former teacher of English and Journalism. We had a lively discussion about how that field has changed from actual reporting the facts, into in-the-field-editorializing. “Newsertainment”
Needless to say, I didn’t read much of my book after all….
…more than worth my time, to meet these people.
The useless vote casting was just icing on the cake.
I have to say, being a relative newcomer to Oregon, their voting system is very convenient. Fill out a form and turn it in whenever I please.
Also, this is very entertaining to see comments from all over the world as the election goes on. I hope I wont feel the terrible disappointment I did in 2004.
Feel better Jeffrey
@ Sven Di Milo;
I’m ashamed of misremembering that. That was my first election, and a traumatic experience for me, too. So where did I get that? Mondale took Minnesota, right?
* third party candidates have no chance
Anyone can still vote for them. That’s a reflection of people’s views surely?
* it’s more a choice of “second worst” than “best”
Isn’t that the case with every election?
* both major candidates take funding from corporations that, by their very nature, don’t spend money unless they are getting something in return.
* few people who get elected as a result of the current system are going to be motivated to change it.
If there is a demand for change on either of these then a candidate can run with that platform and deliver it.
That whooshing noise was the point sailing clear over your head.
Right. Mondale took only Minnesota and DC.
:( Get well soon, JeffreyD!
Sure, they can, but why would they?
Yes. My point exactly. You’re point would be…?
And none have. You’re point being what?
I voted on my way to class at about 7am. I think that the polling place had been open since 6am. The whole process lasted 10 minutes, and paper ballots were used. In contrast, my aunt waited an hour to vote. Afterward she went for coffee and discovered an even longer line: the local Starbucks was giving free coffee to voters. I do not think that she ever got her drink. Ha ha ha.
Bullcrap.
That first-past-the-post voting tends to result in two party systems is well confirmed by both experience and theory; look it up.
“Sure, they can, but why would they?”
Because they want that candidate to represent them as they like his ideas the most.
“Yes. My point exactly. You’re point would be…?”
That your dis-satisfaction with respect to this point applies to all democratic elections. Is there an alternate system you’d prefer?
“And none have. You’re point being what?”
The point here is that either my assertion that “if there is a demand for change on either of these then a candidate can run with that platform and deliver it” is wrong, or that there is no demand for change, at least on a level for it to be given a democratic mandate. Given that there is no demand for change your problem is not with the current system but with the voters.
Even if he can’t win and voting for him might risk the more objectionable of the two who can getting elected?
No, only first-past-the-post elections. I would prefer IRV or something similar that allows me to choose who I like best, not just second worst.
False dichotomy. The third option is that the current system favors people who support the current system. For example, campaign financing: anyone who does not take financing from corporations can’t get elected to change the campaign financing rules.
Heartily seconded!
I am such an emotional heap today! It is certainly not the most productive workday I’ve ever spent.
Growing up in pre-Civil Rights Alabama, I always thought the hate was so monolithically strong that there was no end to it, and I would never see this day in my lifetime (and I’m Caucasian; I’m not trying to pretend like I had it rough or anything myself, only that I was appalled by the hatred I saw other people face every single day of their lives).
Now this day is actually here, and I was a tiny part of it. It is moving beyond any words I have to describe it.
I’m holding it together for now, but we have a victory party at a friend’s house tonight, and once I get some of the JB [Jim Beam]* in me that Mr. thalarctos bought in the hopes of watching Mitch McConnell crash, I am so going to be one blubbering mess at the emotion of this day.
(I suggested Jack Daniels instead, because I like it, but Mr. thalarctos said he’d be damned if he was going to toast McConnell’s defeat with *Tennessee* whiskey.)
third party candidates have no chance
Anyone can still vote for them. That’s a reflection of people’s views surely?
Rational people maximize desirable outcomes. When voting, that includes considering the marginal power of their vote. If there are three candidates and, due to their wealth and access to power, two have nearly 50% chance of winning while the third has nearly no chance, it is rational to vote for the better of the two, even if the third perfectly reflects one’s interests. Or rather, it’s rational to do so in voting systems where you only have one vote even when there are more than two candidates. However, with systems like IRV, you can maximize your desirable outcomes by casting your first vote for the person who perfectly reflects you views and your second vote for the better of the other two.
tsg at #430:
Thanks for the link to instant-runoff voting. That was new information for me. I don’t have time just now to look over that entry in detail, unfortunately, but thanks again.
No kings,
Robert
There is a system, I can’t remember the name of it, but you cast votes for everybody that you support. It tends to do a good job of selecting officers for professional organizations. Don’t know how it would work in anything other than a primary.
Because they want that candidate to represent them as they like his ideas the most.
So you think a vote is a magic wand that turns someone into a representative? If you don’t, then your statement is a non-sequitur.
That your dis-satisfaction with respect to this point applies to all democratic elections.
It takes an act of will to remain this ignorant.
google “voting systems”.
There is a system, I can’t remember the name of it, but you cast votes for everybody that you support.
Approval voting.
Don’t know how it would work in anything other than a primary.
It works whenever there are more than two candidates. But other systems work better.
Actually, it also works for two or even one candidate — silly me. But then it’s no different from vanilla plurality voting.
One vote for Obama in North Dakota. Voting done in about 5 minutes, I live in a very small town.
I went to the local mega-church (this place even has a skate park and basketball courts!) to vote after work, no lines, in and out quickly. (Small towns are great!)
Since I had to go to church, I got out my “Religion Stops A Thinking Mind” t-shirt. But there was not a religious symbol in sight! HoooRay!!! Not like the Baptist church I had to vote at the previous 7 years. I did complain back then, but elected county official wrote back saying, “too bad, some people don’t like schools either, but they vote in them.” I kid you not.
I voted that person out the next year.
If Obama hadn’t made the remarks about expanding Bush’s faith based assault on the first ammendment, I could have voted for him, instead, it had to be Ralphie boy, the Schwinn Stik-Shift killer.
The Redhead and I got to the voting area in a nearby elementary school at about 3:45 pm CT. Very short line, and we were out at 4:05, and a good chunk of that was the Redhead talking to people. Two more votes for Obama.
Or if you believe that perpetuating a broken system by participating in it is more harmful than the benefit you [lose by not] participating in it.
False dichotomy; your participation isn’t what perpetuates it.
Continually electing candidates that have no interest in changing the system (in fact, have a vested interest in keeping it) doesn’t perpetuate it?
I can’t help but notice that there are a few people from King County WA on this thread. I have a problem: I’ve moved way to hell-and-gone into the South End (Burien), but for some unknown reason I’m not allowed to vote against that buttmunch Reichert.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m proud to have Jim McDermott still representing me, but could somebody who lives far enough south (the Peruvian border, apparently), please take one of those “Mickey Mouse” ballots we nefarious Democrats have corrupted the system with, show your picture ID identifying you as Mickey Mouse (you’ve got one right?) and get this pig out of the congress for me? Thanks a bunch!
If Obama hadn’t made the remarks about expanding Bush’s faith based assault on the first ammendment
A serious misunderstanding of his results. While Obama pandered to the religious community by characterizing it as expanding faith-based initiatives, he did not say he would expand Bush’s program. Rather, he quite explicitly said that he would eliminate bias toward faith-based orgs and would ban them from the religious discriminatory practices that are allowed (and intended) under Bush.
it had to be Ralphie boy, the Schwinn Stik-Shift killer.
Thereby increasing the chances of a win by McCain, who really would perpetuate Bush’s violations of the 1st amendment, not just via faith-based initiatives but by replacing Stevens, Souter, and Ginsberg with theocrats as bad as or worse than the current Catholic majority.
“his results” -> “his remarks”
Continually electing candidates that have no interest in changing the system (in fact, have a vested interest in keeping it) doesn’t perpetuate it?
What does changing one statement that I disagree with into a quite different statement perpetuate?
As for the latter statement, your participation in the voting process is not what causes candidates who have no interest in changing the system from being elected, so that too is a false dichotomy.
If you want to work toward a better system then do so; you can do that and continue to cast the most rational vote in the meantime.
there was a line of 2 people in front of me to vote in my neighborhood, which was not all that surprising. had to vote provisionally though, for some reason my name wasn’t on the list…
“from being” -> “to be”
It is precisely what I meant when I made the statement you were responding to.
If I am willing to cast my vote for someone who does not have any interest in making the changes I desire, what incentive does any candidate have in supporting those changes?
Casting my vote for someone I don’t think is qualified undermines my efforts to change it into one where I don’t have to.
I feel your pain, Lurkbot–wish we could help, but living on the Eastside and gerrymandered into sharing Jay Inslee with freakin’ POULSBO, we’re in no position to do so, even though our neighbors literally across the street can–go figure!
(not that I have anything against Inslee; I quite like him, but just look at the map–East King County + Poulsbo? srsly?)
It is precisely what I meant when I made the statement you were responding to.
Prima facie false.
If I am willing to cast my vote for someone who does not have any interest in making the changes I desire, what incentive does any candidate have in supporting those changes?
First, this is single-issue stupidity – there are other bases on which to make the decision between the candidates. Second, while neither is directly supportive, the candidates aren’t equal in re your issue. Third, the candidates don’t know you exist and your action is not an incentive either way.
Casting my vote for someone I don’t think is qualified undermines my efforts to change it into one where I don’t have to.
We weren’t discussing whether the candidates are qualified. But I get it – you’re a blinkered single-issue ideologue with a mind as impenetrable as his syntax. Good luck with that; I won’t waste more of my time.
First poll results from Indiana show that Obama 08 is outperforming Kerry 04 between 7% and 19% depending on the counties.
8% of votes counted and Obama is leading McCain 50% by 49%.
Now that’s already a very positive first sign !
You are going to have to make a better argument than “because I said so”.
I didn’t say it was the only issue.
They don’t have to be.
Then I fail to see why I should bother.
I was.
Fuck you.
Voting was quick and painless. Walked into the local HS gym, found my district (organized by day of garbage pick up for easy remembrance), verified my name verbally, signed the book and the voting slip. A nice lady escorted me to my electronic booth. I tapped my little green ‘X’s, hit the red “Record Vote” button (meanwhile yelling at my husband, who had just walked in, to quit talking about me to the registrar) and walked out. He then voted, and we were done in about 10 minutes. Don’t recall what number tickets we were, but there was quite a nice number of people around voting, and we live in a very small town. Go Obama!
Then I fail to see why I should bother.
Because you’re a cretin.
Comment by truth machine, OM blocked. [unkill][show comment]
Thanks for playing, buh bye.
All set and ready to go at 1130 am here,pot of chili brewing and a million beers in the fridge,BRING IT ON !
If Indiana is close and Virginia goes to Obama,the likelihood of an Obama victory is virtually 100%.
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/11/election-night-thread-600-pm.html
Wow, thalarctos, you’re right–that’s seriously messed up! I’m just bummed because my vote won’t make any difference to McDermott’s 90%+, but every vote counts in getting that swine Reichert out. Well, at least Gary Ridgeway can’t vote for him any more!
Lucky bastard, I knew I should have taken a sick day today. Instead I’m stuck at work for another 6 hours.
Kel,
there was no way I was going to go to work today….
I predict it will all be over in 2 hours max !
The VA numbers are a bit of a worry tho….
Well I had yesterday off, it was Family & Community day here in Canberra. So taking today off as well would be a bit much. So now I’m nervously following electoral maps online.
Florida looks very promissing !
10% of votes in.
Obama 57%
McCain 42%
That looks goooood.
Still WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY early in most states. All it takes is one big urban area that hasn’t reported in to swing the % a number of points in Obama’s direction.
BBC projects Obama wins Pennsylvania and New Hampshire!
NBC too.
Obama seems to be outperforming Kerry everywhere,while McCain is doing worse than Bush.
Good news.
I like it that CNN is not calling PA and NH yet and is waiting for numbers to come in.
CNN just showed an interesting analysis that in Indiana, Virignia, Florida, ona ll counties that have come in, McCain is consistently underperforming Bush in 2004 by 5 to 7% !
Now I guess the election is over then, isn’t it ?
Obama will be for sure the next President of the USA !
I’m not old enough to vote, but my high school held a mock election today. Obama won with 58%.
That’s really encouraging, because I live in Texas. Maybe one day, even the reddest of states will have rational voters instead of right wing wackos.
I’m following the election from the Netherlands. Watching CNN, MSNBC and Faux News at the same time…
I’m still a bit reserved, but CNN’s comparison between Kerry’s performance vs. Obama’s performance looks very promising.
BBC reports projection that Kay Hagan has beaten Dole.
What’s the best place to follow online? Currently using the NYTimes, is there something better?
Looks like Elizabeth Dole is cactus,gee this is fun !!
@375:
That comment was, I thought, a rather obvious allusion to a hilarious South Park episode which satirized the last presidential election:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douche_and_Turd
Based on the above and other insults, I should have thought more about where I’m posting, as humor and satire will obviously be lost on many people here.
CNN is pretty good. Isn’t calling states too early.
NBC is ok, but already calling states others aren’t
Fox is… well…. fox. They can’t stop talking about ACORN so there’s that.
Oh and CNN on TV has that cool touch screen thing that has every bit of info you could want. Ok not every, but it has a lot.
As long as you can deal with Wolf.
Kel at #472:
I’m switching back and forth between Google News and CNN.com. CNN’s got a nice interactive map – it’s not bad.
No kings,
Robert
I suspect PZ will start a live blog on the results once he gets done as election judge.
I wish you and us all good luck for the elections.
I can’t vote myself because I am German… but our countries, too, will have to deal with your future presidency and we’re anxiously waiting. We’re shaking our heads at McCain and Palin over here and wished we had a say in your elections as it will affect us all.
Do your part for us, please. VOTE.
I like “live blogging election night” at pollster.com,
plus switching between the networks in the background.
And beers.
Fun night.
Cheers from Barcelona.
Can’t wait to see Obama’s victory.
Vive l’Amérique !
Am I missing something or is there a reason Fox’s interactive map doesn’t show the electoral vote totals? I only ask since it’s, like, the only number that matters….
News: Obama is predicted to win Pennsylvania with 65% of the vote to 34% in spite of intense last-minute campaigning by John McCain.
fivethirtyeight.com projects 311 for Obama with an additional 64 posible from tossups FL, MO, IN, and NC.
Massive fail for the Republicans.
Yeah, I’m using Firefox and I can’t even see their map properly. A picture of Greta Van Susteren is over top of McCain’s number of votes. Good job Fox!
Comment by truth machine, OM blocked.
I’m crushed.
Fox el suck
How come VA is beating the trend?? Still 54% for McCain….
The counties around Norfolk and Washington DC haven’t reported in.
CNN just projected Hagen beating Dole in NC.
Well, according to CNN, I believe Kay Hagan just beat Dole.
The pundits already all know that there’s no way McCain can win, they just don’t want to pronounce the winner yet :
Comment by Brit Hume on Fox News just now :
“We used to think of the USA as a centre-right country. Does that mean that tonight we have to start thinking of the USA as as centre-left country ?”
Polls haven’t closed yet here.
Polls haven’t closed yet here.
And so …?
Be sure to vote, wherever you are … not only to maximize Obama’s popular vote total, but because downticket races are very important.
Depends on who’s definition of center, right and left.
Penn was McCain’s best hope.
It’s over kids.
Obama Obama Obama Obama
CNN just projected Hagen beating Dole in NC.
Although some people seem to be rather confused on this matter, this is a very good thing.
no doubt. Dole was an utterly ineffective leader and when she did try to lead it was lock step zombie walk bush brand conservatism.
Hagan winning is a great thing. Just think, 6 year ago Jesse Helms was in that seat.
It’s over kids.
It’s been over since the second debate — the poll numbers have been steady since then.
“We used to think of the USA as a centre-right country. Does that mean that tonight we have to start thinking of the USA as as centre-left country ?” – Brit Hume on Faux News
Er, no, Brit, now you can start thinking of the USA as a centre-right country!
(Excuse me if any subsequent comments are typo-rich – I’m now nicely lubricated with fermented grape-juice, lovingly prepared by a team of chyees-eating surrender-monkeys.)
Which states are Obama going to pick up?